.30 M1 Carbine ammo remanufacture?

[Wee Hooker]

When I bought my M1 Carbine some years back, it came with 11 box's/550 rounds of PMC "Target" ammo. The problem is that this ammo shoots 7" R and 7" low @ 100 yds as compared to milspec/CMP issue ammo. The windage is easy enough to dial in but elevation changes on these rifles are done by filing the front sight. ( Read: not happening!)
So I'm wondering if it's feasible to pull the bullets on the 400 or so rounds I have left and rebuild the rounds using a different powder /load?


BTW, My first thought was to sell the PMC ammo off and buy milspec but .30 carbine ammo and brass is getting hard to find and priced like gold when you do. I also know the pulling/rebuild process will be slow but I have all winter.

Thoughts (or favorite loads) appreciated.

 

[mkk41]

Odd , PMC ammo is usually pretty good. I've shot lots of their brown box GI-type ammo. I do believe they make the majority of S.Koreas military ammo and they usually make good stuff in US military calibers , as they received tons of our weapons. I do believe that H-110 aka W-296 is THE powder for .30 carbine.

 

[shaggist]

M-1 Carbine Reloading

Although I shoot nothing but US military ball ammo in my carbine, you might want to consider these loadings, which duplicate the military loading, which was an 110 gr. bullet at about 1970 fps, from the following sources:

Guns and Ammo Mini-Manual - 'The M-1 Carbine'.
110-gr. bullet, 13-grs. of Hercules 2400(DO NOT exceed 14 grains!). Start at 11 grs and work up until it suits you and your gun.

American Rifleman Reprint compilation - 'U.S. Cal. 30 Carbine'- 3rd edition.
110-gr bullet, 13.5 grs-Dupont 4227, 39,240 cup, 1805 fps.

110-gr bullet, 15.0 grs-Win 296, 36,000 cup, 1980 fps.

110-gr bullet, 13.8 grs-Hod 110, <40,000 cup, 1900 fps.

The original military loading used Dupont 4227 powder, which was then changed to a special Western Ball powder, which isn't commercially available. Winchester 296 is probably very close.

As with all reloading, when developing a 'new' load for your gun, start below the recommended powder charge and work up, watching for excessive pressure signs the whole way. I have given you publically published loads for the M-1 Carbine and accept no responsibility for any consequences that may occur.

Enjoy your carbine, as it is a fun little gun to shoot.

 

[Faulkner]

I've loaded a couple of thousand rounds of .30 carbine with 110 grain FMJ's and 14 grains of H110. Plenty accurate and a clean load.

By the way, I've fired a good many rounds of PMC's and never noticed a problem.

 

[jag312]

So I'm wondering if it's feasible to pull the bullets on the 400 or so rounds I have left and rebuild the rounds using a different powder/load?

About 15 years ago I was given 1000 rounds of real crap .223 cartridges made in the Philippines. My son and I pulled every bullet, dumped the powder, and reloaded all 1000 cartridges. We used AA2015 powder if I remember correctly. So yes, it is both feasible and doable.

 

[Hook686]

I reload for my .30 M1 Carbine using 13.3 grains of Alliant 2400, which gives me about 1990 fps with a 110 grain JSP bullet.

To answer your question, "So I'm wondering if it's feasible to pull the bullets on the 400 or so rounds I have left and rebuild the rounds using a different powder /load?
"

Yes, I wopuld think it feasibile. Maybe not exciting, but certainly feasible.

 

[Jellybean]

If I was just going to shoot them into a hill side I'd try to adjust the sights first. Change the rear for windage as you mentioned, then find how far down the front sight you need to adjust for elevation and paint a white line on it. After you're done with the 400 rounds remove the paint.

But that's just me because I was born lazy.

 

[Rule3]

Well they have "Kentucky Windage" why not Kentucky Elevation?

I load for a 30 carbine also, I wish mine had the adjustable rear sight for both elevation and windage.

Sounds like a lot of work for little gain. I would just aim high if it's just plinking and target use.

 

[Wee Hooker]

Thanks for the info and advice, I'll likely give the reloading a shot since my intent is to eventually reload all my carbine ammo once this is gone anyway. That said, about the only time I shoot the gun is during competitions. Kentucky windage is why I took 2nd vs 1st in the last match. Figure I'll fix this right over the winter.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

My M1 carbines (Winchester, Inland, and NPM) all handle ammunition differently. A load that functions well and shoots accurately in one will cause problems in another.

Fun little guns, but finicky as can be.

