Frame cleaning before reassembly

[Polyphemus]

OK. Working my way through the Kuhnhausen manual, my 'new' 1917/'37 Brazilian is stripped to the bare frame--except the cylinder/yoke is still together and the ejector rod plunger is in place.

On page 19, Kuhnhausen begins the checkout/Reassembly section with a 12 point check on the frame. This raises two big questions.

1. Kuhnhausen repeatedly suggests that various slots, grooves, threads etc. be 'detail cleaned.' Does this mean anything more special than working things over with a toothbrush and a spritz of Breakfree? Perhaps toothbrush and Hoppe's? And will wiping down the surfaces in these confined spaces leave the surfaces
sufficiently 'dry' afterward?

2. In dissasembly, all the parts seem pretty pristine, with one exception: The grip frame shows dramatic pitting under the wood, and some active rust, the mainspring shows a few spots as well. Is scrubbing, and the attendant oiling, enough here? or do I need to borrow a dremel tool and try to smooth the surfaces?

Thanks for your attention.

 

[Polyphemus]

OK. Working my way through the Kuhnhausen manual, my 'new' 1917/'37 Brazilian is stripped to the bare frame--except the cylinder/yoke is still together and the ejector rod plunger is in place.

On page 19, Kuhnhausen begins the checkout/Reassembly section with a 12 point check on the frame. This raises two big questions.

1. Kuhnhausen repeatedly suggests that various slots, grooves, threads etc. be 'detail cleaned.' Does this mean anything more special than working things over with a toothbrush and a spritz of Breakfree? Perhaps toothbrush and Hoppe's? And will wiping down the surfaces in these confined spaces leave the surfaces
sufficiently 'dry' afterward?

2. In dissasembly, all the parts seem pretty pristine, with one exception: The grip frame shows dramatic pitting under the wood, and some active rust, the mainspring shows a few spots as well. Is scrubbing, and the attendant oiling, enough here? or do I need to borrow a dremel tool and try to smooth the surfaces?

Thanks for your attention.

 

[Kamerer]

I understand him to mean what you said - just a very good cleaning.

What I like to do is do a two part degrease and clean by using a penetrating agent like PB or Aerokroil (PB seems to work better to me), shake/wipe off the excess, then hit the whole thing with brake cleaner. Completely de-greases it, evaporates quickly and cleanly. Then, take off the latex gloves you were wearing for this step, dispose of them, put on clean ones and then go back to work. This way I know there is no acids, skin oil, or other agents inside besides where I lube it.

On your second question, I can only pass on what I was told. I did this to a 1916 vintage .455 HE last year and found the same thing as you under the grips. I asked in the smithing section and here before doing anything. The collective wisdom was to just not go filing or doing anything unless you really, really new what you were doing. What I did was got some very gentle polish (Mothers), hit any oxidized or pitted areas repeatedly and GENTLY until I was sure that most of the oxidation was gone, and then I waxed it with Renaissance wax to keep the air out, and then I periodically smear a super light coat of oil over that. This will halt any oxidation for good as long as you keep it covered with a barrier to the air - either wax or oil.

I'm not an expert - but I have picked up these tips from experts and find they give really good results.

Another thing I did was use mothers (some prefer Flitz - I have no experience with that) on the finish VERY GENTLY - not really rubbing but just letting the compound itself dissolve the oxidation, then wiping clean. It will take off lots of the brown oxidation that you see on the finish, and give a lovely shine to the remaining blue, like it had when new. Then wax/coat the frame as you now have bare metal, so you need to protect it, but to me it's much more attractive than dull and brown. Your gun may have more remaining blue than mine so it may not apply.

 

[mikepriwer]

Dave Chicoine told me how he removes rust. Put the part into an oven,
heat it to about 300 degrees, then with gloves, take it out and spray it with
Corrosion-X . It makes a lot of smoke, etc, so do this outside. At that
elevated temperature, the oil seems to combine with the rust. You should
see lots of brown stuff running off the part - frame, cylinder, etc.

I assume that after such a treatment, wipe it down and then examine it.
If you still see rust, do it again !

300 degrees is not high enough to cause any warpage, so this sounds like
a much better approach than removing metal.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[Kamerer]

Interesting approach. Is that safe on the blue or is that only to be done if refinishing?

