Date of Manufacture/Shipping for prewar .38 M&P Hand Ejector SN: 291883

[BluedRevolver]

I am trying to get an idea of a possible date range for manufacture of my grandfather's S&W .38 K-Frame that belonged to his father. I'm pretty sure he owned it by the time my grandfather was in high school, which would have been in the late 40s/early 50s.

I know it's hard to say without a letter from S&W, but does anyone have an idea of when this may have been made or shipped? My grandfather is 92 and his father had it as early as my grandfather's high school years.

Here is a photo: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

Attaching image isn't working so I had to link it.

 

[Frailer]

That revolver should have shipped circa 1919.

 

[BluedRevolver]

That revolver should have shipped circa 1919.

Wow, that's significantly older than I thought. How does one determine that? Also, what revision would that make it?

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass! It's a Model 1905, 4th Change. Although some members have databases they use to track certain models, most of us use the Standard Catalog of S&W, 4th Edition to estimate shipping dates. There's an appendix with tables that cross reference serial numbers to manufacture dates. That will usually get us pretty close but S&W didn't always ship in serial number order. So, some guns may not have shipped for months or years after they were made.

 

[Alk8944]

Don't know how wiregrassguy believes the gun is a 4th Change since I do not see a serial number in your post. It is no newer than 1922 though since the Made in USA stamp is not present on the right front of the frame. The stocks are the type used between 1910 and 1920, so if they are original the gun would fall in that time frame. If you will post the SN for the gun we could give you a closer date.

 

[BluedRevolver]

Don't know how wiregrassguy believes the gun is a 4th Change since I do not see a serial number in your post. It is no newer than 1922 though since the Made in USA stamp is not present on the right front of the frame.

Serial number is 291883 as in the thread title. I should've put it in the post.

 

[mrcvs]

I think this revolver has been refinished. But.as long as the S & W logo has not been buffed off and doesn't exist on the other side—it's 1919 production.

 

[BluedRevolver]

I think this revolver has been refinished. But.as long as the S & W logo has not been buffed off and doesn't exist on the other side—it's 1919 production.

What makes you think it was refinished? My great grandfather mainly kept it in a car glove box. But it very well could be I have no idea. The front sight blade is thin.

Here are more pics (hope they show up): https://imgur.com/a/B6MY2fK

 

[mrcvs]

What makes you think it was refinished? My great grandfather mainly kept it in a car glove box. But it very well could be I have no idea. The front sight blade is thin.

Here are more pics (hope they show up): https://imgur.com/a/B6MY2fK

The other photographs are helpful. The one photograph suggested a questionable sideplate fit. I no longer think that is the case, meaning a refinish is less likely.

The medallion stocks tells me this revolver is 1920 or before. Is there a S & W logo on the other side? If not, it's 1819. No logos on 1919 production revolvers.

 

[BluedRevolver]

The other photographs are helpful. The one photograph suggested a questionable sideplate fit. I no longer think that is the case, meaning a refinish is less likely.

The medallion stocks tells me this revolver is 1920 or before. Is there a S & W logo on the other side? If not, it's 1819. No logos on 1919 production revolvers.

I will have a family member take another pic tomorrow of the other side grip medallion. Thank you for the info. As far as I can tell from the pics, I don't see a logo on the other side's medallion. There's certainly no S&W logo on either side of the frame.

 

[DWalt]

On my list is SN 291043 which shipped in 6/1919. Yours probably will not have the small stamped round S&W logo on the frame. It definitely will not have the MADE IN U.S.A. frame stamp. S&W had stopped using the "Model of 1905" nomenclature by then, actually about five years earlier. Yours is correctly called a .38 Military and Police Model. And 4th Change is a collector identification term that was never used by S&W. Grips made then should have the "Deep Dish" gold medallions yours have. Wooden grips made all through the 1920s had no medallions. So everything about your M&P appears to be at least period correct for the late teens. A little sweaty but it will shoot OK. Please do not think about getting it refinished.

 

[Glashaus]

I wish my Grandpa had had a S&W to pass down! Very nice! Clean it up, grab some standard .38 Special and head to the range!

 

[mrcvs]

This revolver No 296840, shipped May 1919.

Just another old school survivor..... 4th change 38

 

[BluedRevolver]

I wish my Grandpa had had a S&W to pass down! Very nice! Clean it up, grab some standard .38 Special and head to the range!

He hasn't said anything yet about who will get it, but he knows that I'm the one who is intensely interested in it and others have told him it should go to me. Despite being 92, he doesn't have any serious medical condition at all (as long as he doesn't fall), is on no medication, and might be around for a bit longer yet, so he may still have use for it. I've talked about taking him out to shoot it sometime.

 

[BluedRevolver]

On my list is SN 291043 which shipped in 6/1919. Yours probably will not have the small stamped round S&W logo on the frame. It definitely will not have the MADE IN U.S.A. frame stamp. S&W had stopped using the "Model of 1905" nomenclature by then, actually about five years earlier. Yours is correctly called a .38 Military and Police Model. And 4th Change is a collector identification term that was never used by S&W. Grips made then should have the "Deep Dish" gold medallions yours have. Wooden grips made all through the 1920s had no medallions. So everything about your M&P appears to be at least period correct for the late teens. A little sweaty but it will shoot OK. Please do not think about getting it refinished.

Thank you for the info. I've passed that on. And don't worry, it will never be refinished and will be cherished as-is as a family heirloom. Seems to have been fired very little.

 

[mrcvs]

As a family heirloom, why don't you get a factory letter for it?

 

[BluedRevolver]

As a family heirloom, why don't you get a factory letter for it?

How should I go about doing that properly?

 

[DWalt]

Letters are $100, but be aware it is highly likely a historical letter will not provide much information beyond that already provided. But the letter will provide an exact shipping date, if that is important to you, and to where the gun was sent. Plus it will contain a paragraph or two of boilerplate general information regarding that particular revolver model. Shipment will nearly always be to some S&W distributor, wholesale house, hardware store, etc., possibly to some law enforcement agency. Very seldom directly to a private individual. Do not expect any data about its chain of ownership after it left the factory. Such information does not exist.Letter Request Form

 

[JH1951]

................ I've talked about taking him out to shoot it sometime.

Please take him out to shoot it. Do you have any idea what that would mean to a man in his 90's? Spend a few hours with the old boy - in the long run you will be glad you did. What you learn during those few hours could be amazing, too.
Don't put it off too long.... Just do it.

 

[BluedRevolver]

Please take him out to shoot it. Do you have any idea what that would mean to a man in his 90's? Spend a few hours with the old boy - in the long run you will be glad you did. What you learn during those few hours could be amazing, too.
Don't put it off too long.... Just do it.

I would love to do that. Next time I go to stay with him I will ask if I could take him out shooting. He's not much of a gun person, more of a hunter, but I will ask.