15-22 Accuracy

[donsvideo]

CCI Standard Velocity lead round nose 40 grain 1070fps , 3x9 scope, 50 Yards, bench rest, I think I could do better with a better rest, any opinions on how to get a tighter group

 

[Beuford T. Rimfire]

...use a different rifle.

But a trigger job or other aftermarket trigger might be a good starting point. Remove the hand guard end cap and check the barrel nut to see if it might be a bit loose, maybe.

I'd conceder those groups pretty descent for 50yds from a 15-22 based on what I've seen others shoot. You'll never put all three shots through the same hole with this rifle.

 

[Aceman58]

As stated above, lighter trigger, and maybe using match grade 22LRs. I've had good luck with CCI Tactical. They run a little lighter on the powder, 1200 instead of 1235 on the standard CCI Blazers.

Remember, the M&P is a combat rifle (although 22LR), it was designed as a tactical 22LR or combat AR and these are not known to be bullseye type weapons. Now you can make them out to be, but you are better suited to get a bolt action 22LR if accuracy is your prime goal. But that is just my opinion.. Good Luck.

 

[Dragon88]

any opinions on how to get a tighter group

Shoot better.

Remember, the M&P is a combat rifle (although 22LR), it was designed as a tactical 22LR or combat AR

The 15-22 is a combat rifle? Which country is using it for military service?

 

[Aceman58]

Dragon88, the 15-22 was never used as a military weapon, my comment was the basic design is of combat design (a copy of the AR15), so performance will be the same, combat style accurarcy. Is all I'm saying... I knew someone was going to do this..

 

[Kayback]

Shoot better.




The 15-22 is a combat rifle? Which country is using it for military service?

Fairly certain he meant as opposed to a benchrest target rifle.

KBK

 

[Majorlk]

Combat STYLE!

 

[dan01]

Whatever!...............My 15 22 shoots as well as my 10/22....

My 5.56 Bushmaster or my 7.62x39 47s would not produce 1 or 2 inch groups at any range.......

 

[Plumbago]

Your targets with generaly two "fliers" on each indicates to me two things, trigger pull and or change your ammo or both....A trigger job but better yet a replacement trigger will do wonders, especially if you can get it down to the neighborhood of 1.5 lbs....Putting a stiffiner on the upper might also help.....by this I mean put a 1/2" 6" long riser block on the upper with half (3")on each side of the upper/barrel/handguard joint..... best regards Plum

 

[copper06]

I've seen a number of the guys free-floating the barrel as well. Something about pressure on the muzzle end of the rifle due to the hand guard. I'm sure someone else can post a better description/solution if it is even a problem.

There are also better bench rests that actually clamp your gun down and all where all you do is pull the trigger, taking the human pretty much out of the equation as much as possible.

Ammo. type as others have stated as well will play a pretty big part. Some 15-22's like certain ammo better than others, no idea why, it just is. Luckily 22 ammo is cheap enough where you can buy a couple hundred rounds of various types and test for accuracy as well as functionality.

 

[omster]

Shot this group yesterday off bench/bi-pod...
This is CCI Tactical, 10 rounds @ 50 yards... only mod to the rifle was the JP springs on the trigger

 

[jsimmons]

0) Remove the hand guard end cap. At that point, the hand guard is not having an impact on consistency.

1) Thread the end of the barrel, and add a heavy-ish flash hider (or muzzle break). It will reduce vibration at the muzzle, thereby enhancing consistency.

2) Before shooting for groups, fire at least one round for every inch of barrel length. This will season the barrel to the ammo being used.

3) You didn't mention what brand/model scope or mounts that you're using. I recommend a Burris PEPR mount, and a scope from a reputable manufacturer, at least a Nikon or a Mueller. Cheap mounts and/or scopes will not provide the most consistent performance from ANY rifle.

4) A calm day (little/no wind).

5) Match-grade ammo. They call it match grade because it's got consistent loads and better lubricant.

6) Make your trigger lighter, and it will break more consistently.

7) Work on your hold, even if you're using a rest. A consistent hold is a key component to good groups.

8) Work on your breathing and timing. Learn how to breathe, and when to shoot during the exhale cycle. DO NOT HOLD YOUR BREATH.

I don't know if you've noticed, but grouping is all about consistency. Consistency is more about equipment and ammo than it is the shooter.

As far as accuracy is concerned, improve your mindset and you technique.

0) Drink lots of water at the range. When your thirsty, your eyesight degrades.

