Done buying from my

Couple of weeks ago was in shop of "friendly dealer" for an incoming transfer.

We discussed how some prices have gone down.

He mentioned three on-line sellers who have prices below his cost.

It is no wonder that smaller dealers are going away.

Bekeart
 
Muss Muggins said:
You didn't agree on the price before he ordered it? That's the first thing I ask.
Click to expand...

Most gun shops, if they're smart will require prepayment on special orders. If they don't, it's a good way to end up with a gun in the showcase that they don't need or want.

You never know if the buyer with change their mind or fail the background check.

So in most cases the buyer will know the price beforehand.
 
Bekeart said:
Couple of weeks ago was in shop of "friendly dealer" for an incoming transfer.

We discussed how some prices have gone down.

He mentioned three on-line sellers who have prices below his cost.

It is no wonder that smaller dealers are going away.

Bekeart
Click to expand...

This is a problem with all small businesses across the nation.

Many online retailers order directly from the manufacturer or distributor and have the item drop shipped to you. No overhead. Very few employees. Less taxes. Etc......

The times are changing fast. If a business owner doesn't change too, they will get left behind.

There is no way that I would open or buy a gun shop today unless I could guarantee that I had an absolute captive market.
 
I don't think I have bought a gun from the dealer who does all of my transfers now, but for years that is where I bought my hunting license and a lot of other stuff here and there. Plus I think they get a charge out of seeing all the neat stuff I get in (not anything that would be competing with them.
 
I have paid my LGS more than online shops or Academy or Bass Pro because: he will get me the exact model that I want, he will take it back if I do not like it for any reason, he will throw in some ammo to make up part of the difference in price, he knows what I have and what I like and will let me know when something interesting gets traded in. He is a nice guy and knows a lot more about firearms and my firearms than the guy at Academy.
 
Kanewpadle said:
Most gun shops, if they're smart will require prepayment on special orders. If they don't, it's a good way to end up with a gun in the showcase that they don't need or want.

You never know if the buyer with change their mind or fail the background check.

So in most cases the buyer will know the price beforehand.
Click to expand...

I've got some great deals that way. One of my LGS is a hang-out for some very serious Glock Fan Boys. They require 1/3 down on orders from people that aren't old trusted regular customers along with a very generous week to pick it up. If you renege on the deal, you loose the deposit (it's all in writing and signed). Guy ordered a M&P PRO 9 and then backed out of it. I already had a M&P FS-9 and an M&P FS-45ACP. The "ordered" PRO had been sitting for over a week on the shelf collecting dust while other brands were zipping out the door. I got it for Dealer cost and the LGS threw in the guys lost deposit (being the long time customer I am), to really entice me. I pounced on it over the phone, took a road trip and had it with-in the hour. Got a M&P-9 Long and a Mid size 9 the same way over the years. Now they are more than holding their own. Lost my "super discount", but I do have the whole M&P-9 and M&P-45ACP line including the Shield and EZ-380. I do have other brands of handguns, I just seem to favor the S&W M&P's. Still no Glocks though...yet?

I do have a friendly rivalry going on with the Glock Fan boys down there, but it's all in fun.
 
Irn-Bru said:
I didn't discuss my unhappiness with the store owner, but did a little research before buying. I saw it on Gunbroker for around about $480 with $30 shipping. I did a little more research after getting home with the gun and saw one place had it for $405 +$15 shipping.

I totally agree that it's my own fault for paying over the odds. I've knowingly paid over the odds in the past just to keep a good relationship with the owner. I don't want to be that guy that just uses him for his $25 transfer fees and never buy in store.

I have no idea what his profit was, but that was the last time I'm buying a new gun and having him order it from his distributor.
Click to expand...

It's a business relationship, nothing more.

It appears, you thought you had an obligation to buy something from him, at retail, because you thought he was your friend and you're a nice guy. He's in business to make a profit and as you found out, he's not your friend, and simply sees you as an income source.

Save your money and "that guy."
 
Bekeart said:
Couple of weeks ago was in shop of "friendly dealer" for an incoming transfer. We discussed how some prices have gone down. He mentioned three on-line sellers who have prices below his cost.
It is no wonder that smaller dealers are going away.

Bekeart
Click to expand...

I see a lot of online prices that are below LGS prices. But that's before shipping costs and transfer fee. Figuring those in, and there not much, if any, difference in price. If online prices are cheaper, they usually turn out not to be significantly lower...or not worth the time hassle and time spent communicating with the seller and sending funds.

I'll buy vintage guns online, but I've never bought current production stuff online.

I see people talking about $25 transfer fees. I've yet to find anyone around here who does them that cheap. I personally think transfer fees are a ripoff, anyway, whatever they cost. Charge anywhere from $25 to $75 transfer fee for 15 minutes worth of paperwork? C'mon.
 
