Ammo Gone Bad?

federali

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Hardly a week goes by that someone doesn't post a query whether or not a particular lot of ammo is still reliable or safe to fire. I scratch my head, thinking that I have stuff in my refrigerator that's older than the ammo in question.

There's a show on Netflix (sorry, forgot the title) in which four battlefield detective/hobbyists have received a government permit to explore the WWII eastern front, near Latvia. One of the items they unearthed was a live but heavily rusted and dirt encrusted 20mm round that's been in the ground since 1945. To prove a point, one of the men broke off the projectile with his hands (the round was that corroded) and poured the black-colored and coarse powder charge onto the blade of a shovel. He put a match to it and up it went, like the powder was made yesterday.

Artillery rounds, some from WWI, are still regularly found all over Europe. These too are handled with great care by EOD teams. They remain as dangerous as the day they were fired. Rounds that landed in thoroughly blasted and muddy ground often didn't encounter enough resistance to trigger the detonator. Every once in a while, a farmer manages to set one off by accident.

I have fired .30-40 Krag ammo loaded in 1917. I once accidentally fired a black powder, .38 Long Colt round and the danged thing worked just fine. The cloud of smoke as well as the odor told me what happened as I was practicing with ammo from a rusted coffee can full of odd-ball .38 SPL rounds received from an estate.

Ammo doesn't have an expiration date. What can cause ammo to go bad is leaving it in leather belt loops for long periods of time, or having brass and copper components in contact with a ferrous metal, causing an electrolytic reaction.

Even the admonition of storing ammo in a cool, dry place, may be overblown. I recovered some .22 rimfire that had been stored in a barn for decades, yet, every round fired. But, back in the 50s and earlier, paper shot shells did swell and fall apart if subjected to prolonged moisture. That must be where cool and dry originated.

When my dad passed, I was cleaning out his jeep and found a hunting belt containing a dozen rounds of .30-06 that had alternately baked and froze for at least 15 years, from when he last hunted. It took me a while to scrape off the verdigris but once clean, every round fired.

With this post, I know I'm preaching to the choir. Tomorrow, when the next poster worries about ammo longevity, refer him to this thread.
 
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I too have fired .45 ACP and .30-'06 from WWI - It worked.
Have fired ammo from the 1930s and WWII - It also worked.
The only ammo which ever went bad on me was some 6.5mm Swedish military rounds. These I bought sometime during the early 1960s, and all had much earlier headstamps. I found them maybe 10 years ago, and the cases were nearly corroded away, probably as the result of powder degradation emitting corrosive gasses.
 
I've never had a problem with WW II ammo.

I buy 30-40 ammo from before WW I and shoot it unless the cases are corroded. (I keep my eyes open for this ammo in poor condition boxes so the collect ability is nil).

Just this year, I shot some 22 shorts that had been sold by Monkey Wards in 1917.

It all works just fine.

Last year, my son shot a deer with 270 ammo I'd loaded in 1964. He insists he'll keep using it until it's gone.

Ammo has a shelf life much greater than any of us.
 
Hardly a week goes by that someone doesn't post a query whether or not a particular lot of ammo is still reliable or safe to fire. I scratch my head, thinking that I have stuff in my refrigerator that's older than the ammo in question.

There's a show on Netflix (sorry, forgot the title) in which four battlefield detective/hobbyists have received a government permit to explore the WWII eastern front, near Latvia. One of the items they unearthed was a live but heavily rusted and dirt encrusted 20mm round that's been in the ground since 1945. To prove a point, one of the men broke off the projectile with his hands (the round was that corroded) and poured the black-colored and coarse powder charge onto the blade of a shovel. He put a match to it and up it went, like the powder was made yesterday.

Artillery rounds, some from WWI, are still regularly found all over Europe. These too are handled with great care by EOD teams. They remain as dangerous as the day they were fired. Rounds that landed in thoroughly blasted and muddy ground often didn't encounter enough resistance to trigger the detonator. Every once in a while, a farmer manages to set one off by accident.

I have fired .30-40 Krag ammo loaded in 1917. I once accidentally fired a black powder, .38 Long Colt round and the danged thing worked just fine. The cloud of smoke as well as the odor told me what happened as I was practicing with ammo from a rusted coffee can full of odd-ball .38 SPL rounds received from an estate.

