Did I do wrong?? A bit of a rant --

[ingmansinc]

I agree with what you did and how you did it. In my opinion we must do what we believe is right and be willing to accept the consequences if it goes wrong. I have been criticized for standing up for what I believe and personally don't give a damn. Thanks for your service in defense of our country, now and then.

 

[Centenniel]

I hope the kid learned something from the experience.

 

[mississippi revolverman]

Good show Sir, respect you for your service also.

Similar story several years ago my wife and I were at a hockey match. As the National anthem was bring played 2, 18-19 yr old "Chumps" were in front of us talking and with there caps on. I reached out and just flipped them off their head into the aisle. They turned and stared at me and I just gave the an "eat sh--' look. Guess they didn't want to mess with a 6'1" 200 lb grey headed ex Narc

 

[Gov't Cheese]

I wouldn't have a problem with them not removing their hats during the German National Anthem. After all, you were still on American soil.

I think you should have asked him to remove his hat during the National Anthem, not after it was over.

 

[Andy Taylor]

Originally posted by Wheelgunner840:
Ya done good.

And thank you for your service.

WG840

I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[truckemup97]

Originally posted by BLACKHAWKNJ:
When I wear a hat I usually salute.

IIRC, that's only appropriate if you are wearing a uniform.

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by Wickahoney: You are darned lucky the young man didn't simply find the nearest police officer, yeah I was one of those also, and had you arrested for assault if not assault and battery.

Wickahoney has it right, VERY right, in fact. You're Very Lucky there wasn't a LEO present or you would have had to watch the reruns from the local Jail.

This is the real World and nothing gives you the "Right" to assault anyone just to impress your personal opinions upon them. They weren't breaking any Laws that I know of and they wouldn't have if they had chosen to simply remain seated during the whole process.

You're not the only one who put time in the Service, as my signature states, but it seems that you forgot what you were Fighting for. It seems you don't remember that one of the reasons we were there was so even Abusive and Hostile types like this are able to do whatever they chose, as long as it isn't against the Laws of the Land.

If you wanted to have a conversation with them, you would have been well within your Rights to do so but laying hands on another person isn't acceptable.

What you did sounds "Good" but it just plain Is NOT Right or Legal!!! Grow up!!!

 

[ladder13]

I have to agree with those who say you had no right to touch the person. Maybe a verbal tongue lashing would have sufficed.
Take my opinion for what it's worth.

 

[Capt Steve]

I understand your frustration but as Ron White likes to point out "you can't fix stupid". You cannot put your hands on or even verbally assault someone unless you are will to pay a serious toll.

These days you never know who you are dealing with and that kid could have had a gun, knife or a couple of black belts. You were lucky he caved or it could have gotten very ugly. Remember John Bernard Books (John Wayne, The Shootist), mantra: I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted and I won't be laid a hand upon. I do these things for others and require the same". Great flick and some pretty good words to live by.

 

[silvercorvette]

Thank you for your service to our country, I want to say thank you for doing what you did because I would probably have wanted to do the same thing you did and most of us on this forum feel the same way about respecting our flag.

But Gator is 100% correct, we all have the urge to do something like you did, and even though it makes my blood boil to see disrespectful acts we have to accept the fact that it is one of the freedoms we fought for.

 

[Wheelgunner840]

Verbally bashing the guy, embarassing him may well have been the "PC" and more legal thing to do, as pointed out by a few here. I suppose i could debate both sides, but on different levels.

One side is that you really don't have the right to physically lay your hands on someone else because they don't agree with (what's right) you.

The other side of me says that what you did, while according to our "PC" laws was probably some form of assault, but wasn't an assault in terms of common sense. Now if you punched the guy in the nose, that would have been a different story.

Snatching a hat off someones head? I am not seeing the "common sense" designation of assault there. Might even be on the books as a violation of hurting someones feelings.

It's getting to be that soon, giving someone a stern look will be considered assault.

I am going to stick with "ya did good, and thank you for your service". Although, I would strongly suggest telling the next person that wearing their hat during the national anthem is disrespectful to all those who fought for this country. Embarrass them to the best of your vocal abilities, but keep your hands to yourself. We live in a different world today.

WG840

 

[pbslinger]

Freedom to choose to be patriotic and free to not be imposed upon from someone who believes otherwise.

