45 Colt bullet diameter

[Doublebit]

Gentlemen,
I am gearing up to reload 45 Colt for my 25-5 and also for a Ruger Bisley Blackhawk. Matts Bullets offers their Keith bullet in either .452 or .454 diameters. I don't intend to hotrod either the Smith or Ruger, looking for 900-1000 fps. Since I'd rather not stock 2 bullet diameters, which diameter would be best for both revolvers? I would like to have only one load around for both to avoid possible problems. Thanks,

LT

 

[ronnie gore]

45 colt

i cast my own and load them as cast without sizing diameter .454 just use liquid alox to lube, no leading and i load around the same velocity as you do. i have some factory cast 45 colt 255 grain sized 452 and they do lead some.
i shoot them in a 25-5 and a 625, and a old model ruger.

 

[Arub]

I have a pair of new model Black Hawks and .452 groups great with them. A friend is using .451 cast in his recent manufacture 25 and they seem to group well also. .451 jacketed also groups well with the Black Hawks.

 

[buckbeans]

It is best to measure the throat diameter of both revolvers to make your decision. Many Smith 25-5's have oversized throats and the .454 will be better. The ruger blackhawk is notorious for undersized throats and most have to be reamed out to accept a .452 bullet to get good accuracy.

 

[scattershot]

I'd go with the .454. I have a 25-5, and the cylinder throats are .456 or a smidge over, and it shoots best with the larger bullets. lately, the trend has been to the .452 bullet, but the larger one should shoot well from both of your revolvers.

 

[Krogen]

My SAA and Blackhawk convertible both have large throats. I can wobble a .452" bullet when I insert it in the throat of either cylinder. It's reduced somewhat with .454" bullets, but still apparent. I prefer to see a snug fit in the throats. You might consider one of the softer swaged bullets in .454" diameter. Supposedly they handle oversize throats better than harder bullets. I'm experimenting with swaged bullets now, but have no real results to share.

 

[Doublebit]

Thanks, guys. Yesterday I found a .452 jacketed bullet on my bench, thought I was out. It is an easy drop thru in the 25-5's cylinder so I'm thinking it has the larger throats. I don't have a decent micrometer so can't get an accurate measurement. I'll give the .454's a try.

Krogan, you mentioned swaged .454 bullets. Where did you find them? The ones I've seen were .452.

LT

 

[Arub]

Roze Distribution sells 230 lrn swagged for $105/1000 shipped. Currently sold out but can backorder if this is a good price. Site is Roze Distribution, Inc. - Zero Bullets and Ammunition .

 

[Krogen]

Krogan, you mentioned swaged .454 bullets. Where did you find them? The ones I've seen were .452.

Doublebit,

I bought mine from Midway. I'm sure you can find them at other places too. I would swear the Remingtons were 0.454" but I see that Midway is now calling them 0.455" which is perhaps more of a good thing. I'll go measure mine, but it may be hard to do as the lube on them is pretty thick/crumbly/messy. Have a look at the photo to see what I mean.... Also, watch the LOA with an SAA; the Blackhawk was not a concern. I don't know how long the cylinder on your M25 is. Hornady's "look" nicer, but they are a bit more expensive. I'm still fooling with these, so no real opinions yet.

Krogen

Bullets 45 Colt (Long Colt) (455 Diameter) 250 Grain Lead Round Nose

Bullets 45 Cal (454 Diameter) 255 Grain Lead Flat Nose Box of 200

 

[scattershot]

FWIW, those Remingtons ( and Hornady) are what I used for my 25-5, with excellent results.

 

[mikld]

For best results in your guns you'll need to measure the cylinder throats. If one gun has consistantly smaller throats then have that cylinder honed/reamed to match the gun with the larger cylinder throats. Then use bullets the same size as the cylinder throats (throats .454" use .454" bullets). A lot of work to use one bullet diameter in both guns. Personally I don't mind stocking different size bullets for the same caliber (I have 5, .44 magnums and shoot 3 different bullet diameters depending on the gun)

 

[Aticus]

A question for y'all, what size lead bullet would you use if your gun has a bore of .454 but the chamber throats measured .452? Also what bullet if the chamber throats measure .454 and the bore is .452? Seems like there would be leading problems either way, just curious.

