First Class vs. Economy Class Handguns

[Sigmund Sauer]

There are ~75 Self Defense Handgun makers I could find. Task is to divide them into three tiers - kind of like First Class (most desirable), Business Class (very solid), Economy Class (might get us there perfectly in some cases, but if we had more money, we'd rather traveling First or Business)
To avoid connotations of price being the only criteria, I will be calling the Classes A, B and C.

We're looking only at the best gun from each maker - whichever that gun is, in your opinion. I will start listing universally acknowledged flagships behind the maker - please help me along with that, too. Let me know if anything should be shifted around.

This list is only there to help organize things in the head of the total novice. A novice in a country where you are only allowed one handgun. Or two, like in Germany. It can only be compiled by you experts, but it is not intended for you experts.

The best gun from the best maker in Class B has to be worse than the best gun from the worst maker in Class A.

The best gun from the best maker in Class C has to be worse than the best gun from the worst maker in Class C.

DISCLAIMER: In some cases, the C Class guns will be perfectly fine and reliable. But it would be very unlikely, that if guns were all free, or if - like in some countries - people can only have one handgun, they would choose one from that group.

Of course, nothing beats holding the gun in your hands, shooting it and knowing which one -to use a Harry Potter analogy- is your wand!

Class A Handgun Makers in no particular order (we would choose these makers over Class B and C even if all guns from all three classes cost exactly the same)

Manurhin (France) r (flagship: MR-73)
Glock (flagship: Glock 17 Gen4)
Kahr (flagship: K9)
Sig Sauer (flagship: p226)
CZ (flagship: CZ 75)
Smith & Wesson r (flagship: Model 27 or 686? )
Walther (flagship: PPK)
Ruger r (flagship: Redhawk)
Beretta (flagship: 92FS)
IWI (Israel) (flagship: Desert Eagle)
Colt r (flagship: M1911 Special Combat Government)
Springfield Armory (flagship: 1911 Loaded or TRP)
Heckler und Koch
FN
Remington
Magnum Research r
Cabot Guns
Korth (Germany) r
Seecamp r
NAA r
Freedom Arms r
Caracal (UAE)
Steyr (Austria)
Sphinx (Switzerland)
Dan Wesson r
Coonan
Daewoo (South Korea)
Detonics
Infinity
Lionheart
Boberg Arms
Uberti r
F.lli Pietta r
Les Baer
Wilson Combat
Ed Brown
Guncrafter Industries
Nighthawk Custom
STI r
Bond Arms
Tanfoglio (Italy)
Valtro (flagship: 1998A1)

Class B Handgun Makers in no particular order (if we could only have one gun, we would only buy these guns if none of the comparable Class A guns were available) :

Kimber
Taurus (Brazil) r (flagship: PT92)
Browning
Rossi (Brazil) r
Arcus (Bulgaria) r
Charter Arms r
Auto Ordnance
FMK
Hi-Point (flagship: OD 45ACP with laser)
Kel-Tec (flagship: subK2)
Armscor/Rock Island Armory r
Canik (Turkey)
Diamondback
Stoeger
Girsan Yavuz (Turkey)
Bersa (Argentina) r (flagship: Thunder .380)
Arsenal Firearms
Heritage r

Am assuming the below are Class B, but I just don't know enough about them. Any Class A or Class Cs among the following? Otherwise, I'll just leave them in Class B:

BUL (Israel)
Zastava (Serbia) r
S.A.M. (Philippines) r
KORA Brno (Czech) r
Alfa Proj (Czech) r
American Classic (Philippines)
MAC (Philippines)
Grand Power (Slovakia)
Norinco (China) r
Weihrauch/Arminius (Germany) r

Class C Handgun Makers in no particular order (we would only buy these if we couldn't get our hands on anything comparable from A or B. If there is something in B that you consider worse than something in C, let's move the guy from B down, rather than moving the guy from C up. C is underpopulated at the moment)

Chiappa (Italy) r
Cobra r
Accu-Tek
Bryco/Jennings/Jimenez
Comanche (Argentina) r
Phoenix Arms
S.P.S. (Spain)
High Standard (Texas, not Connecticut)
SCCY

("r" after the make denotes they currently make revolvers also)

Please also tell me if I am missing any contemporary (not interested in defunct) handgun gun makers from anywhere in the world.

I will keep editing the list using your feedback.

Thnx.

 

[NYlakesider]

You were doing fairly good in your first list for the most part, no way in heck would I have included Taurus!

The best that can be said for that company is there product reputation is very spotty!

 

[pj151]

Korth and see camp should be on the top list.

 

[amazingflapjack]

Taurus makes some very nice guns that are good hunting-target-SD, etc. at reasonable prices-however, this might not be the place to get objective feedback on that brand, as S&W used to own them.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

Thanks very much for this first round. If there is a consensus that Taurus is more Economy Class than First Class, I will edit my post to reflect that?

If more people agree that Korth and Seecamp should be up there in First Class, I will move them, too.

Let me know .

