Best "J" frame

[fchretireddet]

I've normally carrying a 640-3 (with the internal lock) in a Don Hume belt holster and two speed loaders-one in each front pocket. The ammunition (furnished by my PD) is Speer Gold-dot 135 gr JHP .38+P. It isn't the lightest, but it conceals well, and is solid, secure, and accurate.
Good luck in any of your choices.

 

[reppans]

Best "J" frame

I'll put another vote in for the 638, shrouded hammer. SA option for longer shot accuracy, no snag draw, shoot from inside pocket. Exposed hammer is a simple visual, or tactile, guarantee of condition, and ability to feel/control hammer through reholstering, is another guarantee the trigger is not snagging on a shirt, or crease in the holster.

An SS 649, 357 is on my list as well .

 

[JJEH]

Best "J" frame

Not sure what's the best... but I really like the 360 TALO; exposed hammer, all black, shoots .357 and .38+P. But I can neither find one nor afford one. So my 442 has to work for now

[S&W 442-2, Jason Winnie J101, Buffalo Bore 20D/20 150gr. hard cast wad cutter, Peerless 730C, Safariland CH7, S&W Special Ops, 5.11 ATAC]

 

[Lobster Picnic]

JJEH, I like the all-black rig. How do you like the BB 150gr hard cast wadcutters? I have them in my steel house gun but haven't tried them in an alloy J-frame.

 

[Mister X]

SA option for longer shot accuracy, no snag draw, shoot from inside pocket. Exposed hammer is a simple visual, or tactile, guarantee of condition, and ability to feel/control hammer through reholstering

An SS 649, 357 is on my list as well .

Longer range accuracy? In what realistic and probable civilian scenario would it be a good idea to cock your revolver to single action and in what circumstances would you need long range accuracy?

Is there somehow ever a confusion over the condition of the hammer condition of an enclosed hammer DAO revolver?

A 12 lb trigger doesn't provide sufficient safety against AD's/ND's during pocketing or reholstering?

 

[reppans]

Best "J" frame

Longer range accuracy? In what realistic and probable civilian scenario would it be a good idea to cock your revolver to single action and in what circumstances would you need long range accuracy?



Is there somehow ever a confusion over the condition of the hammer condition of an enclosed hammer DAO revolver?



A 12 lb trigger doesn't provide sufficient safety against AD's/ND's during pocketing or reholstering?

Long range? A mass shooting scenario comes to mind - if you haven't been shot immediately, perhaps you've found some cover while still some distance away. While the shooter is busy systematically executing those closest, perhaps you have a chance to take less hurried long shot (relative to a small CCW anyway) from your covered position... maybe even at the shooter's feet from under cars/furniture/etc.

Appendix carry works best for me for deep concealment, but I have a problem carrying my Glock there (pointing at my junk and femoral artery) with a round chambered. Sure, in theory, the striker-fired action is only "half cocked," and there's multiple safeties around the system, but I'm relying on mechanical things that can fail/I can't see, and I know I've put potential energy into the system by racking the slide.

The DAO revolver is much better in that there is (should be) no potential energy in the system, but physical verification that my hammer is resting on the transfer bar is just a bit of extra of piece of mind.

This is from a Policemag.com article on AD (clicky)

On those weapons that have external hammers, the revolver trick of placing the thumb on the hammer for safety when holstering works. If the hammer is rising, then the trigger has snagged.

Most revolvers have heavy trigger draws... why would this be a relatively common "trick" (it's mentioned plenty of places) if heavy trigger draws were the answer to the problem?

Don't get me wrong, I think all the J models are great, depending upon what your priorities are. I just think the shrouded-hammer humpback models happens to blend the best advantages of both internal and external hammered versions, yet without retaining either's biggest disadvantages, save, arguably, aesthetics and pocket lint .

 

[JJEH]

JJEH, I like the all-black rig. How do you like the BB 150gr hard cast wadcutters? I have them in my steel house gun but haven't tried them in an alloy J-frame.

Thank you. The holster is a Jason Winnie J101, I love his stuff; it looks good, it is sturdy and it feels like it lasts forever!

Regarding the ammo, I love it. It's standard pressure but still very powerful and I sure as heck don't want to get shot with it. I also have the OUTDOORSMAN which utilizes a 158 gr. Hard Cast Keith SWC bullet. It's a +P round and has a larger kick than the before mentioned cartridge.

 

[joe44va]

Buffalo Bore makes a .357 with a 125HP at 1225 fpm. Might be worth trying in a j-frame. $30 for 20 though.

 

[ST BERNARD]

Still haven't found anything not to like about this one.

 

[mikestripe]

''J'' frame

Found a nice new 60-14 today for a good price, done some trading with a 380 bodyguard, brought the 60-14 home with me, hope to shoot it this weekend. Need a good leather OWB holster for it, what do you guys recommend.

 

[petepeterson]

Longer range accuracy? In what realistic and probable civilian scenario would it be a good idea to cock your revolver to single action and in what circumstances would you need long range accuracy?

Is there somehow ever a confusion over the condition of the hammer condition of an enclosed hammer DAO revolver?

A 12 lb trigger doesn't provide sufficient safety against AD's/ND's during pocketing or reholstering?

When did having options become a bad thing?

 

[Mister X]

When did having options become a bad thing?

Sometimes adding an option that really isn't advantageous causes you to lose actual advantages or causes problems. Such is the case here.

The probability of needing to make a precision long range shot with a snub revolver in a civilian self-defense scenario is astronomically low. Even if you did, you can still get it done virtually as well double action if you know how to properly work a double action trigger. So all you gain by having single action capability is being able to make long range precision shots slightly easier.