Pecos

 

[mikld]

Bore .454" + .452" Throats = severe leading and poor accuracy, any size lead bullet. Throats will swage bullet to .452"; undersize.

Bore .452" + .454" throats Size bullets to .454"= less chance of leading, better accuracy.

 

[hawgleg]

Just go and buy a box of Hornady 255 gr .454 diameter swaged cowboy bullets #12458. See how accurate the are, if accurate you've found your bullet, if not try a .452 diameter. The 45 Colt diameter is all over the place as it's a very old round. Most made today have gotten closer to .452 bullets. Any new to me 45 Colts get started with the Hornady bullets as I always have them in stock. Good luck.

 

[Aticus]

Wouldn't I be better off using a bullet sized to the bore and try to match the chamber throats to match the bore? Seems this is the place to start. I haven't checked that out but I got more than acceptable accuracy out of .452 bullets in a late 3rd gen SAA.

As I read the OP he was buying his bullets not casting his own. Would it be better in that case to just use .454 bullets?

Pecos

 

[mikld]

If the bullets are smaller than the throats, hot gasses will blow by the base of the bullet, melting lead on the sides of the bullet and depositing lead on the cylinder, forcing cone, and first part of the barrel. When the throats are larger than the groove diameter, and bullets sized to the throats, the gasses/pressure obiturate the bullet base, sealing the chamber/throats and the bullet swages to fit/seal the bore, eliminating leading.

 

[Aticus]

I understand the theory of the gas blow by, my question was: wouldn't it be better to use a .454 bullet than a .452? The man is buying his bullets and unless he has small throats (.451 - .452) is seems he would be ahead of the game by using .454 bullets that would be swaged down by the smaller throats. If his throats match the bore then he could obtain that size bullet and have a match. I'm also not sure you can eliminate leading with an obturated bullet. I should think some of the lead will still rub off in the bore especially if the bullet is too hard and skids some as it enters the forcing cone and the rifling. I may be wrong and probably am but this is what I observed when I was casting my own. The harder the bullet the more leading I got even though the bullets were sized correctly. It's a pain but all of the dimensions have to be considered or you have problems.

Edit to add a question. I just measured the throats on my 3rd gen SAA and slugged the bore. Throats measured .456 - .457 and the groove slugged .452. What do I do about that? Slamming a .456 - .457 bullet into a .452 groove isn't my idea of a good thing.

As an aside I had a Ruger Vaquero in 44-40 that had .427 throats on a .429 groove. .427 bullets fit the throats beautifully but accuracy was bad to say the least and leading was not good. A trip to Ruger solved the problem.

 

[mikld]

I'm jes talkin' from experience, my own. If bullets are too much larger than throats yes, they'll swage down, but often you'll get leading on the face of the cylinder, inside top strap, and forcing cone. I don't have one, but I've read 45 Cold handguns vary widely in throat diameter and groove diameter. .457" throats not being too unusual. Some guns you'll just not get any accuracy shooting lead bullets and odd sized throats are often the reason. For your Colt, I'd shoot .457 bullets as .005" isn't much when it comes to swaging lead in a barrel. Optimally a throat should be just a few thousandths larger than groove diameter, .002"-.004"...

 

[Aticus]

mikid, I thought of something last night but was too blasted tired to post it (we retired guys can get awful tired doing little or nothing all day). How do I get a .457 bullet into a 45 Colt case with out working more than necessary? That's sure to give very short case life.

Pecos

 

[61woody]

I have no experience with S&W revolvers but did a lot of shooting with Colt replicas and rugers. The Colt clones were almost always more accurate with .454 dia bullets while my Blackhawks favored .452s and throat size on the clones varied from .454-.458