44 mag Sierra210gr and N110

[Scrumbag]

Hi folks,

Does anyone have data for the 210gr Sierra JHC with Vihtavouri N110? I'm struggling to find any.

Scrummy

 

[BigMuddy]

Sierra manual has data.

Cartridge OAL 1.600"

Starting load: 19.0 gr. 1200 fps
Max load: 22.1 gr. 1450 fps

Firearm used: Ruger SBH 7 1/2"

Dan

 

[Scrumbag]

Sierra manual has data.

Cartridge OAL 1.600"

Starting load: 19.0 gr. 1200 fps
Max load: 22.1 gr. 1450 fps

Firearm used: Ruger SBH 7 1/2"

Dan

Thanks Dan. I saw that but wondered if anyone had seen anything a little hotter. Vihtavouri has the 240gr Hornady JTC-Sil at a max of 22.0gr and the 200gr XTP at 26.3gr. Sierra seems very conservative.

Any thoughts?

Scrummy

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Thanks Dan. I saw that but wondered if anyone had seen anything a little hotter. Vihtavouri has the 240gr Hornady JTC-Sil at a max of 22.0gr and the 200gr XTP at 26.3gr. Sierra seems very conservative. Any thoughts? Scrummy

My thought is you can make your own data up, and YOU take the risk of getting it wrong. Getting hot load date for a foreign powder is like looking for chicken teeth! Somebody is always willing to stake your gun and safety on their opinion!

Ivan

ETA: You didn't say which firearm you'll be using. There are some junky import 44 mags out their. I have S&W 29's (not the strongest guns) and a T/C Super 14 (that is a real tank). If it will fit in the chamber, the T/C will handle it. I've had Ruger SBH's (Those are almost tanks), Virginia Dragoon 44 Mags (those are tanks) and some nice single action that were no stronger than a model 29! The powder companies have to publish data based on the weakest 44 Mag owner's lawyer! ITB

 

[Scrumbag]

My thought is you can make your own data up, and YOU take the risk of getting it wrong. Getting hot load date for a foreign powder is like looking for chicken teeth! Somebody is always willing to stake your gun and safety on their opinion!

Ivan

Ivan, I was merely wondering if anyone had seen other data from a reputable source. I'm not planning on making things up, don't worry.

"Foreign Powder" - you crack me up. Where I am, Hodgdon is far more "foreign" than Vihtavouri

 

[BigMuddy]

Thanks Dan. I saw that but wondered if anyone had seen anything a little hotter. Vihtavouri has the 240gr Hornady JTC-Sil at a max of 22.0gr and the 200gr XTP at 26.3gr. Sierra seems very conservative.

Any thoughts?

Scrummy

My "thoughts" are to not exceed data in a manual. The only place you might find something different would be in a VV manual. I was told by a prominent firearm manufacturer to use data from bullet manufacturers. Substituting Hornady data with a Sierra bullet may result in higher pressures. It may have a thinner jacket and/or a softer core. If you want to use "hotter" loads seen in a Hornady manual then use Hornady bullets as well. Not sure what the intended use is, but a 210gr bullet at 1400+ fps will do considerable damage to anything it hits.

Dan

 

[Scrumbag]

ETA: You didn't say which firearm you'll be using. There are some junky import 44 mags out their. I have S&W 29's (not the strongest guns) and a T/C Super 14 (that is a real tank). If it will fit in the chamber, the T/C will handle it. I've had Ruger SBH's (Those are almost tanks), Virginia Dragoon 44 Mags (those are tanks) and some nice single action that were no stronger than a model 29! The powder companies have to publish data based on the weakest 44 Mag owner's lawyer! ITB

Hi Ivan,

So, this will be going in a .44 mag Chiappa 1892 lever action so stronger than an S&W 29 I'd have thought

 

[Scrumbag]

My "thoughts" are to not exceed data in a manual. The only place you might find something different would be in a VV manual. I was told by a prominent firearm manufacturer to use data from bullet manufacturers. Substituting Hornady data with a Sierra bullet may result in higher pressures. It may have a thinner jacket and/or a softer core. If you want to use "hotter" loads seen in a Hornady manual then use Hornady bullets as well. Not sure what the intended use is, but a 210gr bullet at 1400+ fps will do considerable damage to anything it hits.

Dan

Morning Dan, all very sensible.

I'm wanting to get a load in a .44 mag lever action (1892 clone).

Where I live, we have a law that for the larger species of deer requiring 1,700 ftlbs of muzzle energy. This seems easier to do with a lighter bullet going fast than a heavier bullet (Most 240gr jacketed loads get into the 1,600 ftlb region but not quite the legal - though I have no doubt the bullet would be effective).

