Can anybody explain this picture?

[Askeladden]

Found this while searching the interwebs. The second revolver from the top is supposed to be a third model 38, but it has the same latch as a .32 first model.

 

[glowe]

Here is what I can make out. First gun is a 2nd Model, the second gun is a 4th Model, and the third is either a 4th or 5th Model, while the last is a 5th Model. Those with a pinned front sight were made before 1908 and the second 38 Safety has a pinned sight. Some very early 5th Models also have pinned sights, most likely from using left-over 4th Model barrels. One thing for sure is that there are no numbered models there, since model numbers did not come out until 1957-1958.

Where is the photo from?

I found the photo and it shows up on page 157 of Smith & Wesson Handguns, by Roper, but there is no caption that shows any Model number? Interesting though, but the third gun is called a 4th Model by Roper. It could be a 5th, but without the serial number, can't tell? One thing for sure is a mistake in ID was made on the second gun. It is actually a 4th Model and not a 3rd as Roper states. The 3rd has a push button latch.

I am still looking at the Roper picture and the second gun latch is not correct for a 3rd Model?? The frame of the 3rd Model did not reach the frame and a very pronounced push button latch sits at the rear of the top frame, but the image does not show either???

 

[opoefc]

Roper's book on S&Ws is full of errors, this being one of many. He had a problem with alcohol so maybe he did his own proof reading. Ed.

 

[rct269]

Roper's book on S&Ws is full of errors, this being one of many. He had a problem with alcohol so maybe he did his own proof reading. Ed.

I'd heard it was McHenry who had a problem with alcohol----Roper too?

That aside, Ed's 100% correct--------the book is loaded with errors. It was my first---many years ago. I digested it thoroughly---and thought I was well versed on the topic.

Surprise! Surprise!! Surprise!!!

Ralph Tremaine

 

[glowe]

. . . It was my first---many years ago. I digested it thoroughly---and thought I was well versed on the topic . . . Surprise

I still look at McHenry's and Roper's book as a ground breaking effort on the S&W gun production history. Smith & Wesson Handguns (1958) was published about the same time as Parson's book (1957) and nothing of substance preceded either book.

I would have hated to try to publish the first definitive work to provide accurate information when research had to mostly be done by mail and only occasionally by phone. That could have been enough to lead a man to drink. As Ralph stated, at the time one was considered well versed if they learned the information from these books. How much have collectors learned in the last 60 years? Heck, the corrections sheet for Nahas & Supic's SCSW3 is 3 pages long.

 

[rct269]

My edition was purchased before 1958, and published in 1945----------------same book?

Ralph Tremaine

And as respects possible research obstacles, am I not correct Roper was employed by S&W------starting in 1920 (thereabouts??)---leaving I don't know when (??)---and having advanced to the rank of a vice president (??)?

 

[glowe]

Ralph, it should be the same book. Interesting that the copy I have does not reference the earlier publication date. It simply says Copyright 1958, with no edition reference. Mine has the red dust jacket and was $7.50 new.

Does your 1945 copy have a dust jacket?

 

[rct269]

Once upon a time, yes---it had a dust jacket---now gone the way of many fragile things.

And my copy is gone to a new home-----offered here free (with fair warning as to its failings)-----and it was snapped up more or less immediately.

RT

 

[Askeladden]

Where is the photo from?

Right click the photo and copy link location.

I haven't seen any photos of similar .38 safety hammerless revolvers with the same type latch other than on the first model .32s.

It is interesting how they went back and forth with the latch on these models and later on settled with the earlier type as on the double actions... so i was thinking that this might be some experimental model?