Airborne423
Member
Any opinions on using the 148 Grain Wadcutter Bullet, for stopping power, in a Smith & Wesson Model 37 Airweight Revolver?
148 Gr. Wadcutter Bullet
- Thread starter Airborne423
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This!
They are swaged and soft, designed for target velocities 705 > 775ish!
I've heard of people shooting them "base out"! I tried it and had difficulty hitting a B27 at 7 yards! Yawn goes here!
Why not duplicate Hornady's XTP S/D load?
Smiles,
They are swaged and soft, designed for target velocities 705 > 775ish!
I've heard of people shooting them "base out"! I tried it and had difficulty hitting a B27 at 7 yards! Yawn goes here!
Why not duplicate Hornady's XTP S/D load?
Smiles,
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The DEWC can be driven as fast as the SWC bullets, but the HBWC cannot, and turning the HBWC backwards looks cool but doesn't help much, if at all.
Have you tried the 135gr Speer Short Barrel +P .38? That's what I carry mostly.
Have you tried the 135gr Speer Short Barrel +P .38? That's what I carry mostly.
If you attempt to hot rod the swaged hollow base wadcutter... you will blow the core out and leave the skirt. If you are lucky, you’ll leave it in the brass or chamber. If you leave it in the barrel, you could wreck your revolver with follow up shots.
jtcarm
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I carry plain ol Federal GMM WCs. Soft recoil, shoots to POA in most fixed-sight guns, cuts a nice .36 caliber hole in a straight line that goes as deeper than most +Ps.
As someone mentioned, if you want to go hotter, do not use a HB. Find a solid base with a nice sharp meplat.
Cast boolit guru Glenn Fryxell is of the opinion that the HB does noting for accuracy.
As someone mentioned, if you want to go hotter, do not use a HB. Find a solid base with a nice sharp meplat.
Cast boolit guru Glenn Fryxell is of the opinion that the HB does noting for accuracy.
Soft lead at higher velocities.......
... is very likely to lead the barrel. Doesn't matter if it's a semi, full or hollow based wadcutter. That's not so bad for a defense situation, but if you want to practice with them you are going to be digging the lead out. The newer 'Flying Ashtray' bullets with the big hollow point such as the Gold Dot and Federal HST pretty much emulate a reversed full wadcutter,but with controlled and consistent expansion as well as being jacketed to prevent leading at higher velocities.
FTXs are rated very highly, but I just like a bigger blowhole on my bullets.
... is very likely to lead the barrel. Doesn't matter if it's a semi, full or hollow based wadcutter. That's not so bad for a defense situation, but if you want to practice with them you are going to be digging the lead out. The newer 'Flying Ashtray' bullets with the big hollow point such as the Gold Dot and Federal HST pretty much emulate a reversed full wadcutter,but with controlled and consistent expansion as well as being jacketed to prevent leading at higher velocities.
FTXs are rated very highly, but I just like a bigger blowhole on my bullets.
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ContinentalOp
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Not my first choice, but I think it's a good one if low recoil is desired.
My first choice is Speer 135gr SB-GDHP +P (it's what I currently keep in my snubs), with FBI loads a close second (my favorite version is Buffalo Bore's standard pressure).
My favorite low-recoil load is Federal 125gr Nyclad, but that round is no longer in production. Winchester Defend 130gr JHP looks like a promising low-recoil option, but it can be very difficult to find. Whenever I've gone looking for it, I couldn't find it.
However, I've also been evaluating 148gr WC as a low-recoil option. So far, I like Fiocchi's version.
The 148gr WC has the potential to cut a full-caliber wound channel, so that's a positive. It seems to penetrate about 14-15" in the gel tests I've seen, so it also has adequate penetration while minimizing the risk of overpenetration. Probably the only solid bullet in a service caliber I've seen that doesn't overpenetrate.
Two caveats, though. One, they're not as easy to reload as a more rounded or tapered profile bullet. Carrying JHP with a rounded shape as reloads can be one solution.
Second, some of these loads may not stabliize well in a 2" barrel, so you should check whatever load you plan on using. If you get signs of keyholing in targets, you'll probably want to try with a different load.
Just my opinion.
If you haven't yet, you may want to search the Concealed Carry and Ammo forums as this has been discussed before.
My first choice is Speer 135gr SB-GDHP +P (it's what I currently keep in my snubs), with FBI loads a close second (my favorite version is Buffalo Bore's standard pressure).
My favorite low-recoil load is Federal 125gr Nyclad, but that round is no longer in production. Winchester Defend 130gr JHP looks like a promising low-recoil option, but it can be very difficult to find. Whenever I've gone looking for it, I couldn't find it.
However, I've also been evaluating 148gr WC as a low-recoil option. So far, I like Fiocchi's version.
The 148gr WC has the potential to cut a full-caliber wound channel, so that's a positive. It seems to penetrate about 14-15" in the gel tests I've seen, so it also has adequate penetration while minimizing the risk of overpenetration. Probably the only solid bullet in a service caliber I've seen that doesn't overpenetrate.
Two caveats, though. One, they're not as easy to reload as a more rounded or tapered profile bullet. Carrying JHP with a rounded shape as reloads can be one solution.
Second, some of these loads may not stabliize well in a 2" barrel, so you should check whatever load you plan on using. If you get signs of keyholing in targets, you'll probably want to try with a different load.
Just my opinion.
If you haven't yet, you may want to search the Concealed Carry and Ammo forums as this has been discussed before.
