Got a opportunity to buy a .38/44

[Scheebs]

Ok everyone, I need some advice.
I have a chance to purchase a 1946 S prefex 5" transitional model. I have'nt seen the gun personally, but it is described as mint with hardly a turn line. No box.
What questions do I need to have answered to determine if this gun is worth purchasing?
What would be a fair price in the midwest?
I appreciate any help you can offer.

 

[Scheebs]

Ok everyone, I need some advice.
I have a chance to purchase a 1946 S prefex 5" transitional model. I have'nt seen the gun personally, but it is described as mint with hardly a turn line. No box.
What questions do I need to have answered to determine if this gun is worth purchasing?
What would be a fair price in the midwest?
I appreciate any help you can offer.

 

[Art Doc]

I'm no expert but I think the trans models fetch a premium and the 5" is less common on the post-war guns (although maybe that doesn't apply to the trans models as they are actually pre-war in features). No box hurts a lot with serious collectors.

My wild guess, based on a 98% condition assumption, would be $900-$1,200?

 

[Nightowl]

From what I have read the 5" is a rare beast, and has been called the McGivern model. If it is an original, its probably worth whatever the seller wants for it, if that is what you like to collect. Good luck and we need some pics,so we can admire it too.

 

[pbslinger]

Look for a Serial number in the S72300-S75000 range. Normal is low polish blue, long action, a knob on the ejector rod.

Look for diamond magna stocks numbered to the gun and matching serial numbers on the frame, under the barrel, back of cylinder, under extractor.

4" and 5" barrels are most common. There is no connection with Mcgivern and transitional heavy duties.

I think Saxonpig is in the ball park on price.

Edit- I got the serial number range from the Standard Catalog of S&W and unless I made a mistake it doesn't seem to jibe with other astute members' determinations. I defer to them. Above information is based on the assumption and probability that the gun in question is a Heavy Duty.

 

[sabre]

The correct grips are important on these guns, later N frame magnas likely won't fit well as the grip frame is a little longer.

One other thing thats a big deal to me is to be sure it hasn't been reemed out to accept 357 magnum ammo. That kind of kills the collector value in my eyes. Still could be a good shooter but not worth what an unmodified gun would be.

Assuming it is original with the correct grips I tend to agree with SaxonPig on the value.

Bill

 

[Scheebs]

Thanks for all the input. The story is this gun and several other S&W's are from an estate. Each gun is in perfect, unfired or minimal fired, collectable condition and the prices are reasonable.
I will use your advice and ask the dealer to remove the grips for numbering.
Others available are a model 12, 49, S prefix M&P .38 and a Baby Browning. Any interest from the forum on these?

 

[1Aspenhill]

I think some more information is required. Is it a 38/44 Heavy Duty or Outdoorsman? there is a big difference. first, 5" transition HDs are not that rare and if the gun has all the original finish, grips and is matching numbers, Frank is right on it price. If it is an Outdoorsman with a 5" barrel, you need to contact Roy Jinks to validate it as I've never seen a 5" transition Outdoorsman and a correct one would be worth a lot of money. It could also cost you a lot of money, but if it is a cut barrel to 5" then it is not worth more than shooter price. A 1946 Transitional HD should have a one line address on the right side, pre war style hammer and trigger, large ejector rod knob and the barrel is most likely marked on top with patent and address info. Correct grips are hard to find if they are not numbered to the gun. Serial number range for the 1946 guns runs from S62000 to S67000 approx. I hope this helps,
Bill

 

[Guest]

first, 5" transition HDs are not that rare

Agreed, the 5" is definitely more common than the 4" or the 6 1/2"
Not a "common" or cheap gun by any means, but of the three barrel lengths, I'd pay the least for a 5".

 

[1Aspenhill]

Yes, but I got a very nice one in the orginal box!

 

[Guest]

Yes, but I got a very nice one in the orginal box!

I know, it's the nicest 5" I've ever seen, the box and hang tag are a bonus..... You have a very nice HD for sure. Maybe I should have said "more often seen" instead of "common"...?

Would you agree, everything else being equal, a 5" would follow a 4" and 6 1/2" in the price (value) equation?

 

[1Aspenhill]

Rob,
From what I can tell, in Transition HDs, the 6.5, then 5 inch are less seen than the 4 inch. The serial numbers I have indicate this trend. However, I have said that when you take the number of N frame guns between S62294 and S75500, subtract the Outdoorsman, 44spls and 357s, what could only be left are HDs. I think there were about 8500 Transition HDs. Based on the serial numbers we know about, I'd say the 4" guns would outnumber the rest. This trend seemed to follow thru the life of the HD. One day maybe we can get the raw data and make an accurate determination for once and for all.
Today, you are correct in the pricing as 6.5 transtions are hard to come by and everyone wants a 4 inch. But I'd just as soon have a nice one in the box with hanging tag and all!

I havent' seen another 5" nicer than that one.
Bill

 

[Guest]

Interesting info Bill.
You have the numbers, so I defer to that info, but in the NW, we see way more 5" guns than others. The 4" definitely have been front and center on the interest index, but maybe I didn't connect the dots as to total quantities versus the 5" guns.
Maybe the "want" side of the equation is what I'm seeing, that could be it. I've seen so many 5" M&P's and 5" HD's over the years that they just look "common" to me.
Now, if you want to discuss 5" Outdoorsman.....aka the McGivern Model, that's a rare breed.....

 

[handejector]

From what I can tell, in Transition HDs, the 6.5, then 5 inch are less seen than the 4 inch.

Bill,
Are you sure, IF we talk about ONLY long action Transitions? I have seen many dozens of 5" Trans thru the years, and only a good handful of 4" Transitions. After the switch to short actions, that is reversed- I've seen more 4" short actions than 5".
In both long and short actions, I agree the 6.5" is the rarest.

 

[Bill A]

Here's my long action transitional 5". I believe they are more common than the 4", and MUCH more common than the 6.5".

Bill

 

[Nightowl]

I was thinking Outdoorsman. Should have know better.

 

[moosedog]

Scheebs, it looks like your thread got over ran a little. A post war transitional pre 10 (if thats what it is and not an N frame) is a collectable gun for sure but depends on condition and if original box, screw driver, paper comes with it. A 5 inch is not uncommon and I would give maybe $500 to $550 myself if in mint condition.

 

[1Aspenhill]

Lee,
Of the serial numbers I have for transition HDs, here is the breakout:
4"-85
5"-26
6.5"-3

Now if I could get access to the records, I could confirm if this trend is true thru out.
Bill

 

[pace40]

Originally posted by Scheebs:
Others available are a model 12, 49, S prefix M&P .38 and a Baby Browning. Any interest from the forum on these?

If the "S" M&P is a 4" in blue w/ box 98%+, yes, I have interest.