 

[Spotteddog]

What LGL said in spades!
A load that yours really doesn't like won't be cured by a ballistician, only an exorcism. I have a Winchester 43' that prefers the 100 grain Plinkers to the 110 G.I.? It's so picky, that the change can make the group size @ 100 double sometimes!
(Ever thought of installing the later arsenal refit rear adjustable for W/E? Just save the original to put it back to OEM.)

 

[Wee Hooker]

To be clear, I'm 90% certain it's the ammo/loading vs this specific rifle. I actually got this ammo with my first M1 Carbine ( Inland, Early version, non-adjustable sight). it shot low and right in that gun . I figured it was the gun and got frustrated with my limited sight adjustments, So when I got a chance to trade up to a latter version ( Winchester, adjustable sights, baynet lug, better wood, etc) I went for it. I've since realized that this ammo shot in the same place with the second gun. Once I got a chance to run some milspec ammo in the Winni, it was confirmed that it was not the gun(s) .
Just ordered some carbide dies, it will make an interesting winter project.

 

[BUFF]

Your .30 Carbine ammo may have a sealant around the inside of the case mouth to keep moisture out. That will make pulling the bullet a lot harder to do.

When I pull military bullets that have sealant, I first set up my seating and crimping die. I don't crimp at all but have the seating stem wound down at least 1 full turn more than it would have needed to be to seat that bullet where it is. Then, running the loaded cartridge into the die, the bullet gets pushed down a minute amount and the seal, often asphault-based, is broken and then removing the bullet will be far simpler.

I would use a bullet collet set to remove the bullets. I use the RCBS set. Minimal bullet deformation and fairly fast.

 

[Spotteddog]

Absolutely use Buff's idea if it's sealed!
Great one Buff!

 

[Wee Hooker]

Yep. Picked up some W296 today then started pulling bullets to find they are sealed :-(. I'm breaking the seal as described but my kinetic puller is failing me. The rounds are slipping right out of the Colet of the first wack or two. Probably worn bit as it's an old/well used puller. Looks like I need another puller/new colets. Project is on hold a few more days.

 

[R-Tex]

...I would use a bullet collet set to remove the bullets. I use the RCBS set. Minimal bullet deformation and fairly fast.

+1! That RCBS set is one of the better reloading tool purchases I've made. The only time I use my kinetic puller any more is if I have just one or two bullets to pull.

 

[Wee Hooker]

Thanks I did order a (Hornady) collet type puller. With 400+ sealed rounds to do, the kenetic puller was going to be a No-Go.

 

[Wee Hooker]

Update

Well, I'm into the project both feet now. I have to say, it's more work and less productive than I had planned. The good news is that a Hornady Colet puller works sweet and doesn't require the previously mentioned "nudge" to unseal the bullet. Time and a step saved. Bullet pulling goes fast. The bad news is that the pulled bullets are covered with sealer/tar and must be cleaned with mineral spirits (MS). The inside of the case is also a mess with sealer and caked on powder. Each case must be scraped out carefully to get ALL the old powder out then wiped out with a MS wetted q-tip to take the ridge of sealer out. A real PITA but critical step to assure that the case is clean of residual powder. ( THE old powder bridges too so it's not uncommon to "poke out" a 1/4 case worth durin this step. Time Lost and steps added.
So after a few nights of messing around I "remanufactured" about 50 of the PMC rounds using W296 powder @ 14.5 and 14.75gr for testing. ( MAx spec being 15gr) OAL was kept to about 1.667+/- 10 with just enough crimp to securely hole the OAL. ( Seater die seems a little rough. I need to polish it to get better consistancy.)
So drum role please............Went to the range today with the two flavors of test rounds and the factory PMC to use as the bench mark. Well, after all that effort the W296 reloads actually shot 2-3" LOWER than the already low PMC. ( The 14.75 actually seemed to group better though.) So after $35 in dies, $30 for a collet puller and $40 in powder, I broke out the file and
"adjusted" the front sight to where it will shoot the PMC factory or the reloads into the bull with a target hold. ( 0.006 off for every 1" I wanted to raise the group per the CMP sight.) FWIW, I don't regret buying any of the tooling and powder as I will now set off and relaod the 300 or so once fired cases I have laying around vs mess with pulling any more of the PMC apart.
Just figured I'd pass my experience along.

 

[steve hammer]

M1 carbine what bullets

I just bought an M carbine and will soon be reloading. What bullets are best for self defense use? I am assuming a 110 gr. soft or hollow point?

 

[Wee Hooker]

Best to stick with 110 gr soft points. The hollow points are known to have feeding issues in some carbines.