41 Magnum & 44 Special

BlackSky

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I am curious as to how these two cartridges compare for self defense purposes.

The 44 Special standard SD load appears to be 180 or 200 grains and the same type load for 41 Magnum looks to be 210 grain.

Both the velocity and energy seem to be greater with the 41 Magnum in comparable 44 Special loads.

It doesn't look like either caliber has a large amount of factory made self defense ammunition available but the 41 Magnum has a healthy contingent of hunting ammunition. I'm wonderig if those hunting loads would be a good candidate for SD.

How does the felt recoil match up between the two with similar size/weight firearms? I've never shot either.

I'd love to hear from you guys about your experiences and opinions on these rounds and how they match up against each other for SD purposes.
 
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I often use 44 sp loading data for the 41. Obviously you can load the 41 much hotter, but why? Most of my 41 loads are in the 44 sp range. For SD, I prefer factory and have Silvertips in both calibers.
 
I am a .44 special guy. I did have one .41 mag in a ruger blackhawk when they first came out. One day I and my friend compared my .41 to his heavier .44 mag in a SBH. My lighter barrel whipped more and you could feel more recoil in it than in his heavier .44 mag.
When smith first came out with the .41 mag they also came out with a milder police load for it.
Okay. It`s like this. For a self defense load both the .41 and the .44 special are more than enough by far. So now it comes down to the guns made for them. I suppose smith might have made a mountain gun for the .41 mag by now, but I have never seen one. If they did they must be rare. So! Except for that one gun IF you can find one, I like the s&w .44 specials. They all have the pencil, or tapered barrel. I think all the other models in .41 mag have the straight heavy barrel. In comparing my specials against my model 29 or 25-5 with the straight heavy barrels, their is a big differance in weight and portability. Thats why I like my .44 specials. Here are my .44 specials.


IMG_1417_edited-1.jpg
 
Sorry, Feral.... the rules say you can't post a photo like that without telling us details about the top two guns. 3rd models? Postwar transition or prewar? This is important, more so than the thread. :)

OH, the OP. 41s have pretty much penetration for SD. Probably more than even a 44 mag. There is only a minor difference in recoil between them. Many of us just use specials in our 29s. Loading down M57s and M58s makes them much more pleasant to fire.
 
One thing that you can look up is the .41 Special. It is a simple wildcat that John Taffin really did alot of research on, and I have been taking up the torch of pestering the ammo companies to try and get them to do something with. If loaded right, you can get pretty good results out of it, which puts it ahead of even the .44 Special. The .41 Special with a 210 grain JHP at 900 fps walks all over the factory loaded .44 Special. It can be argued that the .44 Special is a heavier bullet, but the diameter is only slighter larger at .429. The .41 Special has very little recoil, is very accurate from every gun I have ever shot it out of and would make a fantastic defense round. I have done alot of shooting with the .44 Special as well having both Smith 24's and a 624, and to me the outright best load for everything was the cast Lyman #429421 250 grain bullet and 7.5 grains of Unique. But to me the .41 Magnum is really the all around king if you know how to load for it and are willing to work with it. If the .41 Special were realized, and someone were to produce it commercially, than you would have alot more .41's being taken out to the range and carried for personal defense.
 
Okay dick. The top left started life as a 4" HD that I bought real cheap, but prior to that I had picked up just the barrel off a model 21 (.44 special) at a gun show about 7 years prior and was waiting for a cheap HD to show up. It did and I had my gunsmith just screw the barrel in and rechamber the clyinder.
The top right I bought that way. A triplelock that someone sent back to the factory in 1949 and again in 1950 and had them put on modern day target sights.
That 7 1/2" colt saa started life in 1906 and was a 4 3/4" 44 wcf and sent to the copper queen mine, bisbee arizona. Old gun writer Tommy Bish along with Al Capone that owned King gun works in Los Angles converted it to .44 special. My old friend and mentor "Duke" duvall was capones brother in law and also did most of the polishing at the shop for his extra gun money, bought it from bish and sold it to me around 1970.
The rest are honest guns. Duke also sold me the 6 1/2" 1950 target, and regetably, I misplaced the original grips, and put on the cokes off my 29-2. The 4 3/4" colt I bought new around 1983, the 24-3 4" I also bought new years ago. FM
 
Didn't Elmer Keith push the development and manufacture of the 41mag and later the 44mag too?
 
