A.O. Niedner's 22/32 Cased Revolver Value?

[ol777gunnerz]

I am curious what price other member's of this forum would value this A O Niedner stamped 22/32 revolver which lettered as shipped with the Regulation Police grips in 1919. It is in a period wood case with a extra set of 22/32 target grips numbered 2262 on the bottom. The gun was sent back to the factory for work dated 10/22 on the butt & diamond under the barrel, there are no papers for the work in the S&W Historical files. The gun was also later owned by Michael Petrov, who owned the largest Niedner collection period, & literally wrote the 2 books on the old well known gunsmith's, of which one is included in this set with Niedner's info in 2 chapters.

 

[Truckman]

I could not begin to put a dollar value on something that priceless......Ben

 

[s&wchad]

A number of our members in the Michigan Antique Arms Collectors club covet Niedner's work, since he settled in Dowagiac.

People typically look for guns that he built, but that is very cool!

 

[rct269]

My approach to something like this is simple: I have no idea what the true value might be---other than bigger than a bread-box.

Given the opportunity to buy it, I would pay the asking price in short order----and then grab it and run!! In an auction environment, I would hold up my paddle, and never take it down!

Ralph Tremaine

An added two cents worth: The opportunity to acquire a piece like this comes along once in a lifetime---or never. As for me, as a collector of S&W target guns for over 60 years (ending 3 years or so ago), I have never had such an opportunity. I suppose a Pope piece might be considered the more desirable, but I never had that opportunity either. I'm very happy with my experiences as a collector--but I could be happier.

 

[Hondo44]

Does the letter come with the gun?
To who and where it was shipped (from the letter) could add additional value.

That's the earliest .22/32 HFT I've seen with the RP grips and rebated backstrap.

That's such a unique gun, only an auction gavel price will supply the current value.

 

[ol777gunnerz]

info

Does the letter come with the gun?
To who and where it was shipped (from the letter) could add additional value.

That's the earliest .22/32 HFT I've seen with the RP grips and rebated backstrap.

That's such a unique gun, only an auction gavel price will supply the current value.

Yes, Jinks letter is part of the set, the gun was shipped to William Burkhard Co, St. Paul, Minn. in April of 1919. Niedner closed his shop in Malden, Mass. in 1920, moving to Dowagiac, Mich. At some point it came into Niedner's possession, received a grooved trigger & Bobbed hammer, & was stamped with his Malden stamp, which he did on his personal guns after the move.

 

[mrcvs]

I agree, it would take a hammer price at an auction to determine true valuation.

Which could lead to a conundrum of sorts, if you are the buyer in a private sale, or the seller in a private sale.

If offered to you for sale, i would start at a thousand and see how cheaply you can get it. If the seller, start at $6000, but don't give it away. I'm not saying it's worth $5000, but maybe the prospective buyer likes nice round numbers.

My gut feeling is that this revolver is worth two to three times that of a comparable non A O Niedner example, but that is nothing more than a WAG.

 

[rct269]

Same church, different pew---sort of.

I stumbled upon a 22/40 shipped to Philip B. Sharpe---as a gift. I paid $3700 for it---near as I can recall. It sold for $9500 (in a direct sale).

Ralph Tremaine

 

[JSR III]

I show one gun shipped to Burkhard on 4/14/1919 in my database with serial number 270925. It was one of 5 shipped for $20.75. It states that the gun originally shipped with a Patridge front sight but now wears a Sheard bead.

I have never seen a butt stamped set of stocks after the 490 guns shipped to M.W. Robinson in 1914 with a highest serial number of 208415.

Are the stocks pencil numbered inside?

**PS: After posting the above, I did a search of the serial number (270925) that I listed from my database and see that this gun was discussed in another string back in 2020. Perhaps when you bought the gun??? Would love to know if either set of stocks have a penciled serial number on the right panel.

There is also another thread back in 2010 when Petrov bought the gun FWIW.

 

[Jim Watson]

I wonder what went in the other compartments of the box.

 

[larry21556]

I wonder what went in the other compartments of the box.

The box looks like it was made for a black powder colt, like maybe an 1849, the lower compartment was for a bullet mold.

 

[Jim Watson]

The box looks like it was made for a black powder colt, like maybe an 1849, the lower compartment was for a bullet mold.

And the odd shaped compartment for a powder flask, the small square compartment for a tin of caps. Sounds good to me.

 

[ol777gunnerz]

info

I show one gun shipped to Burkhard on 4/14/1919 in my database with serial number 270925. It was one of 5 shipped for $20.75. It states that the gun originally shipped with a Patridge front sight but now wears a Sheard bead.

I have never seen a butt stamped set of stocks after the 490 guns shipped to M.W. Robinson in 1914 with a highest serial number of 208415.

Are the stocks pencil numbered inside?

**PS: After posting the above, I did a search of the serial number (270925) that I listed from my database and see that this gun was discussed in another string back in 2020. Perhaps when you bought the gun??? Would love to know if either set of stocks have a penciled serial number on the right panel.

There is also another thread back in 2010 when Petrov bought the gun FWIW.

The year 2020 post was when I acquired the revolver from another SWCA member, along with a fantastic Remington 1901 rolling block single shot with a Niedner Rifle Corp. barrel with an Olympic Chamber, stamp on barrel: CB 11 [barrel #11 by Carlyn Behrman]. There are no penciled numbers under either set of grips, out of all the old S&W handguns I have owned, only 3 ever were penciled.

 

[BAM-BAM]

Not my area of "accumulation" what makes these guns so special?

 

[Jim Watson]

Provenance. This one will sell for a lot of money because of its connection to Mr Neidner who was one of the premier gunsmiths of his day.

 

[JSR III]

There are no penciled numbers under either set of grips

That is a shame, since S&W did not record these imprint numbers and serial numbers or if they did the records are yet undiscovered, I have been trying to record as many as possible in my database. Knowing that there is one more key to the puzzle out there without a serial number to record is frustrating.

In my database I have 2253 on gun 208054 and 2264 on gun 208197 both part of the 5 shipments containing 490 guns shipped to M.W. Robinson in 1914. I am fairly confident that your stocks with imprint number 2262 originally came on one of the other M.W. Robinson guns with serial numbers between 207926 and 208415.

The first guns shipped in 1919 showing up in my database are 253619 shipped 4-19-1919 and one I own, 270836 shipped 5-1-1919.

It's a shame that serial numbers were not stamped onto the back of the right stock back then like the more current ones. That would make recording these numbers much easier and also prevent subsequent owners from pencil marking stocks to make them appear to be original. It is difficult to tell sometimes however when you see 100 year old stocks with very dark and legible pencil markings it makes one wonder.

 

[rct269]

Provenance. This one will sell for a lot of money because of its connection to Mr Neidner who was one of the premier gunsmiths of his day.

Another one, and the ONLY other one I know about, is Pope.

If/when one is so fortunate to get their grubby little paws on a gun---especially a handgun, marked with either name, that's what's known as "Money in the bank"!! At that point, you can consider yourself a successful collector---never mind you may already be a successful collector for a host of other reasons.

And while referring to either as a "gunsmith" is entirely accurate, their main claim to fame is they were innovative gunsmiths---with a capitol INNOVATIVE!!

They made good things better---A LOT better---leaving the rest of the world to wonder, "Now why didn't I think of that?".

Ralph Tremaine