The pawn shop that does my transfers charges $16.05

Here's why I'll buy online. As an example, I can find a new CZ P09 for
BIN $363 + $35 Shipping and $16.06 for a total of $414.05.

The LGS had the same CZ at a sale price - no haggling - of $469.
$469 + 8% sales tax is $506.52

Why would I want to pay almost $100 just to buy locally?

AR lowers are another example. I can find them online for ~$40 shipped. Locally, they're $69-$89 + tax. Again, why would I pay more?
 
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Why would you order anything without first getting a price? :confused:

If I was really upset I'd go back to the dealer and (calmly) explain my thinking. Ask him if it was a fair deal. He will have his reasons. He might offer you a carrot of some sort. If not, maybe you will better understand his side of the counter.

I probably wouldn't do that. I'd be more likely to blame myself and just chalk it up to a lesson learned and to be more careful next time. My mistake, not his.
 
Your post is confusing to me. It appears that your did your due diligence on the price, except for what your dealers price was. If so how can you be angry with your local LGS?
 
The lgs where I've been receiving my online purchases for about 8 years is closing next week after about 10 years in business.
He is going back to his home state (OK), so I'm losing a friendly owner who greets me by name when i walk into his store.
He was charging me $15 for a transfer, and after looking around, I found another pawn shop only 2 blocks away from him that also charges $15. I hope they're as nice to work with, but only time will tell.
 
Some folks don't understand just how much money is tied up in inventory, rent, taxes etc for the LGS. Some years back I was looking for a used 700 for a donor action for a build. A LGS asked what I was trying to build and then checked inventory. Guy disappeared for awhile came back with a box with about 1/2 inch of dust on it. I ended up buying new (at a substantial discount from that years prices) rather than building. When I checked the build date on the rifle, it'd been gathering dust for 7 years! That's a lot of time to tie up money for no return.
 
I guess I understand, but this is why the local guy won't be around much longer. The internet has changed the face of retail forever.

Gun stores make very little on guns. The only way they stay in business is from ammo and accessories. If they only sold guns, they'd go out of business quick.

I'll bet the deal the OP saw online was less than the local FFL could get it for from his distributor.
 
I basically agree with the OP. The shop knew him as a regular and knows he knows how to shop online for a bargain. They should have treated him well and given him a decent price rather than full list retail, recognizing that he was throwing them some business, to show him that they can be fair and reasonable. I'll buy local and pay a premium for it, within reason. I don't expect to pay full list retail as no frequent gun buyer does, other than those in a totally different economic category than I'm in. Yes, it was the OP's mistake to trust that the shop would return his good will and apparently a mistake he's learned from.
 
One of my local dealers is basically a kitchen table FFL who runs his business out of his basement. He has an excellent online store with the best prices locally but he can't quite meet what the big online outfits sell for. They're below his cost. Plus there is the sales tax thing. But if his OTD price is less than $100 difference between him and the big outfits by the time shipping and a transfer fee is added on I'll order from him. He does my transfers for $25 plus I have a copy of his license on my computer so I can purchase a gun, email his license to the seller, and he'll let me know when it's ready to pick up. Couldn't get much easier.
 
jeffsmith said:
Where will FFL Transfers be done if all the Local Guys Pack up Shop?
Click to expand...

My FFL guy works out of his home on a part time basis and also has another full time job. I assume there are gunsmiths who also do FFL transfers. If there is a vacuum, it will get filled.
 
Golddollar said:
Point to consider. With sales or use taxes now being required on internet sales, that reduces the gap between the local shop and an out of state internet seller.
Click to expand...
No internet sales taxes required in my state as far as buying firearms where I live.


jeffsmith said:
Where will FFL Transfers be done if all the Local Guys Pack up Shop?
Click to expand...
For one, pawn shops.


Firearm businesses are just like any other commodity and business, and subject to the same market forces, despite what some gun owners think. They have to adapt to the changing market place, if they don't they won't survive.
 
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Well I must be "Old School"

I'd still rather deal with Folks I know Face to face than just Online
at least where Firearm Purchases are Involved

I will support actual Gun Shops for as long as I can
Rather than Pawnshops or someones House Business
 
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Appreciate all the input and opinions from you guys and gals. I don't feel angry with the guy, just slightly taken advantage off. I'll still use him to do my transfers and buy the odd box of ammo, just won't ever buy from him at full retail again. He had a golden goose that would buy 2-3 guns a year from him. He decided to gut the goose and kill it, that ones on him.
 
Irn-Bru said:
I've been buying regularly from my local gun store for about a decade now. For the most part I usually buy online and have him transfer the guns for me ($25) but I will buy 2-3 guns directly from him every year too, even though I end up paying more. I also buy a box of target ammo every time I pick up a gun from him that I've bought online.

So this week I had him order me a gun directly from him, figured it would cost a little more, but feel it's important to buy from him direct now and again.

