FN, a better target bullet?

[Nevada Ed]

I generally use the plated RN FMJ type bullets in my 9mm for target work
as well as a few HP bullets tossed in, now and then.

I know that in my lead WC, 38 spl. bullets, that the holes are a LOT easier to see
and am wondering if any of you like the 9mm Flat Points and if
they feed ok, without any problems feeding into the chambers?

I have shot the Xtreme 135 and Speer 147 TMJ but they both had a very small flat spot
and not the large FN design that I see with Xtreme and the Berry line of bullets.

I will probably try the Berry line first, since they are in the Reno stores.

Thank you for any advise.

 

[venomballistics]

I like them as a general purpose bullet.
A flat point is a no nonsense means of improving energy deposit with absolute reliability.
It's really just going to be a function of your guns ability to digest them as the metplat is enlarged.

 

[robertrwalsh]

Most semi-autos will not reliably feed a full wadcutter. I am not even aware of anybody that makes one for 9mm.

 

[Nemo288]

Not quite the same situation as I am a revolvero, but my favorite bullet in the 44 special is a 240 gr. PFP made by the now late lamented Rainier bullet company.
The Berry and Xtreme are similar but do not have the slightly hollow base of the Rainier and seem to be a little harder especially the Xtreme.
The holes in paper are sharp and easy to both see and measure.
Revolvers are rarely stuffed with round nose or FMJ bullets, at least around here.

If your pistol will function with one of those PFP bullets, I think you will like them.
They are great for targets and better than RN FMJ for defense if God Forbid should arise.

Here is a very quickly done, slightly out of focus, comparison of some plated 44 bullets from the makers we are discussing.
The Berry has a bigger meplat than the X-Treme.
Notice the hollow bases of the Speer and Rainier numbers.
The Speer is very soft and sold as a defense bullet.
I believe the hollow base assists in bumping the bullets up in diameter to fit chamber throats in revolvers and the bore of all guns.
I use the Speer and Rainier hollow points in 44 special carry loads.
They all shoot very well once a golden load is found.

 

[Fishinfool]

Might try a box of factory Winchester 115 grain with the jacketed flat point bullet. I believe it is part of the USA line. See if it feeds in your guns.

Both my Glocks and my CZ's feed TC and SWC bullet profiles. My BHP, not so much.

Larry

 

[Forrest r]

You have a lot going on when it comes to the different bullet shapes, styles & designs when it comes to the 9mm's.

Myself, I aways look at the throating of the bbl or lack thereof when selecting bullet designs for the semi-auto's. A picture of a non-throated 9mm bbl.

Non-throated bbl's tend to do better with standard fmj type bullets. I'm not saying you can't use or shoot other designs (fn/swc/etc). The lack of throating simply makes it harder to reload the swc's, fn & wfn style bullets. The smaller the window to find the "sweet" spot in the oal to get these types of bullet to not only feed reliably Getting them in the non existent leade aiding in accuracy is extremely hard.

A throated bbl like this has no issues with any fn, swc, wfn style bullet.

It's also a lot easier to find accurate loads with a throted bbl.

 

[Forrest r]

Any bullet with a pronounced shoulder will cut clean holes in paper. Both of these bullets cut clean holes that are easy to score in both the 9mm's & 38spl's.

Old meets new:
The bullet on the left is a "parlor" indoor bullet, 115gr for the 38spl. It was designed in the 1930's for short range indoor practice using lite loads in the 38spl's. It's a modified Himmelwright design, they didn't need the long nose on such a short bullet.

The bullet on the right is a modern Himmelwright design 2016/2017. It's a 140gr bullet that is made for both the 9mm & 38spl. It has no lube grooves & is designed for powder coating.

Both those bullets are accurate & do extremely well in both the 9mm's and 38spl's.

 

[Forrest r]

This is the fh style bullet that I use the most in the 9mm's. I cast them and choose to cast nothing but hp's simply because the hp's weigh 125gr and the solid nosed fn's weigh 131gr.

All my 9mm bbl's are throated and the bullet pictured above matches the leade in those throats making the extremely accurate.

10-shot groups @ 50ft bench rested with that bullet pictured above.

My pair of nm 1911, the top 1911 (9mm) shot that group when I was testing different loads one day several years ago.

 

[WR Moore]

Back in the last century, the Air Force did a study on improving the accuracy/lethality of 9 mm ball type ammunition. During their testing, they discovered that a flat nose design greatly improved accuracy and did, within the limits of ball ammo, improve lethality.

Hornady made the test bullets and then capitalized on the results to introduce their flat point FMJ bullets in 9 mm & .45. They later developed the HAP line of competition bullets.

I've been happily using the Berry flat points for decades. They do use a bit more case room than RN.

 

[Paul in Nevada]

All the 9mm Berry's and XTreme bullets I have loaded have been the RN design. I did try some Berry's FP 180's in 40 but my P226 choked on at least one in every magazine. Maybe a COL problem or something with the gun. I haven't had time to sort it out.
It's been mentioned before how Berry's lists COL for all their bullets. With a few I have compared their COL to what was listed in other manuals and the Berry's number seemed a little long. Their RN 147's in 9mm take up the full length of a Dillon case gauge but they still functioned fine for me in several pistols. It's their bullet, I guess they would know. I bet the FP 124's would feed fine but the 147's might not agree with all guns. Just a guess.
As for the advantages of FP's, I believe Keith and several others found that the bigger the meplat, the more accurate and lethal the bullet was. The tradeoff of course is range. Those large meplat bullets lose velocity very fast.

 

[71vette]

I have become a flat point fan in 38 Special. 125 grain flat points over 4.1 grains of HP-38 shoot very well for me. I’m planning on picking up some 9mm 147 grain flat points from Summit City probably this weekend to try out. I’m interested to see how they do in my various pistols.

 

[Nevada Ed]

Maybe I should have added.... 9mm bullets, Sorry

As I stated I only shot JHP that had a "Flat top" design but were high priced, for target work, from Speer.

I was just wondering how the "Real" FP 9mm bullets did in light target loads
which would be easier on my wallet if they worked out.

Just that at looking at the Berry line of bullets, I noticed that a 124 FP bullet was SHORTER than a 115 gr. Gold Dot!

With the 124 FP at .512" and the HBFP at .534" and the THP at .568" in length
there could be a OAL length setting that would be needed for the loads to feed correctly.

I tried the Berry THP and it worked ok, but it was a real JHP, not a FP design.

Is there a problem with the short FP at .512" in length, feeding from the magazine to the chamber, of your pistols?

I have had three (3) fail to feed with my full load (+P) in my C9 pistol
with the 124 Hybrid in my last test, with 1.09 & 1.12" OAL's.

No big thing, since these are only for target practice.

Thank you.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

Ed: Berrys has suggested OALs for all their bullets. My favs in 9mm are the HBFP-TP & HBRN-TP bullets because they can be loaded to higher fps than their "regular" plated versions (as in for 357 SIG)...

In my experience MOST of the many 115 & 124gr HP or FP (or FN?) bullets can be loaded to the same, easy to cycle OAL: one just needs to adjust the powder charge SLIGHTLY to accomodate the differing designs as some penetrate farther into the cases and can, thusly, generate higher pressures.

If not loading at or near MAX loads this usually doesn't create a problem. Thankfully, my 9mms, for the most part, cycle these bullets over a pretty wide range of OALs without any problems.

Cheers!

P.S. A 0.03" +/- in OAL doesn't seem to effect any of my 9mm loads as far as cycling is concerned in 9mm, especially at as short as that is (1.09 - 1.12) vis-a-vis a SAMMI MAX of 1.169"... Just in my limited experience.