686 CS-1 Modification question

[edl]

Hello, I have a pair of Smith & Wessons CS-1 686s. One has a three inch barrel and the other has a 4" barrel. I have had the 3" barreled one since the early 1990s and have not fired many rounds through it. I recently purchased the 4" barreled one and have not had a chance to fire it and will not likely get a chance to do so for a few months due to more pressing projects. One of the guns is marked with an "M" on the inside of the frame, the other is marked with a "2M".

From my research these guns had problems when delivered. In communicating with a former Customs officer I learned:
"There were tolerance issues and unburned powder grains were getting under the extractor star and locking up the action. The star itself was modified and actually dished out on the inside surface to help this problem."

So I assumed that the "M" and the "2M" mark meant that my guns had received this modification.

Then elsewhere I read: "the "M" stamp is for the hammer nose bushing modification/recall that affected 686's, 681's, 586's, and 581's. S&W started incorporating the changes sometime during the run of CS-1's, so some got the "M" stamp at the factory, and some did not. Because of this, they all had to be sent to Glynco to be inspected (S&W sent personnel to Glynco to do this). The guns that did not have the hammer nose bushing modification got fixed and got the "M" stamp. Those that already had the "M" stamp got inspected and got the "2" stamp in front of the M. "

Since my guns were in very clean shape when bought, they were clearly part of an overflow from the contract that was sold to the public and not guns that were carried by the US Customs.

So this begs the question whether or not my guns have had the modification with the star to correct the problem with the overtightness that causes them to seize up after having a box or two of rounds fired through them. I have only fired a small number of rounds through the 3" model and that was several years ago.

I will try to attach a picture of the guns in a follow-up post.

thanks for reading this,

Ed

 

[SAFireman]

Ed,

If they have the M stamp, S&W has performed the modification (hammer nose bushing). The guns with the 2M were double checked while in-service with US Customs service. The 2 was added by S&W factory field service technicians.

I hope that helps.

 

[edl]

Here are some photos. First the two guns with the 4" barreled version on the top:

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The markings of the 3" Barrel:

And the markings of the 4" barrel:

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[824tsv]

I purchased my 4" Model 686 CS-1 new. It was a contract over-run gun and not stamped with the M. I continue to use this revolver in PPC competitions and it's been flawless since new with several thousand 148g wadcutters. I wouldn't worry about it if those revolvers were mine. With some of the work I've seen from the factory, I wouldn't dare send mine back to S&W.
Shoot and enjoy.

 

[edl]

Ed,

If they have the M stamp, S&W has performed the modification (hammer nose bushing). The guns with the 2M were double checked while in-service with US Customs service. The 2 was added by S&W factory field service technicians.

I hope that helps.

Thanks, SAFireman.

But I am wondering if this also means that the tolerance issues and unburned powder grains were getting under the extractor star and locking up the action were corrected.

thanks,

Ed

 

[ralph7]

I have a 3" CS-1 with the M stamp and I can't discern a dished out area under the extractor.
Maybe it is there and not noticeable?

 

[jbtrucker]

I volunteer to shoot them for you

 

[Lonestar57]

I have a CS-1 3" with the 2M stamp. I'm not sure anybody here will really know the answer to your question. Why not remove the two extractors and compare to see if there is a noticeable difference between the two? Good luck.

 

[SAFireman]

Thanks, SAFireman.

But I am wondering if this also means that the tolerance issues and unburned powder grains were getting under the extractor star and locking up the action were corrected.

thanks,

Ed

Ed,

I had not heard about unburned powder being an issue for the Customs Service guns. We have a few retired agents here, maybe one of them will chime in.

I have heard of this issue with model 63's, but not CS-1's.

Good luck.

 

[vegasgunhand]

The unburned powder issue came to a head soon after the CS-1 was issued in numbers to the field. The tighter tolerances was ordered by a staff member at the U.S. Firearms and Training Branch in Ft. Benning, GA., who had ZERO experience in law enforcement. (LONG story). Anyway he was a national match rifle shooter, and felt the standard 686 tolerances needed to be tighter for more accuracy. he also didn't realize that most agents didn't carry ,357 magnum rounds in their revolvers. they in fact preferred the Treasury +P+ .38 spl. round.

U.S. Customs used a 60 round qualification course at the time. Soon after the CS-1 was in the field, we started having the CS-1 getting a progressively harder trigger pull, and in some cases, locking up entirely. It was soon determined that the unburned powder was getting under the extraction start during reloads. So the guns were quickly sent back to Ft. Benning for the repairs. Once the repairs were completed at the Ft. Benning facility, they were stamped with "2m" signifying they were good to return to the field.

Even after the guns were repaired, the Agents and Air/Marine officers were leery of carrying a CS-1, so many just set in the armories. less than two years later, U.S. Customs recalled the CS-1's from the field, and replaced them with 6906 semi-auto 9 mm pistols. Some of the CS-1's were sold in exchange sales until 1992, when the Clinton administration stopped all exchange sales. Some were sent to friendly governments overseas, but I fear many were just outright destroyed.

I was lucky enough to get mine when Lew Horton had purchased some in the exchange sales.