Hence why I'm asking about hotter loads. For a 210gr bullet, 1910 fps is needed.

I have looked at H110 but I'm a little "uneasy" about how relatively inflexible H110 seems to be, hence looking at N110 as is single base and has a wider load range.

Scrummy

 

[Fishinfool]

You are right about H110 / Win 296 (the same powders) It is at its best with full power loads. It is not flexible, but is the right tool for the job, in your situation. I am not familiar with N110, but if you want max velocity in that rifle barrel, then a slow powder like H110 will do it.

I get 1850 fps with 240 jacketed bullets and Win 296 / H110 powder in my Marlins. Never tried loading the 210 sierra for use in a rifle, but don't see any reason you cant get 1900 fps plus out of yours.

Question - When using reloads, how do the "powers that be" know your velocity?

Larry

 

[Scrumbag]

You are right about H110 / Win 296 (the same powders) It is at its best with full power loads. It is not flexible, but is the right tool for the job, in your situation. I am not familiar with N110, but if you want max velocity in that rifle barrel, then a slow powder like H110 will do it.

I get 1850 fps with 240 jacketed bullets and Win 296 / H110 powder in my Marlins. Never tried loading the 210 sierra for use in a rifle, but don't see any reason you cant get 1900 fps plus out of yours.

Question - When using reloads, how do the "powers that be" know your velocity?

Larry

Larry, you make an excellent point. Just the law is the law. I might think it dumb but I try not to break it.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

M-92 and clones are built like tanks! I currently don't have one in 44 Mag, but I did own the Browning/Miroku copy.

When Casull did his original experiments on high velocity 45 caliber ammo. He used an old Winchester 92 rebarreled in 45 Colt and developed Duplex and Triplex powder loads that developed more pressure than can done with a 44 Mag case (due to case capacity) And the 45 Colt chamber walls are thinner too!

I have never examined a Chiappa Model 92, but with modern steel, it would take some doing to mess up that design! If your shoulder can handle it, I'm sure your gun will be safe!!! (All 44 Mag carbines are known for fierce recoil by us Whimpey Americans- but I think that is from a smaller butt plate size)

Ivan

 

[Scrumbag]

Well, it's a bit stronger than a Smith revolver, anyway

 

[Scrumbag]

M-92 and clones are built like tanks! I currently don't have one in 44 Mag, but I did own the Browning/Miroku copy.

When Casull did his original experiments on high velocity 45 caliber ammo. He used an old Winchester 92 rebarreled in 45 Colt and developed Duplex and Triplex powder loads that developed more pressure than can done with a 44 Mag case (due to case capacity) And the 45 Colt chamber walls are thinner too!

I have never examined a Chiappa Model 92, but with modern steel, it would take some doing to mess up that design! If your shoulder can handle it, I'm sure your gun will be safe!!! (All 44 Mag carbines are known for fierce recoil by us Whimpey Americans- but I think that is from a smaller butt plate size)

Ivan

Well, we shall see.

I shall have a play with my H110 and JHC 210gr and see where I get to. Might be lucky and get away with it.

I have loaded up a few Hornady XTP 200gr and H110 and the primers don't look great.

Scrummy

 

[Krogen]

Morning Dan, all very sensible.

I'm wanting to get a load in a .44 mag lever action (1892 clone).

Where I live, we have a law that for the larger species of deer requiring 1,700 ftlbs of muzzle energy.

<snip>

Scrummy

Sorry, I have no direct input to your question, but a comment caught my interest. How would your game cops verify the muzzle energy? Factory ammo usually has printed references, but handloads are an unknown. Particularly, if you set out to slightly exceed 1700 ft-lb with a handload, they could question your specific load energy, yet have no proof. They might just look up the 44 Mag and write you a citation based on published energies.

 

[Scrumbag]

Sorry, I have no direct input to your question, but a comment caught my interest. How would your game cops verify the muzzle energy? Factory ammo usually has printed references, but handloads are an unknown. Particularly, if you set out to slightly exceed 1700 ft-lb with a handload, they could question your specific load energy, yet have no proof. They might just look up the 44 Mag and write you a citation based on published energies.

A good point there but one tries to obey the law.

You can in theory get 240gr to 1,700ftlbs if you believe Hodgdon's H110 data

 

[Scrumbag]

Cheeky question folks,

Anyone know how tough the Sierra 210gr JHC are vs the Winchester 210gr Silver Tips?