1) Clear your mind of EVERYTHING else.

2) Concentrate.

 

[jsimmons]

I've seen a number of the guys free-floating the barrel as well. Something about pressure on the muzzle end of the rifle due to the hand guard. I'm sure someone else can post a better description/solution if it is even a problem.

The idea is that the further down the barrel that your hand guard is somehow attached to said barrel, the more likely it is that any weight or pressure applied to the hand guard will deflect the barrel. This is also why I prefer sights attached to the barrel instead of a floating hand guard. When you grab a hand guard, it deflects, and a guard-mounted sight will deflect with it, thus resulting a poorly aimed shot.

There are also better bench rests that actually clamp your gun down and all where all you do is pull the trigger, taking the human pretty much out of the equation as much as possible.

Which does nothing to improve the shooter's technique or familiarity with the weapon system.

Ammo. type as others have stated as well will play a pretty big part. Some 15-22's like certain ammo better than others, no idea why, it just is. Luckily 22 ammo is cheap enough where you can buy a couple hundred rounds of various types and test for accuracy as well as functionality.

All .22's are like this (pistols and rifles both). The reason is that variances in metallurgy of the barrels, the configuration of the chamber, the rifling, and the muzzle crown, as well as the lubricant used on the cartridges all come into play. That's why competitive shooters never come to a match with a clean barrel. A competitive .22 firearm needs to be seasoned to the ammo being used, and most likely, that "seasoning" was performed before the shooter arrived at the match.

 

[jsimmons]

Dragon88, the 15-22 was never used as a military weapon, my comment was the basic design is of combat design (a copy of the AR15), so performance will be the same, combat style accurarcy. Is all I'm saying... I knew someone was going to do this..

I've seen guys with AR-15s make 10-ring 1000-yard shots. Not bad for a weapon system rated for just 600 yards.

There's no reason the 15-22 can't be dead-nuts accurate to 250 yards. If it wasn't for the dodgy magazine (takes way too long to load well), the 15-22 could be a viable combat weapon (if push came to shove).

A .22 will kill just as surely as a 5.56.

 

[jsimmons]

...use a different rifle.

My Henry shoots better than that - without a scope.

I'd consider those groups pretty descent for 50yds from a 15-22 based on what I've seen others shoot. You'll never put all three shots through the same hole with this rifle.

At 50 yards, with a quality 3-9 scope, some mods to his rifle, decent (match-grade) ammo, and proper technique, he should be able to make quarter-size groups with a M&P15-22.

 

[photoracer]

CCI Standard Velocity lead round nose 40 grain 1070fps , 3x9 scope, 50 Yards, bench rest, I think I could do better with a better rest, any opinions on how to get a tighter group

AR15-22 Performance Center model, Caldwell LeadSled BR, Eley Match ammo.
But a decent Ruger 10/22 or Rem 597 with barrel and trigger changes and the same rest and ammo should put all of them into the 9 ring at the worst at 50 yards. My 597 w/VQ CF barrel and Jard 1.5# trigger in the VTR tactical stock can do one raged hole at 50 yards easily. A CZ bolt gun could do even better.
But an AR15-22 is much more fun to shoot.

 

[jsimmons]

AR15-22 Performance Center model, Caldwell LeadSled BR, Eley Match ammo.
But a decent Ruger 10/22 or Rem 597 with barrel and trigger changes and the same rest and ammo should put all of them into the 9 ring at the worst at 50 yards. My 597 w/VQ CF barrel and Jard 1.5# trigger in the VTR tactical stock can do one raged hole at 50 yards easily. A CZ bolt gun could do even better.
But an AR15-22 is much more fun to shoot.

My CZ 452 does dime-sized groups at 50 yards with the right ammo.

 

[Titegroups]

The 15-22 was designed to make S&W money not tight groups. Like a good looking woman, got your money.

 

[dan01]

I haven't done paper yet, but I can hit 3'' clays at 100 yards with every shot......I have a verticle grip and a bipod on the hand guard and it dosen't "bend" the barrel....(MOE with a 3-9x42R NcStar scope)

 

[jsimmons]

I haven't done paper yet, but I can hit 3'' clays at 100 yards with every shot......I have a verticle grip and a bipod on the hand guard and it dosen't "bend" the barrel....(MOE with a 3-9x42R NcStar scope)

Anyone can do that from a rest (or a bipod). Can you do it offhand? If so, you should get the right (legal) rifle and start shooting in silhouette competitions (and the targets are two times the size of a 3-inch pigeon). I'd pay to see someone shoot a perfect score of 40/40 - in three years of competition, I've never seen a perfect score. My best scores are 28/40 with a Henry lever action (iron sights), and 33/40 with a CZ-452/optics(non-bdc).

