Chief’s Special vs. Centennial THINKING HELP NEEDED

[C.S.63]

James D
The centenial (640) is an awsome configuration of the J frame. I have had one for almost 20 years like some others on this thread and it is my go to carry. With the centenial one thing is practice practice practice. If it is a little rough it will smoth out over use. Also in the beginning start out with some milder loads to get used to that little 5 shot and work up. They are a lot of fun and a real easy carry. (pocket,ankle,hip,etc) Oh I find if I carry my chief's special it is on my hip the centenial leaves alot more options for carry for myself. Only time I shoot my model 36(Chief's special) single action is plinking at cans etc long distance or with shot shells at a snake otherwise it is DA all the time.
Carl

 

[Cruiser RN]

I went with the 640 in 357 Magnum "Centenial Style".With the hammer shrouded it is ideal for pocket carry with a pocket holster.The shroud prevents snaging on the draw and acts to protect the internals from the debris that the gun can encounter when in pocket carry mode.As far as cleaning I take off the crane and cylinder and clean the entire surface area with breakthru and lubricate it with Militec-1 dry impregnated lube.Once a year I carefully remove the sideplate and clean the internals.I also take a few Q Tips and lubricate the trigger mechanism with Militec-1.That is all that is needed under the sideplate.For a carry gun the "Centenial" is a better option because you can only fire it in Double Action mode and elliminate the arguement that you terrorized the perpetrator by cocking the hammer back making him comtemplate being shot.You could of ran rather than shooting him because you had sooooooo much time....LOL.Be well and keep em in the 10 ring...Mike

 

[JamesArthur60]

My reason is this: I liked my M36 Chief for pocket carry, SA/DA choice and lightweight. But, traded for a M640-1 Centennial because I like the 38/357 option carry, covered hammer, extra weight, slightly longer barrel, smoother trigger pull and it's stainless. Plus, for me it's more accurate. However, I've found the 640-1 a little larger for pocket carry and now use a OWB holster.

 

[TMann]

Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where the OP said whether he was going to carry his J-frame: pocket vs IWB? If you're pocket carrying, then I think that the Centennial is a better choice. If you're carrying IWB, then I think they are both equally viable.

Or...just get both.

TMann

 

[destroyah87]

I would pick Centenial, I believe that when you have it in your pocket you can just squeeze and not worry the hammer will snag on clothing or something. I think when a bg jumps on you and you shove the Centenial in to the bg's ribs and you can press your thumb where the shrouded part of the revolver you can make sure the gun points where you want.

 

[JamesD]

Hey! Everyone!!

I've just been sitting back enjoying checking this thread everyday, reading what all everybody was saying, and just realized IT WAS MY THREAD.

And I haven't been saying anything. Like being a bad host at a party! Let me make my amends.

First, I have read EVERY word of every post by everybody. Without trying to single out and respond to each, I'd just like to say thanks to everybody. This thread really did what I was looking for.

After due consideration and reflection, I think, mainly, I'm just an old man who is used to a world where... guns is s'posed to have hammers on 'em. I think I'd sort of miss it if it wasn't there.

I've sort of imagined having a Centennial, and I think it'd sort of creep me out knowing that there was a hammer in there somewhere but I couldn't see what it was up to.

Plus, the issues of spinning the cylinder for high primers (which I actually have heard reference to before) and having a trigger to keep your thumb on when holstering make great sense to me. The latter, in particular is a (cousin to the) habit I have developed with my SIGs to insure the slide doesn't come out of battery on reholstering.

Finally, I have a Model 36 and a Model 37 that were http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-revolvers-1961-1980/77353-my-daddy-s-two-j-frames.html, from the '60s and early '70s respectively, which I do not really want to make into daily carry guns. They are extremely clean, and I'd rather retire 'em than carry 'em. But I have carried the 36 for just a couple of days here to get the feel of it (in a Mika that I picked up at some point). And I find that my thumb goes quite naturally to the hammer. Actually it's sorta difficult to put it anywhere else (harder to make a fist in your pocket than a "knife hand").

So, all things considered, I am going with... drum roll please... the Chief's Special.

I know I'll be in the minority. Just me and Robert B I think.
But it just feels like it's what's right for me.
And, plus, there's little doubt that I will end up doing a "semi-bob" on it (modeled after one of doc540's and another I saw but can't remember whose).

Nothing's perfect in this world. But this is what I think will please me the most and work the best for me.

Thanks, everybody.

JamesD

 

[Wee Hooker]

We'll something tells me that this thread isn't over yet anyway. Seems we get very passionate around here on our J frame preferences.

Congrats on your decision!! Now go out and fine a nice one .

FWIW, your not totally in the minority, despite having owned bodyguards and centennials myself, my two current and longer term carry guns are a 360PD and Mod 60. For my needs (which sometimes require SA shooting), they work best. BTW, both have bobbed hammers which I think is a worthwhile (1hr?) project. Here is my mod 60.

