General Robert E. Lee. A Gentleman's Gentleman.

[the ringo kid]

The General on his beautiful Horse, Traveller.

A nice studio portrait:

One of his most famous photos. I did this in pencil for my final exam in Art class in High School:

General Lee w; his Son, General George Washington Custis Lee, and Colonel Walter H. Taylor:

Robert E. Lee when he was in Texas:

A great painting of Lee and of the most beloved Sons of the South:

Lee's Wife and daughters:
Mary Curtis, & Agnes--third daughter Annie has no known existing photo:

They don't make them like him anymore.

 

[sheepdawg]

A lot can be seen in the way the Union troops treated him at Appomattox. A true American gentleman and hero. His tactics are still studied by militaries throughout the world.

I'm afraid his most honorable reputations are being sullied by today's liberal professors and history rewriters.

 

[the ringo kid]

A lot can be seen in the way the Union troops treated him at Appomattox. A true American gentleman and hero. His tactics are still studied by militaries throughout the world.

I'm afraid his most honorable reputations are being sullied by today's liberal professors and history rewriters.

Amen to all of that. I remember part of a story of one of his exploits as an Engineering officer during the War with Mexico. I need to refresh but, what I gathered from that story, was he was NOT, short on bravery.

To this day, he is my most favorite General of all time.

 

[Faulkner]

I have a picture of Lee hanging in my office.

 

[Philadelphia Patriot]

Not to get too off topic, but what do you guys think about Longstreet? I want to start studying him next, but I have heard some of the material on him is biased, blaming him for losing the war for the Confederacy.

 

[the ringo kid]

I have a picture of Lee hanging in my office.

Sometime in the new year, im going to be buying a couple Lee prints from Don Stivors, Dale Galleon and Don Troiani--all will have Lee in them.
This is one of Troianis works im looking at:

And another:

This one looks great to and is by an artist ive never heard of before, Bradley Schmehl.

Paul Strain is good too:

These are the Stivers
Lees, I like:

The other:

On a separate note, I like this Don Stivers print about British Major John Andre after he was captured during Operation? Gustavus:

 

[sheepdawg]

Longstreet will forever be tied to the Confederate loss at Gettysburg, whether deserved or not, for failure to attack a position early in the morning as ordered by Lee and disagreement with Lee about Pickett's Charge.

Still he is considered by most to be one the best generals of the American Civil War.

He lived to the ripe old age of 82 even though he had been severely wounded in the war.

 

[Philadelphia Patriot]

Longstreet will forever be tied to the Confederate loss at Gettysburg, whether deserved or not, for failure to attack a position early in the morning as ordered by Lee and disagreement with Lee about Pickett's Charge.

Still he is considered by most to be one the best generals of the American Civil War.

He lived to the ripe old age of 82 even though he had been severely wounded in the war.

That's the impression I got. Having Lee at the head, the daring Jackson on the right, and the (what I consider from what I have read thus far) cautious, practical Longstreet on the left you have a pretty solid structure. I didn't even mention Pickett or Jeb Stuart yet...

 

[S&W45Colt]

Longstreet will forever be tied to the Confederate loss at Gettysburg, whether deserved or not, for failure to attack a position early in the morning as ordered by Lee and disagreement with Lee about Pickett's Charge.

Still he is considered by most to be one the best generals of the American Civil War.

He lived to the ripe old age of 82 even though he had been severely wounded in the war.

You are correct. However, the decision to continue past Day 1 was a poor one on Lee's part, Lee bears ultimate responsibility in the loss at Gettysburg. Gen Ewell, of Lee's subordinates, would be the most responsible for the loss IMO.

Longstreet had many successful campaigns, Antietam and Fredericksburg being two of them.

It should be noted Longstreet and Lee debated the coming campaigns over the winter and Longstreet was against an offensive approach, Lee overruled him and took the offensive. Some have speculated this was the motivation for Longstreet's delays, I think that's a reach. He did indeed delay, but by only a few hours, not most of the day.

After the war, Lee admitted Longstreet was one of the first Generals to comprehend that technological changes no longer gave the advantage to the aggressor, but to the defender.

It's an interesting what if to ask what if Lee had agreed with Longstreet and played the role of the defender in 1863. It could be argued the South would have won the war by attrition of public support in the North, a great "what if."

 

[S&W45Colt]

That's the impression I got. Having Lee at the head, the daring Jackson on the right, and the (what I consider from what I have read thus far) cautious, practical Longstreet on the left you have a pretty solid structure. I didn't even mention Pickett or Jeb Stuart yet...

Bragg was the one the South would have been better off without.

 

[bovw]

I'm replacing a broken General Lee coffee mug for my FIL, he's accustomed to "coffee with Bobby Lee every morning" in his words. He considers General Lee the second greatest man every, behind Jesus.

