Can you I/D this Webley for me?

[gunbarrel]

Here is a bit of trivia for fellow forum members not familiar with British military articles like British Commando (Fairbairn Sykes) knives and firearms. The proper name for the "broad arrow" mark indicating British government ownership is "pheon." It used to be really easy to tell if the pheon was real or hand-scratched, but as we develop; so do the crooks. There are shops that specialize in military replicas where you can buy a broad arrow stamp that you can use to deceit. Buyers Beware!

 

[desi2358]

Not surprised to see fake Broad Arrow stamps make an appearance. They've been faking WWII German marks for years and faking the Mums on Japanese rifles. You can buy fake stamps for US WWII guns as well to make that "all correct" M1 Carbine or Garand. They've even been selling reproductions of early Carbine parts to "restore" all those post war updated guns to wartime specs.

 

[.455_Hunter]

I have a couple MK VI examples and a commercial MK III- all still in .455. The earlier MK III was sold by the Army Navy Cooperative Society to whom I suspect was a new junior officer headed to Africa or India in the Omdurman or Boer War timeframe. I had the cylinder throats on my 1918 MK VI opened to match the barrel groove diameter since we are no longer trying to get fussy charges of cordite to ignite. As my user name suggests, I have much appreciation for the platform.

 

[Golddollar]

Not surprised to see fake Broad Arrow stamps make an appearance. They've been faking WWII German marks for years and faking the Mums on Japanese rifles. You can buy fake stamps for US WWII guns as well to make that "all correct" M1 Carbine or Garand. They've even been selling reproductions of early Carbine parts to "restore" all those post war updated guns to wartime specs.

I would think it would be a little tough to restore the half of the serial number that got shaved off the cylinder.

 

[desi2358]

I would think it would be a little tough to restore the half of the serial number that got shaved off the cylinder.

Yeah, that would be a bit harder to manage. I doubt a faker would use one on a shaved revolver, the majority of which are already stamped on the frame and/or barrel. Would have to bring the cylinder back to original specs or find an uncut replacement (not easy, I've looked for one before). More likely the stamp is being sold (as the fake US ones have been) to "restore" worn stamps on a firearm. Which calls originality into question as well as being an issue when people use them to mark other items such as rifle stocks, accessories, field gear, etc. to pass them off as original military issue.

 

[CMudrock]

She has great bore and cylinders, and the grips are intact. So, I took a chance. Those are standard Federal HS .45acps in the pic. Is this thing in .455 Webley, or does it need/take moon clips? THanks!

IT DOES NOT LOOK SHAVED TO ME.
I owned a couple of shaved .45acp MKVI's, & a distressed shaved MKIV, That had been sold off by British Police to a USA dealer. Someone had cut & bent the frames grip strap to make it easier to conceal before confiscation. A wad of Electricians tape passed as grips. Mechanically function was excellent. I took the time & TLC to weld the frame strap & make walnut grips to fit. I was rewarded with the worlds heaviest pocket revolver, which worked well with FULL MOON CLIPS. However; the same previous owner - filed down the front sight. making it useful only as a Belly Gun. For all its faults, It was the last of my Webley's I sold, when I could afford more practical ordinance.

They did cause me to buy 3 H&R Top Break Revolvers, that are more practical & Keepers.

 

[Bob A.]

It always makes me sad to see a shaved Webley. Right off the bat you've cut the value by at least 50%; much more depending on condition and rarity.


I have a Mk V and MK VI uncut; both have 4" barrels, which is unusual for the MK VI. I also have a MK VI with a 22 cal insert kit, which is pretty cool. I've been looking for a WWI-era MK VI uncut, but the prices have risen considerably.


I'd also like a Webley-Fosbery Auromatic Revolver, which are fascinating. The barrel/cylinder slides in the frame to advance the cyl and cock the hammer. It has a safety and has to be carried cocked and locked to be useful. They're remarkably accurate and quick to reload if you can find one of the old cartridge carriers made for the gun. Not likely to be able to afford it, though.

 

[2152hq]

My MkVI is unaltered and I picked it up at a gun show yrs ago.
A young State Trooper was walking around with it for sale. I knew him casually from the shows and he brought it over. He said it was left to him by his Gfather who was in WW1 in a "Scottish Group of some kind" (his words).
Great sense of family history there. Selling the revolver for Beer & Pizza money I guess.
It wasn't a HiCap 9mm, so it was of no interest to him.
I get that,,kind of,,maybe.

I offered him $65 for it. Then he did the I'll shop it around thing on me.
Well, he did come back about 2 hrs later and asked if I still wanted it.
He said he didn't get any offers on it,,none.