So to cut a long story short. I ended up paying $695 for a gun that I could have bought online, including shipping and transfer fee for $450 out the door. Had it been an extra $100 I probably wouldn't have minded too much. The difference this time was enough for me to NEVER buy another new gun from his store again. I'll still use him as my FFL and buy that box of ammo, but that was the straw that broke the camels back as they say. I'm all for looking out for small business owners, but not to the point I'm gouged.
Click to expand...

Don't you know there are plenty of FFL that operate out of their homes. Many do not sell anything. Their fees are usually less and their hours are very flexible. I have one 2 houses down from me and just walk there. Have 6 more of them in a 2 mile radius that operate out of their homes. Look around for some like that in your area. Not hard to find.
 
Irn-Bru said:
Appreciate all the input and opinions from you guys and gals. I don't feel angry with the guy, just slightly taken advantage off. I'll still use him to do my transfers and buy the odd box of ammo, just won't ever buy from him at full retail again. He had a golden goose that would buy 2-3 guns a year from him. He decided to gut the goose and kill it, that ones on him.
Click to expand...

So, back to the question that several of us have asked,

Did you or did you not confirm a price with your FFL before you had them order the gun????

If you did not, suck it up and quit whining about it.
 
Most of us have learned by our mistakes over the years...........
but if we don't do it again, life is good.

Cuda, wooda, shuda, happen now and then......
we just have to suck it up, learn how to fix the problem and move on.

I also try to give all the local shops business, if possible.
It is nice to just drive1-3 miles to get your equipment, eye to eye.
Sometimes seeing the item is better than a picture and having in in your hand
is priceless.

Some of my shops even let me open and see what the bullets look like, before buying them.
A nice thing when buying an item for the very 1st time.

Some stores are chained but if a Mom & Pop store, they can sometime
drop the price if you ask, before buying.
Chains just have a sale or coupons and they are still making a good profit.
In college, a business retail class first rule was.........
50% Mark Up !!

Don't feel guilty on getting a better deal if possible.
 
Compared to what I've read on this (and many other boards) I wouldn't say he's whining about it.

I've given up doing business locally at all. Period. I'm a high volume (I think) purchaser/builder of firearms. I probably build/buy at least 12-15 yearly. Even the ones I build require a receiver/restricted upper to be built.

We all agree in capitalism, correct? Supply and demand, right? Then let the chips fall where they may. Want to/have to charge outrageous prices/fees? Ok. Wonder what kind of nail place the landlord is going to put in your location by this time next year.

The WORST by far in my opinion (mine and mine alone) are pawnshops. I don't even really consider them legit sources for firearms. Every single one in my area are RIDICULOUS when it comes to prices. The vast majority of firearms they sell are complete junk. They are hocked for a quick buck by desperate folks.

I think the OP understands that "this one's on him". So what? He paid. Folks are acting like he's the first person to come here and vent. Sad thing is I know EXACTLY what he's talking about. I had a guy that did my transfers and I tried to buy at least $200 worth of ammo from him everytime. He kept screwing me up to the point where the transfer fee went up everytime. When it got to $50 I walked. Bye. Was I ticked? You bet.

Point is, who cares if he asked? He didn't. So what? I refuse to believe that NO ONE else on this board has had the same experience at lease once.
 
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I used to use an FFL right here in town , about 2 miles from my house .I've bought a few guns from him , but I mostly used him for transfers . He even told me once , I brought him more transfers than anyone else . Short story , I bought a S&W from a member on this forum . He never stated that he was sending it himself , not through an FFL . My FFL got it , told me he does not accept from individuals . I contacted the guy , he said too bad . My gun sat there , he wouldn't send it back , no FFL . Anyways , I gave up , told him to keep it . I have NEVER stepped back in that shop . I found another FFL close by , $10 cheaper on transfers , and extremely honest , and accepts from individuals . I am good for 1-2 transfers a month , so he really missed out . The bad thing ? I ran the gun and it was not stolen . I called the ATF , they said just transfer it to an FFL accepts from individuals . He wouldn't do it , said it would be on his books . Anyone out there top that ? The gun ? A m3914 LNIB .
 
Irn-Bru said:
Appreciate all the input and opinions from you guys and gals. I don't feel angry with the guy, just slightly taken advantage off. I'll still use him to do my transfers and buy the odd box of ammo, just won't ever buy from him at full retail again. He had a golden goose that would buy 2-3 guns a year from him. He decided to gut the goose and kill it, that ones on him.
Click to expand...

I would at least talk to him politely first about your pricing issue.

You likely do not know his supplier. I do business at a couple local shops and each draws off a different warehouse.

One place is a very high volume shop and you can get great pricing on hunting guns as they sell hundreds a year. They call the warehouse and find out there cost and then add whatever.

Second place is very much a hand gun and AR shop. This shop gets better prices than the first if its available.

Both shops really cannot compete against each other as there suppliers are different.

If your guy is relatively small or doesn't sell much his warehouse pricing may not be the best.
 
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