Ammo doesn't have an expiration date. What can cause ammo to go bad is leaving it in leather belt loops for long periods of time, or having brass and copper components in contact with a ferrous metal, causing an electrolytic reaction.

Even the admonition of storing ammo in a cool, dry place, may be overblown. I recovered some .22 rimfire that had been stored in a barn for decades, yet, every round fired. But, back in the 50s and earlier, paper shot shells did swell and fall apart if subjected to prolonged moisture. That must be where cool and dry originated.

When my dad passed, I was cleaning out his jeep and found a hunting belt containing a dozen rounds of .30-06 that had alternately baked and froze for at least 15 years, from when he last hunted. It took me a while to scrape off the verdigris but once clean, every round fired.

With this post, I know I'm preaching to the choir. Tomorrow, when the next poster worries about ammo longevity, refer him to this thread.
They had a show about a special Belgian unit that deals with found ordnance. Farmers typically dig them up with tractors when plowing. Some are not so lucky. Many are from ww1 and ww2

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The oldest ammo I shot was back in the 90s. It was a box of 45 hardball my dad had purchased in the 70s, maybe early 80s. So 15-25 years old.

I think the shelf life of most ammo is longer than the shelf life of most people.

Having said that, I'm not all that comfortable carrying self defense ammo that's old. I think about 3-4 years is the max that I'd be comfortable with. I know there are lots of people carrying SD ammo older than that, sometimes much older, but I like my SD ammo to be relatively "fresh." Just my personal preference, though.
 
Having said that, I'm not all that comfortable carrying self defense ammo that's old. I think about 3-4 years is the max that I'd be comfortable with. I know there are lots of people carrying SD ammo older than that, sometimes much older, but I like my SD ammo to be relatively "fresh." Just my personal preference, though.

I use handloaded ammo for everything in a 1911, but I happily used WWII GI 45 ball ammo for sd before I settled on my 'everything' handload.

I'd use the old ball ammo without a qualm if I ran out of my handloads.
 
I retired in 1997 and had a coffee can of .38, 9mm & .40 that had collected in my locker for 30 years. I took it home and eventually shot all of it and it all worked just fine.
 
Around 1962 I fired a few black powder 32-20 cartridges thru a 1873 Winchester. They fired fine.

I've fired cf cartridges that's been stored for years in extreme heat and cold. The only cartridges that I've had to not properly fire are ones that have been in contact with prolonged moisture such laying on the ground or bottom of boat.
 
I've regularly, unfortunately, left both speed strips of .38 Special or mags of 9mm in my slacks and ran them through a wash/dry cycle. They always ignite the next time I go to the firing range.

My gun club is currently issuing some FA50 M2 ball with zinc plated primers for our Garand matches. It is some of the earliest experimental non-corrosive M2 ball made. So far everything has gone bang.
 
All depends on the quality.

I had a box of Norma 110gr +P rounds for 38spl from the '80s I think. They are had noticeably different pressures while shooting until about 12rds in when one squibbed and got stuck in my Detective Special. That was the end of shooting them. I pulled the rest and re-used the bullets and cases.

They were stored fairly well and in great condition.
 
WWI artillery rounds are still being dug up in France and killing people.

In the Imperial Valley (Imperial County California) next door to AZ. out in the Chocolate Mts. a bombing range for the U S Navy people are finding ordinance and getting blown up.

I have shot 7mm Mauser ammo from the 1920's and Austrian military rounds from the 1930's which looked new and fired as if they were new. If ammo is kept or stored properly, it seems to last almost 100 years or more.
 
All depends on the quality.

I had a box of Norma 110gr +P rounds for 38spl from the '80s I think. They are had noticeably different pressures while shooting until about 12rds in when one squibbed and got stuck in my Detective Special. That was the end of shooting them. I pulled the rest and re-used the bullets and cases.

They were stored fairly well and in great condition.

Thanks for this heads-up! I have several boxes of this Norma ammo; Norma always had the reputation for being A+ in quality. As to being stuck in a 2" bbl: wow, that's a bad one!

