Erfurt Luger advice needed

[schutzen-jager]

[In between the wars the Army was also using Savage 1907 pistols in .32 ACP bought in 1915.] - ??? -

{ they were actually byf 42 P.08 Mausers that were delivered to us instead of the German Army)
actualy last of commercial , not military production for contract sales -!!!

 

[Kurusu]

[In between the wars the Army was also using Savage 1907 pistols in .32 ACP bought in 1915.] - ??? -

Bought in 1915. Germany declared war on Portugal on March 1916, before that we were non beligerant

Edit. I'll try to make it more clear. They were bought before we entered the war and were used thereafter until we reequiped the Army with 9mm pistols. Is that clear enough for you now?

{ they were actually byf 42 P.08 Mausers that were delivered to us instead of the German Army)
actualy last of commercial , not military production for contract sales -!!!

Kindly explain then, why those "commercials" have German military acceptance marks instead of commercial proofmarks that you can find even in the wartime German police pistols. And also why a P.08 marked pistol in the m block with the serial # 350 was Portuguese while the P.08 marked pistol with the serial # 15 was German Army and why both have the eagle over swastika fire proof on the right side of the barrel and 2 x eagle over 655 and again the eagle over swastika on the right side of the receiver.

 

[Kurusu]

Now why would you burn them, rather than shoot them?

I burned them inside my P.08.

 

[2152hq]

;e.g-the last time I put it back together I had to use a screwdriver (wrapped in cloth) to get the take-down lever to go down. ...

Breaking it down to a point where you would need a punch tool to remove the smaller pins, all the parts look good, as if it was cleaned properly within the last few decades. ...

Always have the bbl and toggle assembly pushed all the way to the rear when pulling the TD lever down or try to push it back into position on re-assembly.
Additionally on re-assembly make sure the side plate is installed correctly and is sitting all the way down. If it's not, it's usually the front leg that is up high just a little and the TD can't be pushed easily back into position.

Unless there is a real need to disassemble parts further than the Field disassembly of the breech, toggle and frame, it's not generally worth the effort.
If they are damaged or worn and need attention that's different, then the disassembly is needed.
Plus there are a couple parts that can be damaged trying to remove and/or replace if you're not familiar with them.
Most are straight forward gunsmith removal/install types though.

Have fun,,very unique gun the Luger is.


FWIW, you don't have to dry fire them to let/relax the firing pin down.
With the unloaded pistol cocked, magazine removed,,let the toggle down slowly keeping a grasp on the toggles.
As the breech closes, at a point approx where the breech block is about 1/8" from being closed you'll feel a slight hang up in the forward motion.
That is the firing pin being engaged by the sear and being cocked.

To bypass that cocking action simply hold the trigger back as the breech block passes that point.
The firing pin will not be cocked.
The breech will close and the firing pin will be down & uncocked.

(It's not a good idea to dry fire a Luger anyway. The firing pin tip is rather fragile in the design. I don't recommend dry fire on any firearm.
On a pistol like a Luger, if you must to check function for instance,,a flat faced hardwood dowel held firmly down the bore against the breech face buffers the firing pin quite well)

 

[runscott]

Always have the bbl and toggle assembly pushed all the way to the rear when pulling the TD lever down or try to push it back into position on re-assembly.
Additionally on re-assembly make sure the side plate is installed correctly and is sitting all the way down. If it's not, it's usually the front leg that is up high just a little and the TD can't be pushed easily back into position.

Unless there is a real need to disassemble parts further than the Field disassembly of the breech, toggle and frame, it's not generally worth the effort.
If they are damaged or worn and need attention that's different, then the disassembly is needed.
Plus there are a couple parts that can be damaged trying to remove and/or replace if you're not familiar with them.
Most are straight forward gunsmith removal/install types though.

Have fun,,very unique gun the Luger is.


FWIW, you don't have to dry fire them to let/relax the firing pin down.
With the unloaded pistol cocked, magazine removed,,let the toggle down slowly keeping a grasp on the toggles.
As the breech closes, at a point approx where the breech block is about 1/8" from being closed you'll feel a slight hang up in the forward motion.
That is the firing pin being engaged by the sear and being cocked.