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[red14]

I'm replacing a broken General Lee coffee mug for my FIL, he's accustomed to "coffee with Bobby Lee every morning" in his words. He considers General Lee the second greatest man every, behind Jesus.

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I named my son Robert Edward, Lee and my father,
were/are my heroes.


''Duty is the most sublime word in our language. Do your duty in all things.
You cannot do more. You should never wish to do less.''

''Never do a wrong thing to make a friend or to keep one.''

''I cannot trust a man to control others who cannot control himself.''
Robert E. Lee

 

[Kinman]

A couple of years ago I was telling someone about how boring I find driving long distances, and anything a little over a hundred miles is a long distance to me. He told me about E-Books and loaned me one that was told from Traveler's point of view...It was a great story with somebody like James Earl Jones reading the part of the horse. I think the name of the E-Book was simply Traveler. I turned it on shortly after leaving the house and hitting the interstate, next thing I knew I was approaching my destination after nearly 300 miles of driving.

 

[the ringo kid]

It was instilled in me by both parents as I was growing up, to be proud of all parts of my heritage. They be, American, Southern and Texan. As a kid, I had a buckskin outfit, cowboy hat, and when we went to Little Rock, Arkansas, I had my 1st Reb Kepi. As a teen, I had the Battle flag on my wall above my bed surrounded w/ swimsuit posters featuring Kathy Ireland.

Guess ill go out that way minus Kathy Ireland. :-(

 

[goldenlight]

I remember reading, somewhere, that he was the only person to ever make it through West Point, without getting a single demerit. Amazing.

He was a far better general than anyone else, during the Civil War.

His troops practically deified him.

I also remember reading that the Arlington Nation Cemetery is on land taken from R. E. Lee, during or right after the war.

The story I read was that it was used as a National Cemetery specifically so he could never recover the land that was basically stolen from him.

 

[vito]

On a personal level General Lee was by all accounts a most honorable and respected gentleman. But don't forget he made a choice to accept the leadership of the Confederate forces after first being offered command of the Union army. His loyalty to his state of Virginia was stronger than his loyalty to the United States, despite his oath of office as a commissioned officer in which he pledged his loyalty to the United States of America, not the Confederate States of America. As such he became an enemy of this country. You might not be aware that the U.S. Army War College is currently considering the removal of his official portrait from the college, along with that of General "Stonewall" Jackson, on the basis of them being enemies of this country and who took up arms against the United States.

 

[1morethan8]

Should we remove this too?

 

[jack the toad]

You might not be aware that the U.S. Army War College is currently considering the removal of his official portrait from the college, along with that of General "Stonewall" Jackson, on the basis of them being enemies of this country and who took up arms against the United States.

In this day and time... I'm not surprised.

 

[Faulkner]

That's the impression I got. Having Lee at the head, the daring Jackson on the right, and the (what I consider from what I have read thus far) cautious, practical Longstreet on the left you have a pretty solid structure. I didn't even mention Pickett or Jeb Stuart yet...

I think one of the biggest "what if's" of the war is what if Jackson had not been fatally wounded at Chancellorsville. It is quite possible that Gettysburg could have turned out much different.

 

[1morethan8]

If we keep removing the threads of our country's history...

What will be left?

 

[bovw]

I think one of the biggest "what if's" of the war is what if Jackson had not been fatally wounded at Chancellorsville. It is quite possible that Gettysburg could have turned out much different.

I took a detour off rt 3 this morning and drove through Chancellorsville on my way to town. My wife and I were talking about that very subject.

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[PA Reb]

Great post "ringo" on a truly great man!

Gettysburg, my favorite topic! The many modern theories made in hindsight about who lost that battle have made it a mind boggling subject. After the battle was fought and as beloved as General Lee was in the south, there was no way he was going to be made the scapegoat. Longstreet, who was himself one of the best generals to have ever lived, quickly became the prime target for the failure and carried that unfair title to the day he died. Longstreet was well aware that the plan for the third day's assault was doomed which of course is easy to see today as we look back at it. Here's my opinion of were the fault should rest;

July 1, 1863, the first day at Gettysburg. General Lee and the CSA forces definitely had the upper hand. Union forces met the CSA assault on the west and north of the town but the CSA quickly drove all of them back through the town and up onto Culp's Hill and Cemetery Ridge. It was then that Lee gave Lt. General Richard Ewell the "discretionary order" to "take that hill if possible." Ewell sent Maj. General Edward Johnson, commander of Ewell's third division to take Culp's Hill. The whole plan was carried out weakly in my opinion and to make a long story short, the hill remained in Federal hands at the end of the day. Meade could not have stayed in Gettysburg if Culp's Hill had ended up being occupied by CSA forces.