 

[handejector]

Do you have an air compressor?
It really makes the final cleaning easier after everything is scrubbed loose.

On the grip frame- do NOT start altering the surface with a Dremel!!
You can buy copper and stainless "toothbrushes" at gun shops and shows and many places online. (don't brush your teeth with them

) I suggest the copper, unless all the blue is gone anyway, then the stainless will work quicker. CorrosionX is a wonderful product, and does not harm blue. Give it time to work- days if necessary. I have never heated one like Mike suggests, but a warm environment accelerates any chemical action, so you might keep it in the house in a ziplock bag instead of the cold garage.
For sealing the grip frame, I would also suggest plain old RIG- Rust Inhibiting Grease. It is a wonderful product, tested and proven over many decades. Get those pits coated with it and will will always be there. If it hardens over the next 50 years, that is OK- maybe better. It will still be a rust barrier long after we are gone.

I have never used Mother's- is it safe on blue??

 

[DHENRY]

I wouldn't touch a blued finish with (either) Mothers or Flitz.
They're both excellent on nickel.
BUT...
The Renaissance folks make a fine restoration polish called
Pre-Lim.
It will do a first-class job of cleaning a blued gun, without damage, and its a great way to prepare the finish for a coat of Renaissance wax.
Don

 

[Polyphemus]

Thanks for your information thus far.

A bit more information and a question:
There is no rust or pitting on any exposed or 'working' surface.

The bluing is almost completely gone. I haven't decided about refinishing.

I don't have a compressor.

And.

Would you put the whole frame, including barrel and ejector retainer plunger, into the oven for the CorrosionX treatment?

Thanks again

 

[Kamerer]

Originally posted by handejector:

I have never used Mother's- is it safe on blue??

Yes, it is safe if used carefully. It does a great job of removing the light brown oxidation on the steel where the blue has worn, then replaced with brown patina. It will also revive the existing blue.

If you use it, or Flitz, with too much gusto, you can take off some blue. If you are careful, it is very useful to restore old, oxidized and worn blue to some of it's former luster. I tried it on the advice of a gunsmith and found it to work really well.

If you gob it on and rub for all your life, you will remove the bluing before very long, so it's not something you want to tell a novice to go do.

 

[handejector]

Originally posted by Kamerer:

Originally posted by handejector:

I have never used Mother's- is it safe on blue??

Yes, it is safe if used carefully. It does a great job of removing the light brown oxidation on the steel where the blue has worn, then replaced with brown patina. It will also revive the existing blue.

If you use it, or Flitz, with too much gusto, you can take off some blue. If you are careful, it is very useful to restore old, oxidized and worn blue to some of it's former luster. I tried it on the advice of a gunsmith and found it to work really well.

If you gob it on and rub for all your life, you will remove the bluing before very long, so it's not something you want to tell a novice to go do.

It just dawned on me That I may be confused(happens often

)-
I have heard others talk about Mother's Mag Wheel polish for Nickel guns. Is that what we are talking about here??

 

[Kamerer]

Lee,

Yep, it's that. They make two grades - mag polish, which is very, very lightly abrasive, and billet polish, which is even less so.

Flitz is also abrasive, I find it about the same as mothers mag polish - it has some very fine alumina and diatomaceous earth in it.

I have also used Wenol a fair amount - it is a German product in the same line, though almost too mild to be of use except as a very final polish, and then it's effects are barely noticeable, if at all. I'd use it on something that had a #1200 or #1600 finish in good shape.

 

[50 target]

POLYPHEMUS, the way I see this is that the whole frame, barrel, cylinder, etc. can go into the stove. I WOULD NOT put and springs in the oven as that may take the temper out of them. For s small item like a gun, to blow out the crevices, etc. you can go to Radio Shack, etc. and get and aerosol can of ... well, air. Used for cleaning electronic parts/surfaces. Suggest Q tips for the screw holes, and a pipe cleaner for the cylinder stop plunger hole in front of the trigger guard. Enjoy, Bob

 

[nicky4968]

From my son the physicist. When using the can of "air" used for blowing crud out of computers and such, never, ever turn the can upside down. If you do, you'll get a blast of propellant instead of "air" and you will freeze the dickens out of your parts.