 

[JamesD]

Thanks Wee Hooker

Thanks for the reply Wee/Dave.

And sure, if this thread has some life in it yet fine with me, passion about things is a good thing!

Couple of questions for you?

Is that a Barami Hip Grip I see hiding on the back side of your 60?
Do you carry per it a lot?
How do you like it?
DOES YOUR 60 EVER HOP OFF YOUR BELT? LIKE...WHEN YOU SIT DOWN OR BEND OVER OR SUCH?

And...

You mention shooting SA. With the 60 you have pictured?
Is that enough hammer to cock with???

Best regards,

JamesD

 

[38-44HD45]

Sorry I didn't see this thread sooner. To me the ONE reason to have SA ability on a pocketable J-frame is the high-primer or crud in the BC gap issue, which is enough of a rarity with a clean gun and high-quality ammo that I don't sweat it. I carry Js as backups almost every day, and they are all either Centennial types (usually a 342Ti), a 37-2 with bobbed hammer, or an old no-dash 37 I bobbed myself. (Which, BTW, can be cocked by starting the hammer back with the trigger and then cocking it.) I recently picked up a Ruger LCR with Lasergrips, and that ugly little rascal has no exposed hammer, either. (Has a WONDERFUL trigger, though!)

Since I sold my old no-dash 60, the only carry-snubby I have that has any hammer spur is my Colt Magnum Carry, and I've removed about 35-40% of its hammer spur in more of a "recontour" job. It is only ever carried in an ankle rig that protects the stubby hammer, and its DA pull is actually about a half pound lighter than its SA!

 

[armsmaster270]

I had to chime in for the Centennial also I carry the 340PD

 

[153]

... I read an article in a gun magazine by Massaad Ayoob where he emphasized the importance of a cylinder check. That is pulling the hammer back slightly with muzzle pointed in a safe direction so that one can rotate the cylinder to verify no high primers etc...

Someone already mentioned checking ammo for high primers by placing the rounds on a table or using a straight edge....

Am I the only person who thinks loading your revolver, then pulling back on the hammer or trigger and "spinning" the cylinder to check for out of spec rounds is one of the dumbest ideas ever put forward. Sounds like a technique used by The Cisco Kid and Pancho!

I was taught that after loading your revolver that one should not handle the controls until you are ready to shoot. Playing with the hammer or trigger of a loaded revolver is just asking for trouble.

And am I to believe this idea orignates from the "don't disconnect a safety", "don't shoot reloads" and "there's a personal liability lawsuit waiting" after every shooting school of thought?

But then there are people who believe that Barack Obama will help us by fixing the "broken" health care system....

 

[Mitch_D]

high primer check...

9303: You're not the only one.

Believe it, or not, there are ways to check for high primers - other than spinning the cylinder on a live cocked revolver.

I have several Model 36s, 60s and Centennials. My primary carry is a Centennial style 642. High primers can be checked for on ANY uncocked revolver by spinning the cylinder full rotation when it is just barely unlatched. MA is right, high primers should be checked for on a self defense gun - but it doesn't have to dictate what gun you choose.

My main reason for moving to the 642 was the "sealed" hammer design. I live in a dirty world (don't we all ?) and have a terrible problem with debris falling into the space between the hammer and frame on M36 / 60 type guns when I pocket carry. The Centennial does not have this problem. I have also become very fond of the way the DA trigger stages on this model.

Now, that said, I don't think anyone truely believes that Barack Obama will help us by fixing the "broken" health care system (there can't be anyone really that stupid)...

 

[Wee Hooker]

Yes that's a Barami. I love the concept personally. No bulk or install grief with holsters. Just stick it in my waistband and go. It also rides low and conceals better than many holsters IMHO. I wear this gun in this fashion most of the time I carry. It has never come loose on me in the slightest. The cylinder of the gun sits below the belt so my belt tends to hold it down/in till drawn. My only gripe with the barami's is that they are plain Jane and a little slick. I'm thinking about ordering a wood set from collinscraft.
Yes, there is enough hammer there to cock with (easily) but you need to modify your motion a bit. I generally get my thumb on the hammer and then put just enough pressure on the trigger to move the hammer back a hair then take over with the thumb. It becomes second nature and one fluid motion with very little practice. Likewise, I decock by pulling the trigger and riding the hammer down with my thumb. (As long as you let the trigger return freely, the hammer block safety will reset before the hammer gets close to its seated position.) FWIW, I have three snubies with bobbed hammers. ( 60, 380pd and mod 64) I generally only use the SA feature on any of them when checking for cyl rotation and "plinking" on woods walks. Nice feature to have when you want it though.
hth

Thanks for the reply Wee/Dave.

And sure, if this thread has some life in it yet fine with me, passion about things is a good thing!

Couple of questions for you?

Is that a Barami Hip Grip I see hiding on the back side of your 60?
Do you carry per it a lot?
How do you like it?
DOES YOUR 60 EVER HOP OFF YOUR BELT? LIKE...WHEN YOU SIT DOWN OR BEND OVER OR SUCH?

