ASP vs DEVEL which do you like?

[OldLawman]

I have shot both, and got to handle the largest collection of Devels in the world, belonging to Wayne Novak.
Got to shoot both the ASP and Devel side-by-side with the 3913 when it came out. Overall, the 3913 was the best of the bunch. Second was the Devel - just more useful. The ASP was certainly groundbreaking when it was first introduced, but the Guttersnipe was difficult to transition to, and was not as accurate in any shooter's hands that it was passed toduring the trial.

Also had a several Detonics over the last ten years or so. Again, an interesting concept that had its time in the sun. Too heavy for such a limited capacity, and the idea that you would carry it hammer down on a live round was a poor joke.

 

[chipking]

I carried an ASP for quite a while and I really loved it. Performance was always 100% and the guttersnipe was and probably still is one of the fastest "center of mass" sights ever made. No watch the front sight or line the front up and centered in the rear. If it is in the box shoot. The only improvement I could ever imagine for it would have been tritium at the back. Always thought the clear (actually translucent) grips were kinda silly but the fit and feel were great.

--- Chip King ---

 

[led633]

Beautiful guns

My Dad was a big fan of the chopped Smiths for concealed carry in the 70s and early 80s. He has the ASP, Devel 39 and 59, and the Behlert 39 and 59.

ASP

Behlert 59, Devel 39, Devel 59

Thanks for showing these guns. Never seen them before. Kinda a S&W newbie.

 

[Cyrano]

I sure wish I could find an ASP and a Devel so I could compare them. They sure wouldn't leave my collection!!

 

[triaxle]

I picked up a ASP at a gun show for 275 with holster and 3 mags . I saw it sticking out from from stuff and kept going but stop went back for another look .The guy didnt know what it was . But I did.

 

[vipermd]

Devel-but I do not care for single or double stack 9's The one I had access to was fine, ran well

 

[18DAI]

On a historic note, both Charles Kelsey and Paris Theodore, the respective designers of the Devel and ASP pistols, were treated shabbily by S&W.

S&W suits actually purchased a Devel pistol. The story related to me, by someone who was there, was that the higher ups were amazed and startled by the Devel modified 59. A short time later, the 459 appeared in production. I'm told that Charles Kelsey, who was almost bankrupt, purchased a 459 and modified it too. He then sent the modified 459 back to the head of S&W at that time. Along with an "in your face" nasty gram.

Mr Kelsey never recieved any royalties or copywrites and little recognition for any of his very significant contributions to the design of modern handguns. He was a truly innovative designer and talented craftsman.

It is said that Theodore Paris went to S&W with his ASP pistol. He was in some financial straits at the time. He met with a cold reception by S&W executives. They reportedly regarded the ASP with a "not invented here" attitude. Then they copied his design, like they did with the Devel, and incorporated the features in their 469 pistol.

Its a shame that neither of these talented designers were ever given any support or credit by S&W. I sometimes wonder what pistols may have been had either Theodore or Kelsey been hired to work on the S&W semi auto pistols as Wayne Novak was in later years. Regards 18DAI

 

[TNRat]

I remember going to gunshows back in the 80's, & this guy always had a table full of the ASP guns. Nice guns. GARY

I remember seeing the same table, possibly at the Birmingham, AL show.

I always preferred the ASP for aesthetics reasons but also b/c I never knew what a Devel pistol was until a few years ago. This is also the reason I have always preferred the 44 Magnum to the 45 Colt since I grew up with the 44 but was never exposed to 45 Colt's until the single action market took off.

What are the values of these pistols now? How easy are they to come by? Does anyone still carry them?

How is Devel pronounced, "Devil" or "Duhvel?"

thanks for the pics.

 

[-db-]

For collectors or anyone else interested, a New Jersey consignment firm just listed a couple large lots of Paris Theodore/Seventrees materials on eBay. The stuff is rather expensive, but the photos are interesting, showing different holster prototypes, patent drawings, handguns, advertisements, etc.

 

[jyo]

I was involved in the wholsale/retail gun business way back in the early 80-mid 90s---got to handle and shoot a few of each including just one example of the Devel chopped 59---all the pistols I shot worked well---I had no fuction issues with any of them. Personally, I strongly preferred the Devel guns---I liked the finish better, and especially the sights much better. I could never really come to grips with the ASP sights---didn't work for me!

