Widows Sons
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.38 M&P (Model of 1905 - Fourth Change) date of manufacture
- Thread starter Widows Sons
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Texas Star
US Veteran
Show other side, and a sharper set of photos. Help will probably arrive.
I forgot if the serial no. was in the OP. If not, it'll be needed.
Looks to be in nice condition. Someone suitable will want it, if the family's selling.
I forgot if the serial no. was in the OP. If not, it'll be needed.
Looks to be in nice condition. Someone suitable will want it, if the family's selling.
DocB
Member
That's a high number for a round butt with plastic/rubber grips. I'm thinking around WWI and maybe as late as 1921. I never see a RB around here. I think they are pretty uncommon. The experts will be along to tell you more and better information that I can provide.
I have a square butt 1905 4th change 38 Special from mid? 1919, #315083. Heat treatment of cylinder started at #316648 in September 1919. I learned this here. If you shoot it, use standard pressure rounds. AE38B shoots fine in it.. Mine is just a shooter, but my father was born Sept. 6, 1919. Will always be a keeper for me.
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Absalom
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
It's not exactly uncommon or rare, but you don't see them nearly as often as the square butt. They must not have been as popular; they certainly were just as available. I have several catalog reprints from major retailers of the 19-teens (this one shipped most likely 1917 or 1918) and they all offered both the round-butt or Model 1902 and the square-butt or Model 1905; the 1902/1905 terminology disappeared after 1918 in favor of just Military & Police. For the round butt, the black hard rubber as on the OP's gun was standard.
ParadiseRoad
Member
...my Dad was born July 4, 1919...I have a Colt Police Positive Special made in 1919...the date was a big part of why I bought that one...
OP
Widows Sons
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DWalt
Member
Re SN 28084x: The closest I have on my list is SN 2805xx which shipped in 8/1917. Also there are several other SNs nearby which also shipped in 1917. It is correctly called a .38 Special Military and Police Model, round butt. A few years earlier, S&W would have called it the Model of 1902, owing to the rounded butt shape. Model 1905s have square butts.
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Wait a minute. Are you posting pictures of two different revolvers?
The picture in Post #1 shows a round butt gun with correct black hard rubber stocks. In Post #9, you show what appears to be a square butt revolver with walnut stocks, of the type used from 1911 until early 1920. The serial number is blurry in the first photo of Post #9 but it appears to be the one you mentioned in your first post. I'm not sure what to make of this.
OP
Widows Sons
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I just discovered that I posted a photo of a different 38 with a round butt. That is incorrect.
The CORRECT photo should be of a 38 S&W MP with a square butt and wooden grips. I'm trying to learn how to correct the mistake.
Thanks for the heads up.
The SN in the original post is correct and the three photos added today are correct.
The CORRECT photo should be of a 38 S&W MP with a square butt and wooden grips. I'm trying to learn how to correct the mistake.
Thanks for the heads up.
The SN in the original post is correct and the three photos added today are correct.
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Widows Sons
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The photo in the original post was incorrect. The CORRECT photo should illustrate a blue 38 S&W M&P with wooden grips with a gold medallion on a square butt pistol.
Thanks for the heads up.
Mea Culpa.
Thanks for the heads up.
Mea Culpa.
Texas Star
US Veteran
I think S&W was still using those rubber round butt grips as late as 1938, on at least some rnd. butt guns, maybe even after WWII, if supplies remained. ??
But other rnd. butt guns had wooden stocks. Were they an extra cost item? Why? Sq. butt guns had wood.
But other rnd. butt guns had wooden stocks. Were they an extra cost item? Why? Sq. butt guns had wood.
Yes. They were still using the black hard rubber stocks after the war. Several round butt 2" S prefix guns that I've seen were shipped with them. I believe I have also seen some C prefix round butt 2" guns that got the rubber stocks.
Apparently walnut was also available. I have a few pairs in my collection, including these, which are later than the gun but came to me on it. They are made of Circassian walnut (also called English walnut).
I don't know if they were an extra-cost option. I suspect they might have been. Black hard rubber seems to have been standard. The letter on the .32 Winchester revolver shown above says that is what was on it when it left the factory.
Texas Star
US Veteran
Jack-
Thanks!
By "wood", I meant walnut, of course.
Your stocks here seem much less used than the gun. I guess they're replacements for the same type of stocks with which it shipped? Boy, those are nice!
"Circassia" in in Turkey, isn't it? So, literal Circassian walnut is Turkish. But the same tree is grown elsewhere, in France, England, etc. Going from info in Jack O'Connor's articles on custom rifle stocks...
Thanks!
By "wood", I meant walnut, of course.
Your stocks here seem much less used than the gun. I guess they're replacements for the same type of stocks with which it shipped? Boy, those are nice!
"Circassia" in in Turkey, isn't it? So, literal Circassian walnut is Turkish. But the same tree is grown elsewhere, in France, England, etc. Going from info in Jack O'Connor's articles on custom rifle stocks...
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Yes. I assume the English imported it and that is why it is commonly called "English" walnut. I prefer to call it Circassian walnut myself.