To end my post quickly, right there is where the fault for the CSA loss at Gettysburg is - Lee's "discretionary order" and Ewell's failure to secure Culp's Hill. IF Lee would have concentrated his forces right then and there and taken Culp's Hill and flank it on the CSA left the first day (which they could have if done in full force), the great battle of Gettysburg would have been over and Union troops would have had to retreat towards Washington to protect it. That would have sent shock waves through the north and we would be reading history much differently today!

I came back to this thread just to add this point > After studying the war and in particular Gettysburg for many years, I believe the CSA lost Gettysburg at Chancellorsville. IF the beloved and more than capable Thomas Jackson hadn't been handed his fate by members of the 18th N.C.I. at Chancellorsville, he more than likely would have been present at Gettysburg. If Lee would have given the order, no matter how vague, to "take that hill if possible" to Jackson at Gettysburg instead of his replacement Ewell, Gettysburg would have fallen to the CSA and Washington would have been under a tremendous threat. In turn, the people of the north would have had a much different view of the war and I believe it would have pressured the north to the bargaining table. These are all of course "big ifs" and just my opinion.

 

[the ringo kid]

On a personal level General Lee was by all accounts a most honorable and respected gentleman. But don't forget he made a choice to accept the leadership of the Confederate forces after first being offered command of the Union army. His loyalty to his state of Virginia was stronger than his loyalty to the United States, despite his oath of office as a commissioned officer in which he pledged his loyalty to the United States of America, not the Confederate States of America. As such he became an enemy of this country. You might not be aware that the U.S. Army War College is currently considering the removal of his official portrait from the college, along with that of General "Stonewall" Jackson, on the basis of them being enemies of this country and who took up arms against the United States.

They are wanting to remove their portraits to appease a tiny group--all in the name of being pc. Patton even kept a portrait of Rommel, as well as a few other Generals he was up against. I read somewhere years ago, that that was even frowned upon then.

 

[the ringo kid]

Should we remove this too?

Don't give them any other ideas.

 

[the ringo kid]

Great post "ringo" on a truly great man!

Gettysburg, my favorite topic! The many modern theories made in hindsight about who lost that battle have made it a mind boggling subject. After the battle was fought and as beloved as General Lee was in the south, there was no way he was going to be made the scapegoat. Longstreet, who was himself one of the best generals to have ever lived, quickly became the prime target for the failure and carried that unfair title to the day he died. Longstreet was well aware that the plan for the third day's assault was doomed which of course is easy to see today as we look back at it. Here's my opinion of were the fault should rest;

July 1, 1863, the first day at Gettysburg. General Lee and the CSA forces definitely had the upper hand. Union forces met the CSA assault on the west and north of the town but the CSA quickly drove all of them back through the town and up onto Culp's Hill and Cemetery Ridge. It was then that Lee gave Lt. General Richard Ewell the "discretionary order" to "take that hill I possible." Ewell sent Maj. General Edward Johnson, commander of Ewell's third division to take Culp's Hill. The whole plan was carried out weakly in my opinion and to make a long story short, the hill remained in Federal hands at the end of the day. Meade could not have stayed in Gettysburg if Culp's Hill had ended up being occupied by CSA forces.

To end my post quickly, right there is where the fault for the CSA loss at Gettysburg is - Lee's "discretionary order" and Ewell's failure to secure Culp's Hill. IF Lee would have concentrated his forces right then and there and taken Culp's Hill and flank it on the CSA left the first day (which they could have if done in full force), the great battle of Gettysburg would have been over and Union troops would have had to retreat towards Washington to protect it. That would have sent shockwaves through the north and we would be reading history much differently today!

Thank you sir, as well as this mighty fine post. Im hoping to find more time to do so real research on some of these Gents and to add some real info about General Lee. Others I want to do are, Stuart, Longstreet, Jackson, the Hill Brothers, and especially now--about Forrest.

Ive never liked revisionist history and dislike it even more now.

Something id especially want to do, is a good posting about the fighting that took place between the 4th Alabama and the 69th New York at: Marye's Heights. I looked at a new so-called ""history book" for high-school aged kids. No mention of that battle at all--when I remember reading in the 7th grade--from the then current history book we were issued. That book couldnt spend more than a few lines written about that battle-when they were talking about the Battles of Fredericksburg and Spotsylvania. I remember being intrigued reading how our boys respected a "game" enemy when they stood up and cheered the 69th for their bravery. Nothing like that mentioned these days.

A fine painting by Mort Kunstler on that subject including Sergeant Kirkland: the: Angel of Marye's Heights:

Another of Sergeant Richard Kirkland (aka) the Angel of Marye's Heights."

Sergeant Kirkland's grave:

A photo of our dead behind the stone wall at Marye's Heights:

The: Fightin' 69th.

Sorry I get carried away--back to General Lee.

 

[Faulkner]

Great post "ringo" on a truly great man!