However, by gaining the option of single action, you lose...

1. A better double action trigger.

2. a snag free draw

3. the ability to fire from inside a pocket or purse.

4. grip options, specifically any where you take a high grasp on the back of frame. Such holds effectively lower bore axis, allowing for greater control and faster follow up shots.

5. ECQ advantages such as no hammer to be obstructed or blocked during a disarm attempt or close-quarter entanglement.

6. protection against claims you cocked the gun creating a hair as well as no concerns you actually will. If you are practicing firing single action at the range, you very well may cock it under the stress and pressure of a real defense scenario. I witnessed this personally watching my wife panic and go through this during what we thought was an attempted break-in with her model 60. I sold it the next day and got her a 640.

A bodyguard model rendered DAO has many of the same advantages as the centennial although not the same efficiency in ECQ scenarios since there still is a hammer that could be possibly be blocked. Grip options are still limited as well. Plus you have concerns of lint, crud, debris getting down in the action. The only benefit being able to check for high primers and perhaps a slight degree of greater safety during reholstering which aren't much of an added benefit IMO, especially considering having to have the gun worked on to render it DAO plus the DA trigger still won't be as good as the Centennials.

 

[Kadonny]

Sometimes adding an option that really isn't advantageous causes you to lose actual advantages or causes problems. Such is the case here.

The probability of needing to make a precision long range shot with a snub revolver in a civilian self-defense scenario is astronomically low. Even if you did, you can still get it done virtually as well double action if you know how to properly work a double action trigger. So all you gain by having single action capability is being able to make long range precision shots slightly easier.


However, by gaining the option of single action, you lose...

1. A better double action trigger.

2. a snag free draw

3. the ability to fire from inside a pocket or purse.

4. grip options, specifically any where you take a high grasp on the back of frame. Such holds effectively lower bore axis, allowing for greater control and faster follow up shots.

5. ECQ advantages such as no hammer to be obstructed or blocked during a disarm attempt or close-quarter entanglement.

6. protection against claims you cocked the gun creating a hair as well as no concerns you actually will. If you are practicing firing single action at the range, you very well may cock it under the stress and pressure of a real defense scenario. I witnessed this personally watching my wife panic and go through this during what we thought was an attempted break-in with her model 60. I sold it the next day and got her a 640.

A bodyguard model rendered DAO has many of the same advantages as the centennial although not the same efficiency in ECQ scenarios since there still is a hammer that could be possibly be blocked. Grip options are still limited as well. Plus you have concerns of lint, crud, debris getting down in the action. The only benefit being able to check for high primers and perhaps a slight degree of greater safety during reholstering which aren't much of an added benefit IMO, especially considering having to have the gun worked on to render it DAO plus the DA trigger still won't be as good as the Centennials.

Totally agree. If I can only own one J frame, it's a 642/442 all day long. It's the only gun I own that I can carry no matter what I am wearing....and I shoot it really well. I love that gun.

 

[johnnywitt]

"The snub revolver is an experts gun."

I've heard that expression repeated probably hundreds of time. Whether it's true or false depends on context and perspective.

If you are solely concerned with personal defense, then it's completely false. The reason being is nearly all civilian self-defense scenarios take place at very close distances. It's rare for them to venture past even 3-5 yards and I don't think it takes an expert to get hits at bad breath distances. Plus the hammerless snub revolver has numerous ECQ advantages no other weapon can match.

Now if talking about target or bullseye shooting or the ability to make multiple quick and precise hits at 15 or 20 yards, then I would agree it's indeed an experts gun, but such marksmanship ability is not realistically ever going to be a probability in civilian self-defense.

Yep!

Most Folks don't really look at how actual CCW Shootings go down and what the ranges they take place at and that by the time they realize that the are actually going to have to use their weapon the attacker likely already is in spitting distance or even has their hands on you.
If you just pull your weapon out while you are outside of your domicile and use it on somebody that's 7 or more yards away, you might have some 'splainin' to do.

 

[Rubone]

I like them all. To me the best one is whichever I have with me at a given time...

 

[reppans]

Best "J" frame

I like them all. To me the best one is whichever I have with me at a given time...

Curious if the frame under the grip is the same on all your models? ie, can you swap the 2-finger and 3-finger grips freely? Is that a 649 second from bottom?

 

[Rubone]

They are all standard round butt frames. The second up is a model 60 I bought in about '77. The grips are Bianchi and the shroud is only in the grips. The 36 with combats I just picked up. the top is a 637 with a set of Crimson Trace Laser grips that lives in my wife's car. The 638 NL is a gem. All are great shooters. My wife put 530 rounds through the 60 in a defensive course last year in two short range sessions and out shot about everyone else there with their plastic 9s, 40s, and such...

 

[reppans]

... out shot about everyone else there with their plastic 9s, 40s, and such...

Sounds about right... in my hands, all my Smith revolvers outshoot all my plastic guns, even with less: sight radius, barrel length, and weight.

 

[RONALD HENSLEY]

the only j-frame i own, performance center wyatt deep cover 637

 

[mg357]

I suggest the S&W Model 36 .38 caliber revolver and the S&W Model 649 .357 magnum revolver. The model 649 shoots the .357 magnum cartridge and the .38 special

While the model 36 only shoots the .38 special cartridge in fact if you can find both guns and can afford them buy them both.

the model 36 could be carried in the winter time and the 649 could be carried in the spring and the summer.