Don't know much about Colts

[Peak53]

But my buddy just brought back a trunk full of antique firearms from aging Grandma that wanted them gone. He is going to try to learn about them then give to his sons. Not for sale.

The haul included such things as very old derringers, a six-shot revolving barrel pistol, an 1862 US Cavalry sword with scabbard, assorted non-descript revolvers, two muzzleloading percussion pistols and a flintlock pistol, all of which looked to be about .60 caliber, a Lee Enfield, an old LC Smith double probably damascus, a bunch of rifles I couldn't identify AND a Colt Peacemaker.

It has 1871 and 1975 dates, serial 169xxx, seems to be in good condition with some patina. Can anybody help us out understanding what this is? Maybe approximate value? Thanks in advance.

 

[Bullet Bob]

If you'll tell us the serial number on the frame ahead of the trigger guard that would help a lot. A picture would be even better.

 

[WR Moore]

I expect the dates you mention are patent dates and have little relationship to when actually made. As post 2 notes, the full serial number can produce much more information.

Revolving barrel pistols are generally referred to as "pepper boxes". Probably many makers over decades.

Percussion Deringers (so marked as the makers name) could be worth money if authentic.

 

[Inusuit]

Without the last three digits of the serial number, I can only come close, so maybe 1897.

You can search for the date here:

Colt's Manufacturing LLC
I'm sure you meant 1875, not 1975.

Do all the serial numbers match? Should be one on the front (muzzle) end of the trigger guard, another just ahead of it on the frame, and on the bottom of the butt strap.

Dang, looks like it's stamped "COLT'S FRONTIER SIX SHOOTER" on the barrel? That means the caliber is .44-40 and a desirable variant of the Colt Single Action Army. Production began in 1877.

Condition is very good. Screw heads are not buggered, grips aren't worn.

If you Google Colt Frontier Six Shooter for sale, several pop up. I saw some between $2900 and $6500.

 

[Peak53]

Thanks for the input. I just copied down the serial number as given to me by owner. I'll check it out again tomorrow with my reading glasses AND a magnifying glass looking for all numbers. Like I said, such a gun is unknown to me.

I know there are a lot of fake swords out there, but it and all the guns were in a Texas ranching family for generations, so there's pretty good provenance.

 

[s&wchad]

Nice gun!
That's a .44-40 Colt SAA with a 5-1/2" barrel, built on a smokeless powder frame. It needs a proper cleaning.

 

[lestert357]

It’s a Colt Single Action Army and in this case a Colt Frontier Six Shooter in .44-40 or .44 WCF caliber manufactured in 1897. Even though it has the cross pin cylinder pin retainer which originated in 1896, it is NOT made for smokeless powder, but rather for black powder only. It appears that most of the original finish is gone but the gun exhibits tight seams and sharp edges and appears in original well used condition. The grips are correct and very likely original to the gun. The front sight, cylinder beveling, CFSS marking and all configuration features appear correct for the era. The .44-40 is a very desirable caliber in the Single Action Army and the gun is fairly valuable, probably in the $3000 - $3500 range or maybe more if there is some remaining finish visible after a good cleaning (gun oil & soft toothbrush). It should NOT be refinished or fooled with in any way unless the mechanics require work and if so should only be done by a competent gunsmith.

 

[Fishinfool]

I would be cautious when it comes to cleaning up that Colt. To a lot of serious big dollar Colt collectors, over cleaning / removal of the original patina can result in a big $$ hit. Also note that even though it has the "smokeless powder" style cylinder retention screw, I don't believe Colt SAA's were proofed for smokeless powder loads until around 1900. Lots of info available about these early SAA's on the Colt Forum.

Larry

 

[Peak53]

I advised the owner to just wipe down everything with an oily rag for now.

 

[Peak53]

After a second look at the Colt, the serial number clearly matches on frame, trigger guard, and barrel. The dates on the left side also clearly show 1871 patent and a November 1975 date. This must be a late second generation, correct? It has significant bluing loss, but the action and lockup are solid. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot this gun with CAS loads. Right? Any other input?

 

[444 Magnum]

Patent dates should look like this:

PAT SEPT 19. 1871
JULY 2. 72 JAN 19. 75 {rampant colt here}

Those are 1872 and 1875 patent dates.

What is the whole serial number- if it is all numbers, then it's 1st generation. Starting with 1 up to 357859.

If it has an SA in the serial number, then it's later.
2nd gen: 0001SA to 73205SA
3rd generation: 80000SA to SA99999

The serial number should date it for you. Colt.com has serial number archives. 169,001-169,999 date to 1897.

As previously stated, it could use a gentle cleaning with oil and a rag/toothbrush-grips and all.

.44-40 is a popular caliber but 5.5" is the least popular barrel length. The older the pistol, the better. 1897 is at the end of the black powder range.

Cleaned up, I think Terry's price ranges are good.

 

[willy]

Colt model P
Barrel marking is roll marked
( COLT FRONTIER SIX SHOOTER )
This marking was used from 1890-1922-23

Starting in 1923 ( 44/40 ) was added to the roll marking.

Cross bolt cylinder pin catch started in 1896.
So your gun was made between 1896 and 1923.
Unless it was rebarreled at some point.
Then you need to check the s# .

 

[lestert357]

This must be a late second generation, correct? It has significant bluing loss, but the action and lockup are solid. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot this gun with CAS loads. Right? Any other input?

No, it’s NOT a 2nd generation SAA, it’s an original antique 1st generation late BLACK POWDER SAA. Shooting smokeless CAS loads is NOT recommended.

 

[Peak53]

Thank you guys for clearing this up for me. My friend will be VERY happy

 

[LVSteve]

What sort of Lee Enfield did he snag? Is it complete with all the wood or has it been shortened and the wood hacked to make a deer rifle? Decent Enfields have been fetching money on the milsurp market lately.

 

[Peak53]

LVSteve
I know even less about Enfields than I do about Colts . However, it appears to be in original military condition with full length stock and uncut barrel. It shows the expected wear and tear and dings of a well-used 100+ year old rifle but is not rusted. Did not remove the bolt and look through the bore.

 

[Pig Hunter]

Is there any engraving on the side plates of the LC Smith? Even a lower grade gun can be desirable.

 

[Peak53]

Pig Hunter
The LC Smith double is quite a specimen but does not have any engraving. Will make an impressive wall hanger.