Gettysburg, my favorite topic! The many modern theories made in hindsight about who lost that battle have made it a mind boggling subject. After the battle was fought and as beloved as General Lee was in the south, there was no way he was going to be made the scapegoat. Longstreet, who was himself one of the best generals to have ever lived, quickly became the prime target for the failure and carried that unfair title to the day he died. Longstreet was well aware that the plan for the third day's assault was doomed which of course is easy to see today as we look back at it. Here's my opinion of were the fault should rest;

July 1, 1863, the first day at Gettysburg. General Lee and the CSA forces definitely had the upper hand. Union forces met the CSA assault on the west and north of the town but the CSA quickly drove all of them back through the town and up onto Culp's Hill and Cemetery Ridge. It was then that Lee gave Lt. General Richard Ewell the "discretionary order" to "take that hill I possible." Ewell sent Maj. General Edward Johnson, commander of Ewell's third division to take Culp's Hill. The whole plan was carried out weakly in my opinion and to make a long story short, the hill remained in Federal hands at the end of the day. Meade could not have stayed in Gettysburg if Culp's Hill had ended up being occupied by CSA forces.

To end my post quickly, right there is where the fault for the CSA loss at Gettysburg is - Lee's "discretionary order" and Ewell's failure to secure Culp's Hill. IF Lee would have concentrated his forces right then and there and taken Culp's Hill and flank it on the CSA left the first day (which they could have if done in full force), the great battle of Gettysburg would have been over and Union troops would have had to retreat towards Washington to protect it. That would have sent shockwaves through the north and we would be reading history much differently today!

I am very much inclined to agree with you. General Ewell was no General Jackson, or even Longstreet. Had General Lee given Jackson a "discretionary order" to take that hill, the hill would have been taken.

 

[redneckemt]

I think one of the biggest "what if's" of the war is what if Jackson had not been fatally wounded at Chancellorsville. It is quite possible that Gettysburg could have turned out much different.

What would have happened of we had pressed the Yankees after the victory at 1st Bull Run? The whole Yankee army was in in a panic running full speed back to Washington chasing their Commanders the roads we choked with DC citizens who had come to watch the Battle. The South failed to take advantage of one of the Greatest opportunities of the War.

Or what would have happened if that fool Pillow had held the River Forts in Tennessee? Or if Bragg had never been given a Command?

 

[the ringo kid]

What would have happened of we had pressed the Yankees after the victory at 1st Bull Run? The whole Yankee army was in in a panic running full speed back to Washington chasing their Commanders the roads we choked with DC citizens who had come to watch the Battle. The South failed to take advantage of one of the Greatest opportunities of the War.

Or what would have happened if that fool Pillow had held the River Forts in Tennessee? Or if Bragg had never been given a Command?

It would have been a complete rout and destruction of their Army just like happened to Napoleon in Russia after the Russians counterattacked, chased him to the river and destroyed most of his Army there.

 

[vito]

There is nothing at all wrong with honoring leaders of the CSA, as a reflection of the history and culture of the South, but revering them as "American" heroes is another matter. If the Army War College posted portraits of Lee and others in admiration of their leadership and soldierly abilities, that of course makes sense (if you ever have the chance to visit the US Military Academy at West Point, there are statues of some of the great generals in human history in the Board Room (I don't recall what the official name of this room is, where the Superintendent presides over the Academy leadership) but this is not acclaiming them as anything more than that, i.e., their military greatness. If the Army War College's intention is displaying portraits of generals who were heroes to this county's conflicts, then there is no place for Lee, Jackson, Longstreet or any of the others who fought against the Union.

You will not find, in a similar vein, any monuments to Benedict Arnold at West Point or in Washington, D.C. despite the fact that he was a hero early in the Revolution. Once he became a traitor to the cause, and served the British, he no longer deserved the honor of being considered an American hero.

 

[bovw]

There is nothing at all wrong with honoring leaders of the CSA, as a reflection of the history and culture of the South, but revering them as "American" heroes is another matter. If the Army War College posted portraits of Lee and others in admiration of their leadership and soldierly abilities, that of course makes sense (if you ever have the chance to visit the US Military Academy at West Point, there are statues of some of the great generals in human history in the Board Room (I don't recall what the official name of this room is, where the Superintendent presides over the Academy leadership) but this is not acclaiming them as anything more than that, i.e., their military greatness. If the Army War College's intention is displaying portraits of generals who were heroes to this county's conflicts, then there is no place for Lee, Jackson, Longstreet or any of the others who fought against the Union.

You will not find, in a similar vein, any monuments to Benedict Arnold at West Point or in Washington, D.C. despite the fact that he was a hero early in the Revolution. Once he became a traitor to the cause, and served the British, he no longer deserved the honor of being considered an American hero.

I could maybe agree with this, but if they are removed a bunch of US Army bases, named earlier in the thread, need name changes as well. No cherry picking, all in or go home.

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