Just last week a fellow shooting a "low budget" off brand plasticky pistol (that are known to have large oversize chambers) jammed his weapon with aluminum case 9mm and jammed it up so tight he was going to send it back to a gunsmith to have it safely unjammed. I asked him if the gun had a live round or just a fired case jammed in it. He said an empty fired case. So I used a wooden down to beat the case out of the chamber and horror of horrors it was a live round.
I have seen even rifles like the SKS that have a very robust extractor snap them right off when using steel case ammo. The coating on Steel case ammo if deteriorated or rubbed off due to careless handling or poor storage is a real problem with this ammo. Again seeing is believing.
The problem these days is that some weapons either do not have spare parts available once you destroy the part with steel case or aluminum case ammo or if they are available they may be out of stock for months and then of course many times these parts often are not a "drop in" but often require hand fitting, a task that is beyond the ability of many gun owners so its then an expensive trip to a gunsmith assuming he is even a qualified one in regards to your particular weapon to be repaired. I have had so many so-called gunsmiths screw up and even damage my guns that years ago I started doing my own work.
As I said in my other post the best way to screw up and destroy a set of expensive dies, especially match grade dies, is to try and resize steel cases and aluminum cases are not easy on dies either.
Ammo manufacturers have long warned people "not to" reload aluminum cases. Is it worth blowing up an expensive firearm especially if it is no longer made and a collectors item?
You are just wrong when you say you can "blow up" a normal handgun with aluminum ammo. Show me some links from any laboratory on the planet that can prove this. Any case can rupture and they do. Big deal. I have been experimenting with this issue nearly 50 years.
In one case I was a federal agent who was asked to test a prototype of one of the hottest 357 self defense offerings made, I am not new to testing hot ammo. Likewise I have been loading and testing ammo at max loads and up to 10% above max loads, some over 30% above max loads for decades.
In the case of steel cased ammo, in handguns, I have been testing them 30% or so above max loads. I have been lucky none have blown up anything.
I am an attorney, I look for weak links and faulty ammo offerings. And what I know is there is no attorney anywhere who has ever been able to establish that aluminum ammo creates any greater risk than any other product, none. Any product that does , will not last long in the market, too much easy money to be made by lawyers, protecting the public from these dangers that you speak about.
People can make all the lawyer jokes the want, but what we do know for a fact, is that if something is dangerous, lawyers will jump on that danger, makes some big bucks and get that product off of the market. Not many Ford Pintos left around any more.
So, to be fair, what gun was it that you personally saw jammed up and what brand of aluminum ammo was being used? And what did the case look like when you removed it.?
I am surprised that anyone would consider sending a locked gun back to a gunsmith? Why? Normally as range officers, we just pull them apart gently and remove the obstruction. With the mag out, and as you described, the only thing that could possibly be wrong is a stuck empty case. Not much gun smithing to go on there.
So, was it a split case?
How many rounds had been fired since the last cleaning? Pretty commonly known that aluminum is not as slick and the chamber needs to be kept clean more often, once again, the reason we use Flex Hones on any duty gun or gun expected to perform under extreme conditions.
And how long since he last applied lube to the gun. These are basic and critical questions to be asked when any gun locks up, otherwise we have no basis to assume anything.
And plastic guns have metal ramps, metal barrels and metal ejectors and metal extractors AND a metal slide,, if I am preparing an expert witness for trial, he will not pose any distinction between metal framed handgun and one with any aluminum, scandium alloy aluminum, polymer or zinc alloy frame, because there is not physical distinction. The parts of the guns involved in a jam or even kaboom, are all metal, and the framework is practically, physically, and legally irrelevant.
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So, my response is that the gun you observed locked up was not simply because the guy used aluminum ammo or some plastic gun, but because he did something wrong....wrong under the circumstances, so I am assuming that he was some person new to shooting, dirty gun, lack of lube something other than just his brand of aluminum cased ammo.
Please explain all these issues, because your statement just seems more like an opinion. You do not like it, you do not like cheap plastic guns, and you saw one jammed to the point that he would not pull the slide back. That is exactly what will happen with nearly every gun is you do not clean them for long enough. One caveat, those with larger chambers, usually last longer between cleanings. So please explain.
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As I said in my other post the best way to screw up and destroy a set of expensive dies, especially match grade dies, is to try and resize steel cases and aluminum cases are not easy on dies either.
Really, show me one independent lab that confirms this. First, lets dispose with the resizing of aluminum cases. You can smash and aluminum case with your fingers. Do you really believe that you can damage a set of dies made of the hardest steel with aluminum? You can only scratch or damage a metal with another object that is harder than it is. Not possible.
You said you can "destroy" expensive dies by resizing steel cases. Show me a report by an independent lab that proves this there is none. You will find ammo companies that revolted against the Russian ammo long ago saying this with their minions, they said it destroyed guns too, but that was all fake noise. Since that time you have Hornady Black, USA Forge and Federal all producing steel cased ammo, because it it totally safe in guns and dies.
In 2011 Lane Pierce published an article about reloading steel cased 45 acp, that is where I got my start. I have now loaded and experimented with it more than any gun writer or publisher on record. I find no one that can dispute my actual testing.
Simple take a steel case of 45 acp ammo and one of brass. Cut out a little piece, maybe 1/4 inch wide by 1/2 inch long. Now take 2 pair of pliers and twist both back and forth until they break. What you will find is not much difference. The steel case will bend back and forth about the same as the brass case. What that tells you is it is not that hard, and secondly that it has the ability to spring back for resizing, just like a brass case. And most importantly, it tells you that being flexible and softer than gun metal or die steel, is that it cannot possibly harm your gun or your dies.
Of course if you use plastic bullets and plastic cases in your guns, they will last longer. The softer the materials the longer they last. But when comparing aluminum or steel cases, the war cycle and any damage is minor, trivial at best.
So, if you have any actual evidence from an independent lab please provide some links, so we all can learn, otherwise, maybe just consider what you saw as a fluke, which it probably was.
It is easy to trash cheap guns and cheap ammo, but maybe people cannot afford the more expensive guns and ammo, and really need more factual information, is all I am saying. I can afford any of them, I just choose to operate as cheaply as possible. Just my way.
Please feel free to provide any actual links showing I am in error, it happens all the time and I am never offended, I am old and biased and think what I have seen and done, is correct, but if I am wrong, I am wrong, no problem there.
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