To bypass that cocking action simply hold the trigger back as the breech block passes that point.
The firing pin will not be cocked.
The breech will close and the firing pin will be down & uncocked.

(It's not a good idea to dry fire a Luger anyway. The firing pin tip is rather fragile in the design. I don't recommend dry fire on any firearm.
On a pistol like a Luger, if you must to check function for instance,,a flat faced hardwood dowel held firmly down the bore against the breech face buffers the firing pin quite well)

Thanks - that's all great stuff. Also, it makes me feel better because last night I was able to figure out most of the things you described. One thing that was different is that I am unable to pull the toggle assembly all the way back. When I said I got it into a position where it could be dry fired, I wasn't actually dry-firing it - I was releasing the toggle as you described. I understand what you are saying about taking it completely apart and the problems that could cause for a new Luger guy like me. I also noticed what you described about the side-plate - quite a quirky piece.

I'm going to start by just cleaning it without breaking it down further, then trying to fire it once the mec-gar mags arrive. I decided to take a break from it today, as my thumb feels like I've been pulling nails by hand. Instead I enjoyed a very pleasant morning at the range shooting my new P320 M17 Bravo and my old 1984 P226.

 

[Andyd]

We have used the P.08 as a service pistol from 1943 to 1961(they were actually byf 42 P.08 Mausers that were delivered to us instead instead of the German Army) as the main sidearm, and as a secondary sidearm up to 1975, after we adopted the P.38 in 1961.

Our own defense industries(now gone I'm afraid) used a 115 grs(7,45 grams) bullet that was tailored for the P.08 and was NATO certified. They were of excellent quality.

Still got a box left from a 1999 lot .

I burned thousands of these things.

My point wasn't so much that 124 grain bullets were to be used but to give an idea of the powerlevel and energy that the 9 mm Parabellum was originally loaded to. Here are the numbers in lb-ft: 39.18 mkg = 283.4 lb-ft.

By the time that Mauser had started to manufacture the frames for the P.08, the metallurgy had improved significantly but in WWI vintage Lugers, I would stay with a moderate load.

 

[Kurusu]

@ Andyd.

You definetely have a point there. The truth is, that even If I do have a WWI 1916 DWM P.08, I very seldomly shoot it. And when I do I use my mild reloads.

 

[Andyd]

@ Andyd.

You definetely have a point there. The truth is, that even If I do have a WWI 1916 DWM P.08, I very seldomly shoot it. And when I do I use my mild reloads.

I even load the ammo for my 1942 Mauser only to moderate levels. The days when I loaded up .44 Magnum to +P+P+ and shot it in the Super Redhawk are long gone, even gave that SRH to my son at Christmas - with some of that ammo that was left.

 

[runscott]

Here is the chewed-up top of my magazine, while inserted. It's even crooked.

 

[Kurusu]

Here is the chewed-up top of my magazine, while inserted. It's even crooked.

Yep! That magazine is the likely culprit. The lips can be reformed, but it takes a good expert. The Mec-gar is the way to go. Or... an original late type. But they will cost you.


On the left a DWM from 1915, on the right a WWII by Mauser.

 

[CZU]

Could you post some pics of the Luger and the magazine?

 

[runscott]

Here are a few:

 

[runscott]

New Mec-gar mag arrived today - problem solved.

Comparing the springs....there is no comparison. The spring on the old mag was shot and the lips were bent and chewed.

 

[CZU]

I'm not surprised that the magazine was the issue after seeing it. Don't discard it, it may still be salvageable. Go over to Lugerforum.com and look up G.T., he can work miracles with magazines. The mag you pictured would be the correct era for your Erfurt sans the ugly white base.

 

[runscott]

Thanks - he has already given me pointers on breaking down the gun.

BTW, it shoots pretty good. Mag arrived today and I went straight to the range. After 4 rounds at 21' to sight it in and get used to the recoil, here's a 30' target, 10 rounds.

 

[Walter Rego]

I had read many recommendations for the Winchester White Box 124 grain 9mm ammo for the P08 pistols and that was my choice when I shot mine. It worked flawlessly. It's probably a combination of the velocity and recoil impulse of the 124 grain bullet that the gun was designed for. There are probably other brands that will work satisfactorily, likely the S&B, Fiocchi and GECO. Glad to hear that the Mec-Gar magazine solved the problem.