Disappointing range visit

[TWEAKD4]

I got the opportunity to go to the range today with some friends. This was only the second time I have shot my M&P 9mm 4.25" (bought new 4-2013). I seem always to be low and left, I am a righty BTW. My friend let me shoot his Glock 19. First and only time I have shot a Glock. Instantly my groups tightened up and closer to bullseye but still a little low and left. Once I felt the Glock trigger I was impressed. I went back to my M&P and now I can't stand the trigger. Too much travel and not a clean break. I am new to this 9mm but I also have a Ruger 22/45 and shoot that great so I don't think it is just me. I have read up on Apex components. Would the DCAEK fix this or do I have to go with the trigger kit as well?

The reason I went with the M&P over the Glock in the first place was because it felt so great in my hand. The Glock felt like a 2x4 while the M&P a glove. I wonder if I should have rented them and shot at a range first. I am open to any suggestions or improvements to help me be a better shooter with this gun. Thanks in advance.

 

[RobzGuns]

The Low & Left portion of your problem could simply be cleaned up by experimenting with different trigger finger positions in order to get a good 'clean' rearward press of the trigger. This can vary from one Brand/Model to another. For some, the distal pad works best, while for others, the Center pad works best and (like for me) the 1st joint works best... But that's JUST for the Shield and is different on some of my other pistols. I'm not a fan of aftermarket trigger kits.

The Glock felt like a 2x4 while the M&P a glove. I wonder if I should have rented them and shot at a range first.

Yup... I always suggest trying before buying, in order to see which Brand/Model you shoot better. There are a lot of pistols that feel great at the counter, but that doesn't mean squat if they don't shoot well for you on the range. You need to compare them side-by-side... Which is why I went with the G19 over the XDMc and M&Pc. The G19 simply shot better than the other two.
I'll never buy another pistol that I haven't tried first.

 

[Saudade]

Personally, I prefer my M&P 9 over the G19. I shot them both before buying.

I did like the Glock trigger better. The trigger safety is different on them. The split trigger on the Glock allows my finger to rest pretty much anywhere. The hinged trigger on the M&P requires my finger to rest lower to ensure the safety disengages. Due the the smallish size of my hands (OK let's not go there!!), it partially negates the high grip allowed by the beavertail.

That being said, it's just taken me a bit to adjust. As you noted, I didn't like the feel of the "Block". The M&P felt more natural. So much so I bought a 9C to compliment my FS.

 

[mustangman]

A lot of righties bring up low left, and someone usually responds with something like this....
Also shooting a gun twice in 14 months and passing judgment doesn't seem quite fair. You need to shoot it a lot more, and see if things work themselves out. I would suggest a lot more trigger time.

 

[Lee in Quartzsite]

Try shooting with the other Backstraps and see if it makes a difference. A larger/smaller backstrap will change your finger position on the trigger and might help the problem.

 

[Atticaz]

Too little finger in the trigger guard, for one. Maybe you need the smaller backstrap to help shorten the distance to the trigger face? The Apex poly trigger is a sweet addition to the M&P. I highly suggest it. As for shooting low, what sight picture are you using? Do you cover your target with the front sight post or a 6 o'clock hold?

Also try balancing a penny on your front sight and do dry fire practice shots. If the penny falls or teeters, it means that you just need to get use to the gun.

 

[Coaltminer]

The Glock trigger feels like a stick to me, not even ergonomic. I shoot my M&P much better, think that's one of the reasons. Trigger finger always got sore with the Glunk, it's a sorry shape for the finger. As for cops carrying them, let's not go there, it's all about money, politics, deals from the manufacturers, it's pathetic. It's surely not about what's best because there are several products out there that are more than qualified to fill law enforcement roles. I get tired of this one over that one debates ad infinitum, this caliber over that caliber also. Just don't arm me with junk!

 

[TNDave]

I have never fired an M&P but would like to. I use a G19. It does feel like a block in your hand but it works and hits to point of aim. One thing that might solve your mystery is to put some dummy rounds in your mag. If you are jerking low left you will catch yourself doing it. Low left is a classic jerk for a right hander. You might try scooting your finger over on the trigger a little farther too.