 

[igor455]

i owned an asp in the late 80 s and carried it as an off duty weapon, so i had to quall with it i idd so shooting expert even out to 25 yds, with a rain handicap and a disc l5 s1 that was due to be fused i month later. but a collector kept pestering me for i. i got off it for a 2 3913s, one walther ppk s and a sq butt mdl 36. i sold a 3913 to a haeart surgeon breother in laaw of a good friend. i used that money to but a mountain bike for me and a bike for my wife. i later traded the walther to another friend for a 3953 and some ammo. i did keep the belt holster whic fit the 3913 and the 53 great. so i got in shape and better armed all for the asp and the ocllector got a gfreat gun.
i must admit qualifying at 25 yds was a little difficult b ut i did so

 

[igor455]

oh yeah i still ahve and ride the mountain bike asnd used it go complete bike cop school the week after i turned 50

 

[xfarfuldog]

I have seen both the Devel and the ASP for sale at OGCA. I believe the seller wanted like $ 7000 for the ASP. OGCA sow is 11/17 and I will look again for this seller.

 

[WC145]

Great thread, just ran across it. I know the Devels, ASPs, and Behlerts pictured here were ground breaking but there were all 9mms. Austin Behlert also chopped .45s for those that were looking for a bit more "punch". This Behlert Bob-Cat started life as a full size Gov't Model but was reduced to just a bit smaller than a CCO. Incredible workmanship, 100% reliable.

 

[Murdock]

I just bought a ASP mag ( brand new in the plastic) off ebay for my Trapper, I am glad I did not buy the other two, while it is very well made, due to the base plate you can insert the mag in the well upside down! I still carry mine and would hate to fumble a mag change and thumb down the slide, driving it into the derlin base plate and locking up the pistol.
Mr Murphy has a way of showing up, so I try and solve as many problems before hand that I can. Any other ASP users noticed this?

I have an ASP complete with Seventrees leather by Ken Null. The magnetic mag pouch is cool enought that I have considered having Null make one for 1911 magazines. I don't carry the gun though. For one thing, it's just too expensive now. But mostly there are better choices today than there were 30 years ago.

One issue I have had with the ASP is that you really don't want to seat the magazine very hard when reloading from slide lock. This can (and does) shove the magazine so high into the mag well that the slide can't come forward. (Remember, there is no toe on the magazine floor plate to prevent this). Bad ju ju.

One thing that does chap my butt is reading statements to the effect that the M3913 is is so superior to the ASP. The 3913 is just another idea stolen by S&W after somebody else has done the lion's share of the R&D. _________________

 

[wil]

asp or devel

I have been one of the lucky ones, in my time i have had 5 asp's
2 were made from 539s, steel frame. like a dummy i sold them.
i found a 98% one last yr at a local show has the standard 39 sights on it. i like them better than the guttersnipe. its the new safe queen now. i had 2 standard devels, and 1 full house.all were 98%. i have to say that both guns have there air of ultra cool about them
i would be hard pressed to pick just one. but if i had to i would go with a standard devel. has the factory sights, wood grips round trigger guard
ect, just suits my taste. just my 2 cents.

 

[Hopper13]

Full House Model 59 Devil

I just dug out my old Devil. It's been sitting in a climate controlled safety deposit box for about 25 years now. The gun is is fabulous condition with no more than a few hundred rounds through it, but is missing one Devil badge and one screw from the right grip.

I'm not sure whether to keep it or sell it. Can anyone give me an idea of the current value?

Thanks in advance,

Richard

 

[Gryff]

I just dug out my old Devil. It's been sitting in a climate controlled safety deposit box for about 25 years now. The gun is is fabulous condition with no more than a few hundred rounds through it, but is missing one Devil badge and one screw from the right grip.

I'm not sure whether to keep it or sell it. Can anyone give me an idea of the current value?

Hard to say. There is a full size one on Gunbroker right with a starting price of $1500.

I'm told that Richard Heinie is an avid collector of Devels and ASPs. You might trying contacting him.

 

[WC145]

I just dug out my old Devil. It's been sitting in a climate controlled safety deposit box for about 25 years now. The gun is is fabulous condition with no more than a few hundred rounds through it, but is missing one Devil badge and one screw from the right grip.

I'm not sure whether to keep it or sell it. Can anyone give me an idea of the current value?

Thanks in advance,

Richard

$2500 or more.

 

[Hopper13]

Thanks guys. At those kinds of prices, I might be tempted to sell.

Mine is in overall better condition judging by the pitting on th barrel of the on on GB. It has some slight holster wear as I did carry it off and on for a year or so, but it's overall a remarkably clean weapon.