"Battle" rifle discussion ...

I've owned a lot of AR's thru the years and feel comfortable
with one so that is what i'd grab personally. Just as in a hunting
situation you would be best served to grab something familiar
and comfortable and a rifle you can hit what your shooting at.
No bad choices here. Just like favorite ice cream flavors.
Shoot whatever you shoot the best. All the downrange power
in the world won't help you if you can't hit whats coming after
you.

Chuck
 
AQBill said:
I'm kicking it old school with my .303 Enfields starting with my WWI version (No.1 Mk.III) and then moving up through my WWII Enfields (No.4 Mk. I) and finally my No.5 Mk.1 Jungle Carbine. Will be working on my "mad minute" skills... The old "smellies" are quite the battle rifle with a great pedigree.
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I'm with you. The rifle I trust in is my No.4 Mk 1 with the barrel cut to 20 inches. I carefully regulated the battle sight with small washers until it hits right above the front sight at 100 yds with my favorite 180 grain loads.
 
A few years back I'd said anything but an AR. I still prefer wood and steel for class and shooting, but the AR has proven itself to me.

It's hard for me to fault the aluminum and plastic that I once cussed.

I now own more AR platform long guns of various calibers and sizes than any other type.
 
Given the parameters outlined, i.e., urban unrest, rioting etc., I'd just reach over to the end of the couch and pick up my M-1 Garand. I carry it every morning when jogging/walking. It is about as light and easy to manage as anyone could want. Stuff it full of some nice M-2 AP and put a roll of duck tape in your pocket. You'll be able to fix just about anything you might end up facing!

In fact, if the truth be told, for a actual urban meltdown type situation, a 15-22 and a backpack full of loaded magazines would also work real well. After all, in a urban environment distance is not going to be the problem. Most folks are not going to want to stand up and take a round. With a 15-22 you could put accurate fire onto a target and carry a pile of ammo while running, ducking or anything else that might be necessary. Of course the smart thing would be to take that 15-22 or whatever rifle you were going to use and go to ground, i.e., get out of sight and stay out of sight.

If the situation is something more like Red Dawn 2.0, then I'd grab the M-1 and all the ammo I could carry. Soon as I found a loose AK-47... I'd swap for it and resupply with ammo from folks who no longer needed it.
 
Much like hand guns, I think it would be wise to first consider how you will use a battle rifle.

Probably the most important consideration is distance. If you live on some acreage, and can see your attackers coming from a distance and of course knowing that they are a threat I would choose a larger more effective caliber. The weight of the weapon would not be a factor for most.

It would be easy to leave that rifle and transition to a lighter one if they close the distance.

The ability of the user and tactics will determine the outcome. And those will differ from person to person.

There aren't too many "one size fits all rifles" out there in both caliber, size and weight but I think an AR in 7.62 x 39 or 308 would be ideal.
 
GyMac said:
I'm with you. The rifle I trust in is my No.4 Mk 1 with the barrel cut to 20 inches. I carefully regulated the battle sight with small washers until it hits right above the front sight at 100 yds with my favorite 180 grain loads.
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Can you post a pic? Which 180 grain load do you use? I like Winchester, but can't really say it works any better than Remington or Norma. I wish that Federal would load factory .303 with Nosler Partition bullets. I think Federal still loads .303 but I haven't seen any in years.

Keep spare exractor springs on hand for Enfields. I've had a couple break. Those are old rifles and some wartime parts may not have received the best heat treating .
 
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I own 160 acres. I can pretty much see 1/2 to 1 mile in any direction.

My Colt AR 6601. It is well scoped, plenty of ammo, reliable and accurate.

I would like to have a 6920 for running and gunning if needed.

For the window port I'll keep my pre 64 Model 70 in 270 Win or my 300 WBY handy. Someone above said most folks can't hit past 150 yards. They may be right but I have a couple of rifles that can make me look like a better shot.

With these two rifles one would be 350-400 yards short of the 150 yard marker at demise time.

Close to the door is shotgun and buckshot time.

All the old antique battle rifles from 110 plus years ago, you know the ones that replaced the single shot Martini's and Trapdoor Springfield's, that have to be manually operated with a bolt may have been good in a trench for a rifle squad but today's battle ground is drastically different. Peek around a corner, shoot, jerk back turn the bolt, peek back. There is a high probability the gent with the semi auto that reloads all on it's own will probably be set for the 2nd shot.

Hunting or ambushing a few insurgents might be a bolt thing but the Garand did prove to be the best battle rifle which further solidifies the semi auto theory. Make mine an AR in 5.56 or a Garand or a plain old Browning sporting rifle in 308, 30-06 or 270 Win.
 
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Weight and maneuverability are the issues when you are caught in urban unrest. With the possible exception of the SOCOM any 7.62/.30 cal caliber rifle is just going to be too big and heavy for use over an extended period. Remember you also have to carry the ammo, as well as the gun. One thing in favour of a weapon in that class is that it reduces much of the "cover" in the US to "concealment".

An intermediate caliber weapon like the AK, AR or SKS makes more sense weight wise. They won't punch through brick like a heavier round, but they'll do a number on cars and stucco homes. Even 5.56 with the right ammo and a proper length barrel will penetrate quite well.
 
POU, POU,POU... that is what it all boils down to. And while I think the 308 battle rifle is a great tool, the ergonomics of the AR make is a better overall platform when combined with a 308 bolt gun for the long distance stuff. Add a 9mm Glock and you are ready for any civil disturbance.
 
The older I get the lighter I like them. Ed Heineman, designer of the A-4 Skyhawk claimed that in designing the plane his goal was to "simplify and add lightness". The man had a point. So these days an AR with lightweight everything seems a good idea.
 
Trying to defend a position is a losing proposition - staying on the move is a best bet especially when you are familiar with the area. I'd have to say the weakly little .22 rim fire with standard velocity ammo. If the bad guys are at 300 yards I'm thinking a flanking move and use surprise and cover. A kill at 300 yards with a battle rifle will give them the idea to flank you. Unless you have enough buddies to help watch all directions your cooked one on a few.
 
trap4570 said:
Trying to defend a position is a losing proposition - staying on the move is a best bet especially when you are familiar with the area. I'd have to say the weakly little .22 rim fire with standard velocity ammo. If the bad guys are at 300 yards I'm thinking a flanking move and use surprise and cover. A kill at 300 yards with a battle rifle will give them the idea to flank you. Unless you have enough buddies to help watch all directions your cooked one on a few.
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A lot to be said for a 22. Much more versatile than larger calibers. That said, it's not much of a battle rifle. My AR's the obvious choice. It's what I depended on in Vietnam and would be the one I'd grab first. With other calibers ammo could become hard to find. 223 will be available, by hook or crook.
 
Donn said:
A lot to be said for a 22. Much more versatile than larger calibers. That said, it's not much of a battle rifle. My AR's the obvious choice. It's what I depended on in Vietnam and would be the one I'd grab first. With other calibers ammo could become hard to find. 223 will be available, by hook or crook.
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A man can get a LOT of 22lr ammo in his pocket!
 
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