 

[scooter123]

Low & Left is EXTREMELY common for new shooters and 99.9999% of the time it's a result of "slapping" the trigger AND a Push Flinch.

Fixes.

Step one, spend some time every day doing dry fire practice. When doing this CONCENTRATE on a steady rate of increase of pressure on the trigger until you get a good clean "surprise" break. BTW, align your sights on a small target like a light switch and work to achieve as little movement of the pistol as you can achieve throughout the trigger stroke. Once you start to get a consistent clean release you can then increase the rate at which you pull the trigger.

Step two is range time and working on that Push Flinch. I've found that some of what is taught in Meditation classes can work quite well at addressing a flinch. Because it teaches you how to concentrate on achieving a relaxed state of mind and body. Master doing that and you'll eliminate your flinch because you won't be all tensed up in anticipation of the gun firing. BTW, I know this from first hand experience because any time I stay away from the range too long I have to work on a tendency to flinch. IMO flinching is a perfectly natural response to a loud bang and blow to the hand so anyone who states they never flinch are fooling themselves.

PS; I'm going to assume that you are an adult and capable of making sure your handgun is unloaded prior to doing any dry fire practice and also adult enough to ONLY select non living objects for dry fire targets.

 

[erick1987]

+1 on the backstrap change. i had the medium grip on my core because it felt better in my hand. i decided to do some swapping one day and found thay the large grip greatly reduced my low left groups.

 

[Ranger17]

OP, as a 9mm newb myself, I noticed the comparison you made with your .22; that is something i was doing as well when i first got my 9c. But I am realizing (speaking for myself) that while i can be a decent shot with my buckmark, there is much for me to learn and adapt to on the 9. I hit the range again yesterday, pix showing both rounds at 7 yds (post it for group size reference). Note i shoot for fun and practice, but even after 400+ rounds thru my 9 i still have a ways to go both for accuracy and esp consistency. But it's coming along, and i believe will continue to do so as i keep at it.
Point being, perhaps dont make too many comparisons between the different handguns you have, as that may alter your thought process on how you can improve on the 9.

just a beginner's .02

 

[Com 45acp]

Your anticipating the recoil. Steady, smooth press. Make sure your bringing the gun up to your head not other way around.

 

[Llando88]

I've found this graphic humorous and accurate. +1 to the advice in the thread, though.

http://www.misgunception.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Target1.jpg

 

[walkin' trails]

Scooter123 is right on the money. Just because you shot dead on with another pistol that day doesn't mean that you won't start jerking and flinching with it another day. there is a possibility that because the Glock was new to you, you were focusing much better. The G19.is a good pistol, and I won't knock it, but the M&P 9 is more capable than people give credit. Personally I like it's trigger much better than the Glock's. Dry firing is the key to mastering trigger control. The amount of finger on the trigger depends on how well you are able to control the trigger. I went thru a class a couple of months ago and the instructor noted I was staging my pistol's trigger. I didn't realize I was doing so, but when I started working to correct the problem, I shot more accurately - I was going low-left too and thought I was doing everything else right. Sometimes it helps to have a professional instructor standing beside you to help you thru the rough edges.

 

[ginzo]

Accurate is correct!!!

I caught myself when I was having trouble, "Looking" around the sights to see where I hit before I finished the shot. It's an easy trap/habit to get into. I was very lucky I figured it out.

I've found this graphic humorous and accurate. +1 to the advice in the thread, though.

http://www.misgunception.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Target1.jpg

 

[TWEAKD4]

I want to thank everyone for your advice. Very good points to consider and it will just take time to get used to this gun.

I never thought about using a larger backstrap. I tried them all when I brought it home but the medium felt the best to me but a larger may improve my shooting. The next time out I will give that a try. I will need to do more practice dry firing. I haven't much because I don't want my kids to even know I have a handgun yet until they get older.

I thought at least someone would mention the long trigger travel but since I don't have a lot of experience with other guns it just may just be normal. I will hold off on any upgrades until I get the fundamentals down.