Would you like it if someone told you they thought you were a fool for standing in reverence to the flag? His opinion is as valid as yours until we are controlled by the state.

Freedom fighters unfortunately fight for the right to choose to be irreverent.

Americans are free to never have a patriotic thought or appreciate their freedom if they don't want to.

I'm sure this isn't a popular way to look at it, but it is another cost of freedom. Freedom isn't free.

You don't have to look hard to find disrespectful people. Someone who won't remove a hat and stand quietly during the anthem probably doesn't live by the golden rule.

I think the best course would be to politely tell them it is good manners to remove hats and stand quietly during the anthem. Maybe their parents never taught them. Sometimes it is proper to be rude to strangers, but I don't think this is one of them. Display that patriots are also kind.

You will see this with about any size of crowd during the national anthem. It bothers me also, but I don't get worked up about it. It is hard to enjoy the song and thoughts of founding fathers and patriots if irratated.

 

[ingmansinc]

The more I read the replies here the more I see the light. I would be very careful of touching another if you are a vet. Home Land Security will surely consider it a criminal act against the country. Then of course if these rules were in place when our country was founded George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and all those fellow would have been locked up before they got a good start.

I'm kind of thinking it is time to take this country back.

 

[cmort666]

I generally ignore ignoramuses like that. Now if he were to start something with me, well let's just say I can make somebody want to go hang himself without resorting to profanity at all.

I never had any kids. I don't feel the need to raise somebody else's kids without having been around for the fun. And if he's that old, the fun's already been had and gone.

 

[marine2541]

Semper Fi!

 

[Wickahoney]

Idaho Code IC-18-901 Assault defined:
An unlawful attempt of or threat to, committ violence, coupled with the ability to do so.

Punishment: Fine not to exceed $1000, Jail not to exceed 1 year in the county jail.

Assault is the verbal threat or, pointing the gun or brandishing or................. Battery is the actual act of violence.

I would be willing to bet money that the statute is very similar in most states, as it is based in/on English Common Law.

So the act of confromting a person that is engaged in an act that is NOT illegal and offering or threatening violence, of any kind, is an assault. As soon as you snatch the hat from his head, or thump him in the chest or..... you have committed a battery.

Simple Battery: Fine not to exceed $5000, Jail not to exceed 1 year in county jail nor to exceed 4 years in the state penitentuary.

We all get angry at rude behavior. The fact that I have a hard time tolerating rudeness is one of the reasons I opt to live in a remote area and I seldom if ever attend things like concerts, football games, rodeos etc. The primary reason is I KNOW there going to be people there with whom I strongly disagree and who's behavior I find offensive and that I have no right to do anything about. People really have the right to not stand or salute or anything else. They also get to scream and yell and stand on their chairs in front of me at concerts and ball games. Knowing that I am highly unlikely to change their behavior and that I have no right to try to do so, I simply opt to avoid those situations when I can.

Ross W Thomas

By the way this isn't PC or new, it hasn't changed in my 30 years as a LEO.

 

[Herknav]

Originally posted by truckemup97:

Originally posted by BLACKHAWKNJ:
When I wear a hat I usually salute.

IIRC, that's only appropriate if you are wearing a uniform.

That changed last year. Vets now have the option to render the hand salute.

 

[MaricopaKid]

As a proud veteran, I applaud your patriotism. I can't condone the "touching". However, if one were to desecrate the flag in front of me, all bets are off!

 

[11B Lifer]

Standing for the a NATO ally's anthem is military protocol (not civilian)-I'd be damed if I would tell my wife to stand up when soemone else's anthem is played!. So, while in Europe,while in uniform, I would stand up for the German anthem-probably salute. For our Anthem, I salute (also for retreat, since I now work as a civilian on a post). Attempting to correct/fix civilian behavior would drive one to madness. Its still legal to burn a flag, and no law says you must do anything when the flag/anthem are presented. I look at it this way-being able to go out and render respect to the flag during retreat is a priviledge. Same with saluting during the Anthem-

 

[Capt Steve]

Knowing that I am highly unlikely to change their behavior and that I have no right to try to do so, I simply opt to avoid those situations when I can.

+1 I avoid crowds as the larger the crowd the larger the idiot factor.