Early Bekearts - What is (and isn't) Known

[bruce5781]

Just firmed up the deal on my "shipped" Bekeart. Thanks for the info and helping me make up my mind.

Bruce

 

[JSR III]

I have owned #138977 stock #801 for about 20 years now. I bought it at a farm auction in Northern Illinois. It had not had an easy life prior to my owning it, although it is very sound mechanically, aesthetically, it lacks the beauty of it's brethren. I am sure that generations of young Illinois farm boys enjoyed it for it's designated purpose. It undoubtedly provided squirrels, and rabbits for the pot, and eliminated various vermin.

I have not lettered it as I did not think it was one of the Beheart few. If you could shed some light on it, I would be most appreciative.

Thanks.
WR

138,977 /801 shipped on 8/25/1911 to Norvel Shapleigh in St. Louis MO.

 

[JSR III]

Just picked this up today at a local gun show. I was surprised to see it there. #525488 doesn't look too bad for being around 79 years old. No number on the bottom of the stocks.

As others have stated, butt stock numbers or stock sequence numbers as I have termed them, according to my database, appear to have stopped within the 490 M.W. Robinson shipped guns in 1914.

I don't have 525,488 in my database however, 525,002 shipped 1/28/1931 and 525,668 shipped on 6/15/1931.

While 525,600 is reported to be the serial number when recessed chambers appeared, due to S&W's policy of not doing anything in serial number order, you will find guns with lower serial numbers with recessed chambers and guns with higher serial numbers not having recessed chambers.

The other factoid to remember is that by the time serial numbers reached the 525,XXX range, the .22/32 HFT's were losing favor due to the introduction of the K 22 Outdoorsmans and the 4" barreled .22/32 Kit Guns.

While I do show a few 4" guns with lower numbers in the high 400's, (could be modifications) by the time they reached the 529's and 530's I show mostly 4" kit guns.

If I missed anyone's questions, please feel free to post again. I have close to 2,000 guns listed in my database and just love discussing these neat little guns.

 

[JSR III]

Was the other box you saw associated with a specifc serial number? If the "Bekeart" labels were factory applied, the question also could be asked whether there was one label used for those guns actually shipped to Bekeart and another "non-Bekeart" label used for the others. But if all the labels that left the factory were the "Bekeart" type, I'd expect to sooner or later see a box with a label that had that "advertising" cut out or otherwise redacted.

I own one box from the 300,XXX range that has a light green end label.

It reads:

SMITH & WESSON
HAND 22 / 32 EJECTOR
BLUED 6 INCH

 

[Hondo44]

Pictured below is an example of the box from the ultimate in "Bekeartness" in a .22/.32 Hand Ejector,
being that it's from the inaugural batch made in 1911 and also one of those actually shipped to the
Phil. B. Bekeart Co. in San Francisco.

It reads: S&W 22 Long Rifle cartridge Heavy Frame.

Photo by Jim Fisher

Photo of April 1912 Adv. in this thread, post #48.

 

[bruce5781]

Sort of an interesting one here. Serial range 276xxx. Note the hammer and grips.

 

[bruce5781]

I don't have it in hand yet, should be winging its was toward me as we speak. I will check the serial number against the grips though.

 

[Hondo44]

Sort of an interesting one here. Serial range 276xxx. Note the hammer and grips.QUOTE]

That's a unique hammer and looks professionally made. Definitely an ergonomic improvement over the original.

From the s/n and lack of the MADE IN USA stamp on the right front frame side, a 1919-20 frame production is indicated.
Although the target grips are factory, they are post Aug.29, 1923 vintage due to their convex tops and lack of medallions.
Does the serial # penciled on the back of the right grip jive with the gun's s/n?

Also the Patridge front sight and sq notch rear are of the post Aug.29, 1923, vintage.

This could be a 1919-20 produced frame that was not assembled until after Aug.29, 1923 which is what I suspect.

 

[Gaffer]

I have a S&W 22/32 Kit gun. serial no. 207970. The condition is awful as it road for years under the front seat of a deputy sheriff in a chamois bag, thus all traces of bluing are gone Any Idea as to year of manufacturer?

