Bizarre computer problem. EDIT Fixed I think.

[LVSteve]

I have two computers in the den, an old PIII running XP and a much newer machine using Vista Home 64. Both are connected to my cable modem by a wireless router. The other week the USB modem on the new computer died, so I bought a new modem.

Now, about every 2nd or 3rd time I boot up the new machine, its Internet connection fails. BUT, if I then start up the old machine and allow it to connect, then magically the link to the new machine "wakes up". I have tried ipconfig /renew and that did not work. I got a message saying that the computer was unable to find the DHCP.

The other "fix" is to reboot the cable modem. What is baffling me is that the wireless router is between the computer and the cable modem, so how can it "sense" which computer is there and decide not to talk to it.

Baffled of Las Vegas

SEE POST #20 BELOW

 

[iouri]

Check if there's a "connect on demand" setting on your modem; those "demands" might be served differently by XP and Vista. For me it is not a problem, cause my router is in "always on" mode.

 

[LVSteve]

Check if there's a "connect on demand" setting on your modem; those "demands" might be served differently by XP and Vista. For me it is not a problem, cause my router is in "always on" mode.

I'll have a look for that setting. My wireless router is always on as is the cable modem. I do shut down the computers, though.

 

[SweetMK]

I'll have a look for that setting. My wireless router is always on as is the cable modem. I do shut down the computers, though.

Luckily my son-in-law stopped for a visit when my computer was doing that.

It turns out that most wireless routers only have a couple year lifespan!!

He popped a new router in my system, everything is great!! We have 3 computers, the new router really made everything go faster!! AND, no more disconnects!!

We went whole hog, and bought a ASUS RT N66U,

Newegg.com - ASUS RT-N66U Dual-Band Wireless-N900 Gigabit Router, DD-WRT Open Source support, IEEE 802.11a/b/g/n, IEEE 802.3/3u/3ab

it performs so well, my son-in-law went home and replaced his!! Seldom I get to out do my son-in-law, at least I was ahead for a week!!

The computers now run like they are wired!!

 

[LVSteve]

Luckily my son-in-law stopped for a visit when my computer was doing that.

It turns out that most wireless routers only have a couple year lifespan!!

Been there, done that with my old router. When the cable guy came out to check everything he was dumbstruck as mine was the second example of that type of router to die.

I think my router is OK as the old computer connects first time on 99.9% occasions. I am convinced this is a peculiarity of this machine/USB modem combo. The old Netgear USB modem was an old type you cannot get anymore and mine actually lasted longer than most when I checked on Newegg.

 

[zoom6zoom]

Could be an address conflict.
Check that your router is acting as a DHCP server and giving each machine a different IP address.

 

[LouisianaJoe]

Check to see if your old USB wireless is still defined. Your PC may need to timeout on the old adapter before trying to connect using your new one. If the old one is there, delete it. You may need to use the device manager to do this.

 

[LVSteve]

Check to see if your old USB wireless is still defined. Your PC may need to timeout on the old adapter before trying to connect using your new one. If the old one is there, delete it. You may need to use the device manager to do this.

Nope. I uninstalled the old USB wireless before connecting up the new device. The Device Manager says I was successful.

One thing I did note in the IP properties is that in the connection properties it stated that the preferred IPv4 IP Address was 192.168.1.2. I think that is because when I first set it up the other computer was running and so 192.168.1.2 was the first available address. If I start the new machine BEFORE the old one, Il wonder if the router is saying 192.168.1.1 is available but the modem software (Registry entry?) is saying no, I want to start at 192.168.1.2.

Uninstall and reinstall with the old machine off will follow shortly. Can't hurt.

Oh, why did I just say that!

 

[J Rich]

Have you tried hooking directly to the router via ethernet cable? Have you tried going directly from computer to modem? That's how I figured out my wireless router was bad.

 

[LVSteve]

Have you tried hooking directly to the router via ethernet cable? Have you tried going directly from computer to modem? That's how I figured out my wireless router was bad.

No, but the old computer hooks up just fine via wireless. I suspect the timing of the new (Belkin) USB modem and the timing of the router are not playing well together.

I reloaded the Belkin driver and attempted to connect and it came up with "Limited Connectivity" meaning no Internet and a DHCP not accessible. When I fired up the old machine the new one with the Belkin sprang into life after the old one made its connection. It is like the new machine and its new modem are a puppy and cannot do anything without the old dog.

For my next trick I may try static IPs for the two computers. However, that will have to wait a day or three as I have stuff to do, like make a sandwich for dinner.

Thanks to all.

 

[LouisianaJoe]

Change it to "Obtain an IP address automatically". Also some wireless routers use 192.168.0.1 and may be looking for an IP address with a 0 in the 3rd position of the IP address. The manual for the router should answer this question. Even if you want to specify a specific address, try this anyway to see what it assigns to you. You can see what it assigns to you by selecting Run and CMD. Then run ipconfig from the CMD window. The Default Gateway IP address is the one for the router.