Cheers.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

Korth goes to the top of the top list, just after Casull (Freedom Arms). Seecamp is there, also. Possibly NAA, also - I myself do not know. As stated, Taurus does not belong on that list.

 

[Muss Muggins]

This list isn't going to work without assigning era's to the respective manufacturers . . . Best manufacturer in one era may be the worst in another. Look at Kimber, for one example. Once great, now average.

 

[Decker]

This list isn't going to work without assigning era's to the respective manufacturers . . . Best manufacturer in one era may be the worst in another. Look at Kimber, for one example. Once great, now average.

Plus, even the "Top List" manufactures make ho-hum models that can tag along with the reputation of their better guns.

One thing I don't think is arguable, and that is that Korth is definitely a Top List maker, and might even be in it's own category above that.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

OK, I have included Freedom Arms and have moved Korth, NAA and Seecamp to First Class. Am moving Taurus to Economy.

If someone seconds moving Kimber to Economy (either in post or by "liking" Muss Muggins' post), I will move them down.

Thanks very much for this first round of feedback. Very useful.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

This list isn't going to work without assigning era's to the respective manufacturers . . . Best manufacturer in one era may be the worst in another. Look at Kimber, for one example. Once great, now average.

I'm looking at ONLY right NOW - 2015. Thanks.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

Whoops - my buddies are already telling me I forgot two makers:

Boberg Arms

Bond Arms

Where would those go? 1st Class or Economy?

 

[reddog81]

Re: "in their best models, these makers focus really mainly on quality and price is only an afterthought. "
I'm pretty sure most of the manufacturers on the top list would be disqualified if you stick with this qualification.

If you are looking for the best gun by each manufacturer you should probably be looking at the models geared toward target shooters. Most military, police dept., or SD buyers are looking for something reasonably priced that will fill their needs - not the cheapest model but conversely not the best model available either.

With that said I would add Manurhin to the top list. Their MR73 was a special forces revolver built to withstand 150 rounds of full power .357 Magnum every day indefinitely.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

Re: "in their best models, these makers focus really mainly on quality and price is only an afterthought. "
I'm pretty sure most of the manufacturers on the top list would be disqualified if you stick with this qualification.
If you are looking for the best gun by each manufacturer you should probably be looking at the models geared toward target shooters. Most military, police dept., or SD buyers are looking for something reasonably priced that will fill their needs - not the cheapest model but conversely best model available either.
With that said I would add Manurhin to the top list. Their MR73 was a special forces revolver built to withstand 150 rounds of full power .357 Magnum every day indefinitely.

My goodness! Just looked at those Manurhin guns, and I know what I want for Christmas!!!! I had never heard of them, but that looks like ultimate quality.

Understood what you said about price consciousness - will edit my original post to reflect that. Thanks much.

 

[Marshwheeling]

Are you on the fence about Charter Arms? I see it in two locations.
No matter, it probably does not belong in the boutique class. economy is a better bet.

 

[dawggunner]

SCCY in Economy Class?

 

[GtownGeorge]

Armscor/Rock Island Armory. Probably sells more 1911's than anyone else, needs to be added to list. I cannot be objective as to what category as I love my RIA 9mm 1911.

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

Armscor/Rock Island Armory. Probably sells more 1911's than anyone else, needs to be added to list. I cannot be objective as to what category as I love my RIA 9mm 1911.

I just watched hickok45 reviewing it. He really appreciated the gun, but definitely always stated "for its price" etc. Would you be offended if I put it in Economy, tentatively?

 

[Sigmund Sauer]

SCCY in Economy Class?

Done, thank you very much.

 

[GtownGeorge]

I just watched hickok45 reviewing it. He really appreciated the gun, but definitely always stated "for its price" etc. Would you be offended if I put it in Economy, tentatively?

I let others decide, yes it is cheap, yes it goes bang everytime. I just do not buy guns because they are pretty, and a RIA will never be called pretty. I did some research and since it was my first 1911 and it was in a caliber that's cheap compared to .45ACP I bought it. I will never sell it, my grandson has his eyes on it.

 

[ISCS Yoda]

Are you on the fence about Charter Arms? I see it in two locations.
No matter, it probably does not belong in the boutique class. economy is a better bet.

Besides the fact that in the 1970s the infamous Son of Sam murders in NYC were accomplished with a Charter Arms .44 Special (Bulldog?), and while I have read some decent reviews of late, I have never seen Charter Arms categorized as handmade "luxury" firearms or "boutique" anything. Economy class at best, I'm thinking, but maybe there's some nuance in what Charter Arms does that I am missing. I can't wait to hear comments on that.

As for Bond Arms, they make extremely high quality derringers, but if you're betting your life on a Bond Arms derringer good luck with that. They are very difficult to operate or shoot well compared to what you can do with a small revolver or pistol.

As for Para-Ordnance, it is now a Cerberus/Freedom/Remington company and I cannot imagine that Remington is doing anything with those guns except normal manufacturing. If they make them by hand somebody please let me know.