I took it at the price I offered which even at the time was a decent deal.
Still have it.
1918 dated revolver w/a Brit holster, maker marked London 1912.

I thought it was odd that no one else in the rather large show had snagged it,,but I was happy. Still am.

I've had a couple shaved MkII and a MkIV,
Shot them with BP sub loads. Great shooters and fun for sure.
Wish I had kept one of those along with a 1930's mfg Enfield No2MkI 38.

I loaded some of those BP sub .45acp rounds into a 1914 mfg Colt 1911.
They worked just fine in there too.
Not a big deal with cleaning,,just water a bit of soap in it, dry and oil.

 

[oldcorps76]

I'll add my 2 cents, as someone who looked hard and found an uncut Webley Mk VI, that revolver has definitely *not* been "cut" for .45 ACP. The whole-serial-number on the cylinder is the verification.

I bought a mold from a guy in Slovenia for the original .455 265 gr RN Eley. Then I found New Service refurb in .455. I love the caliber, shoot the home-cast bullet over 4.6 gr Unique. You might be able to use the .455 from MP Molds with Starline .455 brass.

455 Webley (Mk2), HB, 4 cavity mold - MP-molds

 

[VictorLouis]

Thank you all for the outstanding feedback on this one.

The broad-arrow is intact on the face of the cylinder.

The s/n is also intact along the side of the cylinder. (Thank you 22lrfan)
However, it clearly does not match the s/n on the frame in
front of the trigger-guard. Hmmmmm?

Having served in a military arms room, I wouldn't think that wouldl be
too unusual. IOW, replacing parts on an 'issue' gun.

Please, do continue.......

 

[Muley Gil]

I once owned a 4" MK IV that was unshaved. I found a MK VI target model. I sold the MK IV to buy the MK VI. When I went to buy the MK VI, it was gone. The buddy I sold the MK IV to didn't want to sell it back.

The late '90s, a friend found a shaved MK V in a pawn shop. The finish was really messed up; it looked like someone started to sand it down with 0 grit sandpaper. However, the bore wasn't too bad and I got it for $65.

I haven't shot it in years. I need to load up either some .45 Auto Rim ammo or the equivalent in ACP cases.

 

[zeke]

I once owned a 4" MK IV that was unshaved. I found a MK VI target model. I sold the MK IV to buy the MK VI. When I went to buy the MK VI, it was gone. The buddy I sold the MK IV to didn't want to sell it back.

The late '90s, a friend found a shaved MK V in a pawn shop. The finish was really messed up; it looked like someone started to sand it down with 0 grit sandpaper. However, the bore wasn't too bad and I got it for $65.

I haven't shot it in years. I need to load up either some .45 Auto Rim ammo or the equivalent in ACP cases.

Did manage to luck into an unshaved Mark VI later on, but still before brass, bullets or new rounds were common. After they moved to Enfield factory

 

[Golddollar]

My MkVI is unaltered and I picked it up at a gun show yrs ago.
A young State Trooper was walking around with it for sale. I knew him casually from the shows and he brought it over. He said it was left to him by his Gfather who was in WW1 in a "Scottish Group of some kind" (his words).
Great sense of family history there. Selling the revolver for Beer & Pizza money I guess.
It wasn't a HiCap 9mm, so it was of no interest to him.
I get that,,kind of,,maybe.

I offered him $65 for it. Then he did the I'll shop it around thing on me.
Well, he did come back about 2 hrs later and asked if I still wanted it.
He said he didn't get any offers on it,,none.

I took it at the price I offered which even at the time was a decent deal.
Still have it.
1918 dated revolver w/a Brit holster, maker marked London 1912.

I thought it was odd that no one else in the rather large show had snagged it,,but I was happy. Still am.

Believe me, mine cost a lot more than $65! But I'm happy with it and have no intention of ever letting it go. There is a judge in Maryland who wants it badly. I told him to come to my estate sale.

 

[Golddollar]

Did manage to luck into an unshaved Mark VI later on, but still before brass, bullets or new rounds were common. After they moved to Enfield factory

That gun is absolutely gorgeous!

 

[Dave_n]

That gun is absolutely gorgeous!

Enfield ran MKVi's for roughly 6 years after WWI as the UK Gov't did not want Webley to "pocket all the loot!!". I picked up three, two shaved, one "virgin". The sale of that one paid off a few "collection debts!!"

Dave_n

 

[zeke]

found this company on another site for Webley reduced loads. Not an endorsement, but for consideration

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