Another thing. You can configure the router to use a specific range of IP addresses.

Check your services to make sure that the "Computer Browser" service is running. It may be that it is running on the other PC and that is what is making your PC "Wake Up"

 

[cmort666]

Sounds like the one that's not connecting might be set to "ad hoc", instead of "infrastructure". If it is, change to the latter.

 

[LVSteve]

Sounds like the one that's not connecting might be set to "ad hoc", instead of "infrastructure". If it is, change to the latter.

I'll poke around and see if it had such a setting. My other computer with a different modem and software has it, but it is not up front on the new machine.

Last night I powered down everything including the wireless router and cable modem. It connected fine last night after 10 minutes off so I left everything on except the computer. When I started the computer this morning it connected up right away. I wonder if the router had something lurking in its volatile memory from the old USB modem and last night's efforts cleared it. We shall see.

One other thought. We had a power glitch at the house not long ago and I wonder if it was enough to put the router or the cable modem "on edge" for want of a better phrase.

 

[LVSteve]

Ad Hoc vs Infrastructure

I cannot find this explicitly in the network settings for the new computer and new modem. However, there is an option buried in the Wireless Connection Properties for allowing "Internet Connection Sharing" whereby another computer can connect directly to the machine. That sounds like Ad Hoc by any other name and I have it VERY firmly disabled.

 

[MO_mule]

LVSteve:

May be a long shot but have you got the latest driver(s) installed for the modem? My work laptop kept dropping the wireless signal and updating the wireless driver has made the wireless connection extremely reliable.

You done good by disabling Ad Hoc connections!

HTH,

Chris

 

[LVSteve]

The drivers are up to date. I will try a few more shut-downs and restarts before saying the problem has really gone away. It is 2 for 2 working OK since I rebooted the router so we shall see.

 

[J Rich]

LVSteve

I am not that computer savvy, and I probably can't fix your problem. I my search for a new router and such. I found belkin products to be slow and unreliable. Went with netgear I think it's a 700. I got it at best buy, and explained my problems to the sales guy. Best buy sell belkin and netgear. They are about the same price. The sales guy pick the netgear over the belkin. He seemed pretty knowledgeable, and isn't paid on commission. I couldn't be happier with netgear.



Fixed my post- I am NOT computer savvy!

 

[LouisianaJoe]

I cannot find this explicitly in the network settings for the new computer and new modem. However, there is an option buried in the Wireless Connection Properties for allowing "Internet Connection Sharing" whereby another computer can connect directly to the machine. That sounds like Ad Hoc by any other name and I have it VERY firmly disabled.

Here is a good explanation of Ad Hoc vs Infrastructure: Wireless Network Architectures | Louie Wong

If you have a wireless router, then you must have your adapters set to Infrastructure. Most default to that.

Look at the IPv4 properties. You have 2 options:
1 - Obtain address automatically or
2 - Use the following address.
You must use the same option for all PC's on the network.

If you use option 1, then your router must be set up as a DHCP Server with a range of IP addresses to assign.

If you use option 2 then you must have the Default gateway IP address set in the router and specified the same in each PC.

If you want to share files between the PC's then they must have the same Workgroup name.

There is a service named "Computer Browser" that will try to identify other PC's on the network. If it is not running on your PC, then other PC's may discover you, but you will not discover them first. When you start you PC, there can be a delay before discovery if the service is not running.

Unless there is a device that must use a specific IP address, it is easier to get everything connected by having a router that is a DHCP server and all other PC's and devices use option 1.

You should also set up a security key in the router so that drive by PC's and neighbors can not connect to your network and see your stuff. You must initially connect to the router from each PC by specifying the key on the PC connecting to the router.

 

[LVSteve]

LouisianaJoe

The Belkin USB modem running on the Vista machine never says Ad Hoc or Infrastructure explicitly, but it does have "Internet Connection Sharing"which I have disabled.

Everything in the IPv4 properties is set up for obtaining the addressing from the router. The router checks out as being set up as a DHCP server, too.

As for security, not only am I running WPA-2 with AES but I have configured the router to only accept the MAC addresses of my two machines. If Mr Hacker is smart enough to get through that lot, I was never going to keep him out anyway. As for freeloaders on my bandwidth, not on my watch.

I shall see if all is well again with the next few computer restarts. If the router picks the new machine up every time from now on, that's fine, even if I am unsure how I cured it.

 

[LVSteve]

I think my issue is fixed. Since flushing the router by a power recycle the connection has come up every time.

One thing I have also done in all this is to delete the old versions of Java on my computers. That has had a noticeable effect on Firefox in the new computer and Opera on the old one as both browsers now run a bit quicker. Interesting.