Considering the other bullets now available for personal defense, like the Federal HST and the Speer Gold Dot, and all the great research that has gone into their development, the wadcutter is worthless in my opinion.
During my former career, I went to a lot of autopsies. Wadcutters for practice? Sure. Wadcutters in the defense of my own life, or a loved one, nope.
During my former career, I went to a lot of autopsies. Wadcutters for practice? Sure. Wadcutters in the defense of my own life, or a loved one, nope.
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cmj8591
Member
3 grains of Bullseye behind the 148 grain HBWC is the go to accuracy load for the 38 special. It is about the last thing I would think of taking with me if I was going to get into a gun fight. There are so many better options available for a 38 personal defense load that I would not even bother considering it.
cowboy4evr
Member
I cast / shoot the 148 gr WC from a LEE mold in my airweight 642 Airweight . It shoots Point of Aim = Point of Impact . I use the traditional load , 2.7 grs of Bullseye powder . I have also shot them out of a 4" K-frame with great success . I hope this helps , Regards Paul
I am also curious about old school standard pressure wadcutters and FBI load especially for use in older revolvers where I prefer not to use +P ammo. Found some modern versions of both in the Underwood line and bought a few hundred of each. They have a special coating that you can read about on their website. They are supposed to come up to speed fast in short barrels. Supposed to prevent lead fouling. Have yet to try them, but the ammo appears to be impeccably made. Everything I’ve ever tried from Underwood was amazingly good...
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Up to now I preferred something a bit more peppy like the FBI Load or the BuffBore/Underwood LSWC-GC +P at a legit 1000fps from 2" bls.
But my wife likes the Federal Gold Medal Match wadcutter and it is hard to argue with the results: mild recoil and tight groups and a wife willing to shoot it.
I will undergo surgery on my dominant side shoulder so I will be toting lefty and shooting one hand + off hand with my snubby. Given one hand off hand reloads are likely going to happen in time frames that can be timed with a calendar, I think I will drop down and use some of my wife's Fed GMM stash and make it easier to get good hits COM.
Coating is just the polymer/plastic coating that has become common in handloading circles. I hear good things and have some of it from several makers to try out soon.
I shot both BB & the older UW that used a standard hard cast wadcutter. Both good accurate & consistent loads, both recoil like Rem/Win/Fed FBI loads.
If it is from BB or UW, it is going to be good...but I avoid the screwey Lehigh projectile loads from UW.
I carry standard pressure 148gr DEWCs in my J-Frames, +P HP for reloads. WCs are slow to load.
OP
Airborne423
Member
I thank you all for your personal information.
R.F.
R.F.
A wadcutter that won't lead at top 38 SPC velocities is Penn Bullets 148 gr. I loaded a tray full with 4.0 gr 231 and they shot very accurately out of my 2.75" K frame.
Gel tests of wadcutters on Youtube showed they basically punch caliber diameter holes, very deeply. Gives me pause to consider whether WCs are any better than a RN. A hole is a hole.
Gel tests of wadcutters on Youtube showed they basically punch caliber diameter holes, very deeply. Gives me pause to consider whether WCs are any better than a RN. A hole is a hole.
StrawHat
Member
When I was inLE I had the pleasure of knowing about 1/2 dozen coroners. Of the ones that carried, one carried a 1911 and the rest 38 S&W Specials with wadcutter ammunition. All chose what they carried based on their observations in the autopsy rooms.
Ed Harris wrote this about full power wadcutter loads.
Ed Harris: Revisiting The Full Charge Wadcutter. - [url]www.GrantCunningham.com www.GrantCunningham.com[/url]
He recommends 3.2 grains of Bullseye, and a cast DEWC. When I carried a 38, that was the load I used.
If a speed loader full of wadcutter ammunition is problematic for you, consider using something else for your second cylinder. Or practice. I found that reloading a K frame with wadcutter ammunition was easier than the same ammunition in a J frame.
Kevin
Ed Harris wrote this about full power wadcutter loads.
Ed Harris: Revisiting The Full Charge Wadcutter. - [url]www.GrantCunningham.com www.GrantCunningham.com[/url]
He recommends 3.2 grains of Bullseye, and a cast DEWC. When I carried a 38, that was the load I used.
If a speed loader full of wadcutter ammunition is problematic for you, consider using something else for your second cylinder. Or practice. I found that reloading a K frame with wadcutter ammunition was easier than the same ammunition in a J frame.
Kevin
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I / We, sometimes carry them. Below I have posted some research from the "LG-folks", because their expert opinions are more well based than my own $0.02-worth. The accuracy of this load is legend. I reload a lot of these rounds in front of Universal at start velocities.
--Barrier Blind
--Excellent Penetration
--Inside the 12"-18" FBI guide lines
--Has been very accurate from my 637 and 64
--Low recoil
--Low muzzle flash
Cheap 38 Special Ammo For Sale - 148 Grain Super Match Wad Cutter Ammunition in Stock by Winchester Super-X - 50 Rounds
--Barrier Blind
--Excellent Penetration
--Inside the 12"-18" FBI guide lines
--Has been very accurate from my 637 and 64
--Low recoil
--Low muzzle flash
Cheap 38 Special Ammo For Sale - 148 Grain Super Match Wad Cutter Ammunition in Stock by Winchester Super-X - 50 Rounds
max503
Member
I reload the Lee DEWC to all power levels. It is very accurate in all my guns. I think a stout wad cutter load out of an Airweight 38 would be a good defensive tool.
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