I had to stop competing because of foot problems and the lack of available practice ranges - most of the local ranges around here stopped allowing offhand shooting because retards were intentionally shooting over the berms.

 

[Majorlk]

Anyone can do that from a rest (or a bipod). Can you do it offhand?

Just a little nasty there, wouldn't you say?

If so, you should get the right (legal) rifle and start shooting in silhouette competitions (and the targets are two times the size of a 3-inch pigeon). I'd pay to see someone shoot a perfect score of 40/40 - in three years of competition, I've never seen a perfect score. My best scores are 28/40 with a Henry lever action (iron sights), and 33/40 with a CZ-452/optics(non-bdc).

If I can find my score books from the mid-late 80s, I'll show you several 20/20 strings from a Ruger 77/22 and a Bushnell 6-18 AO scope with a 1-minute dot in NRA Rimfire Silhouette. It's not that much of a big deal! We used to have three or four in any given match and we'd have to do a sudden death to get the day's winner. I'm not sure what you are shooting that has a 40 shot string.

If you want REAL silhouette competition, do NRA silhouette with a centerfire pistol. I have some 20/20s with my TC in .30 Carbine and a 6x32 scope.

 

[w0ady]

i hit the paper 25/25 times at my 15 yd range.

 

[Majorlk]

i hit the paper 25/25 times at my 15 yd range.

My kind of shooter!

 

[dan01]

w0ady.....When I got done rezeroing the scope on my 15 22 I popped off a few shots at 15 yards with my Astra A 70 9mm and managed to hit the paper too.

 

[w0ady]

wow dan, thats 1 weird looking range you go to!

 

[rraisley]

wow dan, thats 1 weird looking range you go to!

Don't know why you say that. It has the traditional reed basket to catch the bullets, and Old Spice to freshen up after using Hoppes #9.

 

[DelFuego]

Geez, and I thought that my 18" groupings at 100 yards was good.

Sent from my Kindle Fire

 

[jsimmons]

Just a little nasty there, wouldn't you say?

Not at all. Anyone can do that at 50 yards - or even 100 - from a rest. Offhand is much harder, even at just 25 yards.

If I can find my score books from the mid-late 80s, I'll show you several 20/20 strings from a Ruger 77/22 and a Bushnell 6-18 AO scope with a 1-minute dot in NRA Rimfire Silhouette. It's not that much of a big deal! We used to have three or four in any given match and we'd have to do a sudden death to get the day's winner. I'm not sure what you are shooting that has a 40 shot string.

If you want REAL silhouette competition, do NRA silhouette with a centerfire pistol. I have some 20/20s with my TC in .30 Carbine and a 6x32 scope.

We shot 40-round strings. 10 shots at 25, 50, 75 and 100 yards.

 

[Prof_Fate]

The 15-22 is capable of 1" groups at 100 yards. Are YOU capable is the question.

You need to try all the ammo you can find to see what your particular rifle likes. Mine like CCI stingers (rn) best of what I've had available to try. I hear great things about their tactical 22 but it's not easily available near me. My 11 year old son does 1" groups prone, no sling, no bipod, no problem. (sweet 22 3-9 scope at 6x, most allowed in rimfire sporter matches). He's been shooting 4 months.

Off a bench, handheld on sandbag, I can do ragged 3 shot holes at 50 yards - BUT the pressure of the bench moves the barrel and POI up by 3-4". I plan to add the picatinny risers and remove the handguard end ring and see how it improves. I;ve got the JP springs to install too.

My old glenfield bolt 22 with the same ammo groups a bit less tightly but hits 3" high. It prefers winchester and with that ammo the 15-22 groups high...odd, but true.

The mossberg tactical sucks in every way - won't hold zero, 2" groups at 50yrd on a good day, feed issue, picky on ammo, stovepipes.

 

[Majorlk]

We shot 40-round strings. 10 shots at 25, 50, 75 and 100 yards.

What are the targets? NRA Silhouette uses 1/2 size steel chickens at 25 meters, pigs at 50, turkeys at 75 and rams at 100 - five targets at each range. The targets have to be knocked off the stands, not just hit.