 

[Hondo44]

I have a S&W 22/32 Kit gun. serial no. 207970. The condition is awful as it road for
years under the front seat of a deputy sheriff in a chamois bag, thus all traces of bluing are gone Any Idea as to
year of manufacturer?

Is there a letter prefix to the serial # on the butt?

If not, the # is way too early for a Kit gun which began at about 534XXX in 1935. Therefore it's no doubt a
.22/32 Heavy frame Target with a Kit Gun 4" barrel replacement or a shortened original 6" barrel.

Does it have a mushroom shaped extractor rod knob?

 

[Gaffer]

Hondo44: The bbl is 6" The flat on the bottom of the bbl has letterB and then the six serial numbers that are the same as on the inside frame grip. There is a 4 digit number on the flat of the of the frame where the crane closes. The bottom of the grips has area the appears to be where the numbers were ground off. I took some pics but don't have a camera that will show that clearly up close. From what you have said I don't know now what I do have. Here are the photos:
and

 

[bruce5781]

I think it was the "Kit gun" part that was misleading...that sort of implies a 4" barrel. Looks like a 22/32 heavy frame target...much earlier than the kit guns.

 

[Gaffer]

What is the significance of the letter "B" in front of the 6 digit serial number on the frame where the crane meets?

 

[series guy]

That usually means the gun was shipped with a blued finish.

 

[Hondo44]

Hondo44: The bbl is 6" The flat on the bottom of the bbl has letterB and then the six serial numbers
that are the same as on the inside frame grip. There is a 4 digit number on the flat of the of the frame where the crane closes.
The bottom of the grips has area the appears to be where the numbers were ground off. I took some pics but don't have a camera
that will show that clearly up close. From what you have said I don't know now what I do have.

What is the significance of the letter "B" in front of the 6 digit serial number on the frame where the crane meets?

Gaffer,

1. Kit Guns all steel models only have 4" barrels and after the war 2" barrels. Only target models have 6" barrels. Now that your photos
cleared that up, we know your gun is originally configured!

Even the serial number; there was no serial # ground off the butt because on this model with target grips and a few others that have grips
covering the grip frame butt, the frame serial # is placed on the front grip strap as is yours, instead of the butt. However, if you meant the
bottom of the left side wood grip, for your serial # 207970 it's very likely to be one of the first 3000 of this model assembled, therefor should
have 4 digit production sequence # stamped in the wood. It reads correctly with the gun lying on its right side and the muzzle pointing to the left.
Can you make out any vestige of a number with a magnifying glass and good, bright light, probably beginning with a 2?

A 'B' in front of the barrel serial # indicates the gun was originally produced with a blue finish.

The matching 4 digit # in the frame 'yoke cutout' and on the yoke are factory assembly parts matching #s and of no other use now,
but they also match the number on the inside of the side plate.

So you have a righteous .22/32 Heavy Frame Target. Congrats!

 

[JSR III]

207,970 is one of the 490 guns shipped to M.W. Robinson in five shipments sent out in January, February and March of 1914. These guns had stock sequence numbers on the bottom of the left stock panel that has no correlation to the serial number. The number tells the owner the order in which the gun was assembled.

 

[JSR III]

Sort of an interesting one here. Serial range 276xxx. Note the hammer and grips.

That serial number would put the gun in the mid 1919 period. Guns around that time have regulation police style stocks. Some have gold medallions and some do not. The early guns will and the later guns will not.

 

[Hondo44]

Gaffer,

We neglected to suggest that you look for a matching serial number penciled on the inside of the right stock like this along the bottom edge:

Observing serial #s for accuracy or even existence, especially on penciled stocks, requires magnification, bright light, and an attitude that it is there!

 

[Gaffer]

Thank you one and all. That is info that I really appreciate and now I know that it is a keeper. I will leave to my Number 2 son who has two sons of his own. Thank you again!

 

[bruce5781]

That serial number would put the gun in the mid 1919 period. Guns around that time have regulation police style stocks. Some have gold medallions and some do not. The early guns will and the later guns will not.

Would you have any thoughts on the "S187" on the bottom of the stocks ? I don't believe it's factory, but had hoped someone had run into this sort of thing before.

Thanks,
Bruce