And...

You mention shooting SA. With the 60 you have pictured?
Is that enough hammer to cock with???

Best regards,

JamesD

 

[JamesD]

Wee Hooker

Likewise, I decock by pulling the trigger and riding the hammer down with my thumb. (As long as you let the trigger return freely, the hammer block safety will reset before the hammer gets close to its seated position.)

Dave,

Can you please elaborate on the short passage I pulled out of your above post.

Again, I've been shooting for 50 years, but way sort on "detail" when it comes to the S&W revolver.

I've been "playing" with my Daddys 36 and 37 (unloaded). Trying to listen to all the little clicks it makes as you draw the hammer back. Watching all the little timing stuff go on. Trying to figure out just how this mechanism "thinks".

So, my question... trying to figure out how the hammer can be "returning freely" when you're riding it down with your thumb, the overall action of the hammerblock safety, etc.

Oh, I've got so much to learn. But I WILL NOT operate a machine without understanding it. (Any machine, but especially this kind!) And the only way I know to learn is to read and/or ask questions.

Thanks for any help on this!

James

 

[Wee Hooker]

Ok first, for legal reasons, I'm NOT advocating anybody pull the trigger on a loaded gun to cock it. I'm also not advocating anybody modify their own gun or imitate what I've done in anyway. It can be unsafe if done incorrectly.
I'm merely describing on how I do it (at my own risk and often on an empty gun.). That said, here is what I do.

With the bobbed revolver in my shooting hand ,pointed in a safe direction, I rest my thumb on top of the hammer stub like I was going to thumb cock the gun. I then (with my trigger finger) start putting increasing pressure on the trigger until I feel the hammer start to move back. Once the hammer is back only a 1/8-3/16"" or so there is enough exposed top surface of the hammer to get a good purchase on it with my thumb. I then use a curling motion with my thumb to firmly catch the hammer and complete the cocking motion. This transfers the cocking force from the trigger to the hammer in one motion. Note it's important I take my finger OFF the trigger as soon as my thumb takes over so I don't pull through. ( My thumb locked down on the hammer somewhat prevents this anyway, but it's important to be safe as possible.)

The decock I do is just the reverse of this action but I also use the thumb and forefinger of my left hand to firmly pinch the hammer and ride it down to the last 1/8" of drop (with finger off the trigger immediately after the sear/hammer is released.) At that point the trigger has come forward and allowed the hammer block safety to reengage. There is also very little inertia in the hammer/spring so I can just let it slip the last 1/8" ( again with the gun pointed in a safe direction.)

BTW: When I first started learning this procedure, I would purposely allow the hammer to drop along it's arc from different positions ( on an EMPTY GUN!) while closely watching behind the cyl for the firing pin. What I noticed was the point on the gun where the hammer block safety engaged/kept the FP from popping through the frame towards the (empty) cyl. I think it's important to know my gun's parameters if I'm going to be doing this type of manipulation.
hth

 

[JamesD]

Thanks, Dave.

I myself completely understand that describing what you may do is never to be construed as giving advice or a recommendation to someone else. But it never hurts to add a disclaimer.

Thanks for the step-by-step of your procedure.
Especially the last little paragraph where you describe your experiments ON AN EMPTY GUN with how the various components behave at different points in the arc.

That's very much what I'm trying to do with this new type of "machine" I want to master:
watch, observe, learn, understand.

Thanks for your time.

JamesD

 

[feralmerril]

Didnt read all the replys so dont know if I have anything new. To me a J frame is a pocket gun. A hammer spur does not belong on a pocket gun to snag and rip your pants or get you killed. Why wear a J on your belt? If you want a belt gun you can as easily carry a 3" or 4".
Bob that hammer to where you can carefully cock it for single action if you really want to. I carried a "bobbed" model 60 for many years untill it was stolen along with my truck. I replaced it with a old model 40.
Just today I stuffed it in a nice old holster that I forgot I owned and just found. No point in it, just will try it out for a few outings. In winter I always used to like carrying a snub in a jacket pocket, and just in my front pants pocket in summer. Done that for about 40 years off and on. Some of my uniform coats used to have a special inside left side butt forward pocket sewed in with a snap strap. Those were the best I ever found. Now for that set up the hammer didnt need to be bobbed, but for everthing else I liked a bobbed hammer or model 40. I do own a old 2" model 34 that I have been debateing on bobbing, but really I dont carry it that much so probley wont.

My old model 60 # R 4266. If you see it, its hot and I want it back!

The model 60s replacement, a old model 40. I have the pocket holster, but most the time just carry it loose in my pocket.

 

[Wee Hooker]

BTW,
Here is a pic of my 360pd which has a bobbed hammer. Notice the hammer stub is considerably smaller than the older mod 60 (no dash) I posted. The newer J frames have a MIM hammer too which is considerably smaller (and pointier) than the old versions. They "Bob" differently.
hth