41 Failure to feed

[Drm50]

Finally got a 5” field barrel. Took it out to try out and was having failure to feed issues. I’ve never run into this before with 41. The magazine is not the problem. The donor pistol is a 73/8” I bought month ago for this purpose. I shot 50rds of Rem Govt Std-Vel without issue, with 73/8” barrel.
Question: inspection of 5” barrel shows nothing out of ordinary.
Could the problem be recoil spring? That seems to be the only reasonable cause.
I’ve never had any trouble with 41s, must be my turn.

 

[gmborkovic]

OK, start here. Hold gun with slide locked back.
Insert full mag. Release slide and let it fly in to battery.
Did it Jam?
Did you clean chamber and bolt face under extractor?

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

How is it failing to feed? What happens with other ammo? I use bulk box Federal 36 gr hp in mine without issues. I do have a buffer.

 

[gmborkovic]

Hello Ed, I will get to those points. First lets see how it jams. One step at a time. Mike

 

[505Gibbs]

Finally got a 5” field barrel. Took it out to try out and was having failure to feed issues. I’ve never run into this before with 41. The magazine is not the problem. The donor pistol is a 73/8” I bought month ago for this purpose. I shot 50rds of Rem Govt Std-Vel without issue, with 73/8” barrel.
Question: inspection of 5” barrel shows nothing out of ordinary.
Could the problem be recoil spring? That seems to be the only reasonable cause.
I’ve never had any trouble with 41s, must be my turn.

Since it's a blow back action with the barrel locked in place the barrel length should NOT have any impact on the recoil spring. The action moves equally regardless on barrel length - IMO.

 

[Drm50]

The 1st round chamber when slide is released. Second round hangs up like if return was a little stiffer it would have chambered. Thing is 50rds of this ammo was fired with same gun with 73/8 barrel that came on it. To me that makes ammo innocent. Gun is clean/ was clean….to dry??? Maybe spring is weak?? Never fails to chamber when slide is released.

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

Going to jump back in Mike if you don’t mind. I would disagree 505, a shorter barrel will generate less blowback pressure to operate a blowback gun so barrel length can make a real difference. [I have several blowback .45acp ARs and have played with handloads, short barrels and buffer springs]. Also with age and use recoil springs weaken which will cause feed issues. To the op I would try some CCI or federal hv ammo and see what happens. But a good tear down and cleaning should be first on your list.

We were typing at the same time. From your reply it sounds like your Remington ammo is not generating enough umph in the short barrel to cycle the slide and compress the spring far enough to give it enough forward momentum to pick up and feed the next round.

 

[ggibson511960]

The 1st round chamber when slide is released. Second round hangs up like if return was a little stiffer it would have chambered. Thing is 50rds of this ammo was fired with same gun with 73/8 barrel that came on it. To me that makes ammo innocent. Gun is clean/ was clean….to dry??? Maybe spring is weak?? Never fails to chamber when slide is released.

Think of the returning bolt in terms of an engineering mechanics free body diagram. If you hold the bolt back and release it, how is this scenario different from firing the gun? Easy. A large mass that absorbs recoil energy, a smallish return spring and a medium sized damper are removed from the mechanism; your hand-wrist-forearm combined assembly. If the 41 previously worked with Rem ammo, all the springs, recoil mass and dampers were sufficient to let the bolt hit the recoil stop without absorbing too much energy. The shorter barrel imparted slightly less recoil impulse because the pressure curve of the blowback mechanism diminished earlier, not enough to prevent the bolt from cycling in a new cartridge, but enough to compress less energy into the combined spring system of the recoil spring and your hand. Long winded, engineering discourse more simply stated as limp wristing. Try stiffening up your grip and shooting with forearm more parallel with barrel. In the end you might need a slightly stiffer (higher spring constant) recoil spring. All this assumes the new barrel doesn't have an obvious mechanical impediment, such as a rough feed ramp.

 

[gmborkovic]

Now Ed, dont be that way! Cheap cure first, change ammo.
Then switch mags.
Then, since everybody is hell bent on springs, change it out.
Have you let anybody else shoot it?

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

We’re cool Mike.

 

[gmborkovic]

Ed, I know. I was raised in Charm City. Right on the city/county line.

 

[Mike0251]

Lets start here:
Load up 5 rounds of hi vel and shoot the gun. Did it cycle?

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

A good start.

 

[Drm50]

Think of the returning bolt in terms of an engineering mechanics free body diagram. If you hold the bolt back and release it, how is this scenario different from firing the gun? Easy. A large mass that absorbs recoil energy, a smallish return spring and a medium sized damper are removed from the mechanism; your hand-wrist-forearm combined assembly. If the 41 previously worked with Rem ammo, all the springs, recoil mass and dampers were sufficient to let the bolt hit the recoil stop without absorbing too much energy. The shorter barrel imparted slightly less recoil impulse because the pressure curve of the blowback mechanism diminished earlier, not enough to prevent the bolt from cycling in a new cartridge, but enough to compress less energy into the combined spring system of the recoil spring and your hand. Long winded, engineering discourse more simply stated as limp wristing. Try stiffening up your grip and shooting with forearm more parallel with barrel. In the end you might need a slightly stiffer (higher spring constant) recoil spring. All this assumes the new barrel doesn't have an obvious mechanical impediment, such as a rough feed ramp.

Definitely long winded, a Civil Engineer would have just said limp wrist, of which it isn’t in this case. I have never seen Limp Wrist involved with 22 pistols. I have with 9mm & 45s.
Going to shoot today. Taking assortment of ammo, magazines and couple other 41s to swap barrels.

 

[gmborkovic]

Hello Doc, good idea. Just to amuse me, while at the range let a few other people load and shoot the M41. Mike

 

[dave lehnert]

Anyone out there removed the weight plug on a 7" bbl.? Mine has not been removed for 50+ years and is in there good & tight. I assume the plug thread is standard left turn to remove.

Cheers,
Dave