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103
 
My experience with WW2 small arms ammo has been US and German stuff all fired as if it were made last week. On the other hand, .303 British, click-boom hangfires were not uncommon if the ammo was much over 20 years old. Had the same troubles with .380 Mk1z revolver rounds. It did not seem to matter where in the Commonwealth it came from, Radway Green was as bad as P.O.F.
 
Friend was shooting some old Federal 38 special cartridges from the 50's, they came from boxes that were in great condition. One detonated instead of just going bang. Cylinder and top strap were demolished. He called Federal and they said "We do not guarantee old ammo!"

As far as I know this is the only outfit that makes that claim.
 
A shooting buddy of mine had a whole box of loaded 1911 magazines from WWI and he brought some to the range. We fired a few mags each in our 1911s and every single round went bang! This actually proves two things, first ammo that was literally 100 years old all fired. Second and possibly more surprisingly, magazines that were fully loaded for 100 years worked flawlessly even though many shooters swear leaving magazines loaded for 6 months will ruin the springs. Remember, these springs were made 100+ years ago with old technology, not modern springs!
 
I did a mass reloading around 1994, loaded everything I had. Primers all sealed, organized in new 1 gallon and quart cans by caliber. With moisture silica gel desiccated pads inside. The cans sealed up tight and water proof. I went out of country for several years on jobs.

Around 2014 I thought I might test random loads to see if the loads and stored powders, primers still worked as planned. It all went bang.

The only dud I ever had was when I was face to face with a big angry black bear six miles into the backbush, it was a 158gr 357mag factory round made by PMC, South Korean made. I lived to never use PMC again.
 
About ten years ago I visited a friend and we hit the local range. He'd acquired some GI .45 ACP of WW2 vintage, and it was pretty bad--variations in recoil, and lots of misfire primers--say 2-3 rounds per 7 round mag. I'm pretty sure this stuff was steel case, US GI, tho my memory could be flakey.

While scarfing brass at my local range about four months ago, I came across some interesting .45 Auto cases and dud rounds. "UMC 14" and "FA 27". Oldest ammo I've handled, I think someone got into Grandpa's stash. With the number of duds to fired cases, this stuff looked about 50% bad, if the knucklehead who fired it didn't pick up any of the brass.,

I also found an abandoned box of Winchester .40 S&W, with about five dud rounds, and forty or so unfired rounds. The box looked relatively new, maybe 15 years old, with "Winclean" non-toxic primers and brass-encapsulated bullets. I tried firing them from a Sigma 40F and an AMT DAO Backup. I don't know if the 'non-toxic' primers don't age well, or what conditions that stuff was stored in, but the misfire rate was about 30 out of 40.
 
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We had a guy in our county about 5 years ago that was trying to deactivate a Civil War cannonball. His intent was to drill a hole in it and empty out the black powder.
It blew up and killed him.
That thing was at least 150 years old and had been dug out of the ground.
 
Forget all you've read! That stuff is dangerous and should be sent to me for proper disposal. No kidding.

I wasted my ill spent youth shooting surplus ammo. All we had for center fire rifles were 8mm mausers. Because we were impoverished and it was all we could afford. We ran the circuit of local gun shops, scavenging surplus german ammo. Some had funny looking letters we were told were Arabic. Who am I to doubt? We fired it all. I don't recall a dud, ever. It was military stuff, they made it to go bang, and couldn't predict the conditions.

But my guess is American commercial ammo is even better. And I have a motley collection of it. Back about 1970 I was given a box of old roll top OO buck along with the box. I did give in and shoot some of it, probably from the 1940s. My dad had a collection (family trait) of WWII 1911 mags, still filled with WWII headstamp ammo. Yes, I shot it all up too. I used to go shopping at yard sales and barn sales. I left nothing to chance, I asked if they had any old ammo.

In the 1950s I used to go with my dad when he went shooting. The empty cases I liked best were the nickel plated 22s by super X. I just liked the tiny lettering. Probably why I'm so stupid these days, the priming compound had lead staphnate. Anyway, I used to buy all that old Winchester and Super X stuff when I saw it. And never having much self control, I fired some of it. As I recall, it all went bang. Unlike current production Remington junk that you can just expect a few duds out of every hundred.

My conclusion is simple. Old ammo is just as dependable as modern stuff, maybe more so.
 
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