"Survival Guns" by Mel Tappan is somewhat dated by now, but does have an interesting discussion of "comparative stopping power". Tappan's calculation uses bullet weight in grains x muzzle velocity x sectional area of the bore, moving the decimal three places to the left for convenience:
.41 Magnum 210 x 1050 x .126 = 27.73
.44 Special 246 x 755 x .146 = 27.11
 
"Survival Guns" by Mel Tappan is somewhat dated by now, but does have an interesting discussion of "comparative stopping power". Tappan's calculation uses bullet weight in grains x muzzle velocity x sectional area of the bore, moving the decimal three places to the left for convenience:
.41 Magnum 210 x 1050 x .126 = 27.73
.44 Special 246 x 755 x .146 = 27.11

This appears to be the lead cast specs or close to them on the 41mag? The federal and cor-con specs are much higher on the jacketed bullets/ammo they manufacture for the 41mag. Bill
 
This appears to be the lead cast specs or close to them on the 41mag? The federal and cor-con specs are much higher on the jacketed bullets/ammo they manufacture for the 41mag. Bill

Tappan's Book is over 20 years old, and so is the ammo data. His formula for stopping power is easy, though.
 
Most of the .44 Special ammo is loaded fairly light, I'm guessing for all the older guns still out there. Some of the speciality brands like CorBon or Buffalo Brand might be hotter, and the 44 special does offer more varity. The .41 mag seems to be more for a hunting round with the loads and guns out there, but either should do the job just fine. If you don't have the gun yet I would consider a .44mag, then you have a lot more options as far as loads.
 
Didn't Elmer Keith push the development and manufacture of the 41mag and later the 44mag too?

Elmer Keith pushed the 44 mag until its first factory production in 1955 if I recall correctly. He pushed the 41 mag as the ideal police round and the factories began producing it in 1962 or 1964.
 
I like the 41 mag. I like it in my 58 and my 5.5 inch Ruger Redhawk.
You ain't gonna find ammo at WalMart, but most any well stocked LGS has something on the shelves you can feed it with. Scouring the internet will result in finding loads similar to the "police load" or some screaming hunting rounds.
It is a great handloading cartridge, bullets from 170 to 300 grains can be found...and a wide variety of powders will push it to whatever limit you and your gun can stand.
I like it, and many of us do.....to some it is obsolete, or maybe never should have been developed...but it is fun to shoot, accurate and hard hitting loaded right...what else do you need in a handgun round??
 
I put a .41 jacketed SWC thru the thick steel fender of an old '50s junker and the bullet disappeared into the block. I guess that would be enough penetration for SD.
 
It doesn't look like either caliber has a large amount of factory made self defense ammunition available .

I've just ordered my first .44 Special and I'm finding that there are lots of interesting loads that might be used for SD, such as the WW Silvertip or the Speer GoldDot in the 180-200 grain range. You have to go the the major suppliers online to find them though, and even then they may be on back-order.
 
While this is an old thread, I know exactly what you want. The very best load for your .41 Magnum is a 210-grain SWCHP leaving a either a 4" Model 57 (or Model 58) at about 1000 fps. It is imperative that you load a relatively soft lead slug so that you can obtain some expansion. This was what Elmer Keith envisioned when he engineered the cartridge.

Penetration, expansion and an initial projectile diameter of .410"... What's not to like?

Scott
 
I've just ordered my first .44 Special and I'm finding that there are lots of interesting loads that might be used for SD, such as the WW Silvertip or the Speer GoldDot in the 180-200 grain range. You have to go the the major suppliers online to find them though, and even then they may be on back-order.
You can not go wrong with speer gold ( in mine) or silvertips ( what I used before gold dots) or CCI's "flying ashtray" was always reported to be a good load. Be Safe,
 
I am curious as to how these two cartridges compare for self defense purposes.

The 44 Special standard SD load appears to be 180 or 200 grains and the same type load for 41 Magnum looks to be 210 grain.

Both the velocity and energy seem to be greater with the 41 Magnum in comparable 44 Special loads.

It doesn't look like either caliber has a large amount of factory made self defense ammunition available but the 41 Magnum has a healthy contingent of hunting ammunition. I'm wonderig if those hunting loads would be a good candidate for SD.

How does the felt recoil match up between the two with similar size/weight firearms? I've never shot either.

I'd love to hear from you guys about your experiences and opinions on these rounds and how they match up against each other for SD purposes.
There is a lot more SD .44 Special ammo out there than you think. Hornady has 2 Critical Defense loads, Speer has a SD load using a Gold Dot bullet, Winchester has a Silvertip SD load, Cor-Bon has several loads as does Buffalo Bore. There are a lot of SD ammo choices for the 44 Special out there.

While you are correct about the 41 Magnum having a lot of hunting bullets many of those loads can be used for SD too. The 175gr Silvertip load would make a fine SD load. Buffalo Bore and Cor-Bon both make dedicated SD loads in 41 Magnum too.

I wouldn't allow ammo to block you from carrying either. I would carry the one you can shoot best and the one you can make a quick and accurate followup shot with.
 
I use the 200 gr Silvertips in 44 special and I find them to be incredibly accurate. I have three S&W model 21's and the results are the same for all three. I usually order them online from midwayusa.com
 
Most .41 mag ammo is either hard-cast SWCs or hi-vel heavily constructed , controlled expansion JHP/JSPs designed for big game.

For defense against two-legged nasties , Winchester makes a 175gr Silvertip at somewhat less then max velocity.
 
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