H&R 32 Hammerless 2nd Model Large Frame Top-Break Revolver w/5" Barrel

[jsmith]

Here is a gun, although not a Smith & Wesson, I believe is worthy to be mentioned here.

I just recently acquired this at a gun show in Ohio. It is a H&R 32 Hammerless 2nd Model Large Frame Top-Break Revolver. Serial number is 172410 and all the numbers match. This gun has a nickel finish, blued barrel latch, trigger and guard. It is a 6 shot revolver w/auto extractor and has a 5" barrel, which is an unusual and somewhat rare length for a top-break revolver. The top of the barrel is marked HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS CO. WORCESTER, MASSACHUSETTS, U.S.A. The left side of the barrel is marked 32 S&W CTGE. No other markings. The grip frame is round butt with original H&R Target logo square-butt extension grips.

What is unusual about this gun is that it is chambered for the 32 S&W Long cartridge. This is something that Smith & Wesson never did in their top-break's. All their top-break's were chambered in 32 S&W (short), 38 S&W, and various 44 & 45 calibers in the large frame top-breaks. I can't seem to find any other manufacturer who made a top-break gun chambered in 32 S&W Long.

This gun is in excellent condition, and I would rate it at about 95%. Bore and chambers appear to be perfect. No rust or pitting. It has been used but well taken care of. Barrel latch and cylinder lock-up are tight.

Bill Goforth, the expert on H&R's and IJ's, stated to me that the exact configuration of my gun is almost rare. A long barrel hammerless and over sized two-piece hard rubber grips were both options at an extra charge. The 32 S&W Long is rarely seen in the Hammerless model.

The 29th edition, page 843 of the Blue Book lists this as the H&R Hammerless 2nd Model Large Frame Top-Break (Smokeless Powder) with six variations. Mine is the 5th variation, no patent dates, state name in the address spelled out (MASSACHUSETTS), with a serial number range estimated from 160,000 - 190,000, which mine falls into at 172410. They were made from 1916 - 1924.

Bought it for $200 from an old man selling it at a gun show. I don't think he realized what he had!

jsmith

 

[jsmith]

Here is a gun, although not a Smith & Wesson, I believe is worthy to be mentioned here.

I just recently acquired this at a gun show in Ohio. It is a H&R 32 Hammerless 2nd Model Large Frame Top-Break Revolver. Serial number is 172410 and all the numbers match. This gun has a nickel finish, blued barrel latch, trigger and guard. It is a 6 shot revolver w/auto extractor and has a 5" barrel, which is an unusual and somewhat rare length for a top-break revolver. The top of the barrel is marked HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS CO. WORCESTER, MASSACHUSETTS, U.S.A. The left side of the barrel is marked 32 S&W CTGE. No other markings. The grip frame is round butt with original H&R Target logo square-butt extension grips.

What is unusual about this gun is that it is chambered for the 32 S&W Long cartridge. This is something that Smith & Wesson never did in their top-break's. All their top-break's were chambered in 32 S&W (short), 38 S&W, and various 44 & 45 calibers in the large frame top-breaks. I can't seem to find any other manufacturer who made a top-break gun chambered in 32 S&W Long.

This gun is in excellent condition, and I would rate it at about 95%. Bore and chambers appear to be perfect. No rust or pitting. It has been used but well taken care of. Barrel latch and cylinder lock-up are tight.

Bill Goforth, the expert on H&R's and IJ's, stated to me that the exact configuration of my gun is almost rare. A long barrel hammerless and over sized two-piece hard rubber grips were both options at an extra charge. The 32 S&W Long is rarely seen in the Hammerless model.

The 29th edition, page 843 of the Blue Book lists this as the H&R Hammerless 2nd Model Large Frame Top-Break (Smokeless Powder) with six variations. Mine is the 5th variation, no patent dates, state name in the address spelled out (MASSACHUSETTS), with a serial number range estimated from 160,000 - 190,000, which mine falls into at 172410. They were made from 1916 - 1924.

Bought it for $200 from an old man selling it at a gun show. I don't think he realized what he had!

jsmith

 

[opoefc]

Very nice find. H&Rs are not cheaply made guns and they offered more variations of features in their revolvers and pistols that did S&W, for less money. It's sometimes hard to classify H&Rs as to excatly what model a gun may be and when was it made, etc. due to the many different features. If your gun left the H&R factory originally intended to be chambered in the .32S&W Long, it is indeed a very uncommon gun, perhaps a special order. Unfortunately H&R records are almost non existant for research purposes, as no one was thinking about collectors 100 yrs. later.

 

[walnutred]

While I agree that is a nice pistol the 32 Long in a breaktop is not that rare. Most manufacturers had a large frame and small frame offering. The small frame was typically available in 32 S&W (5 shot) and 22 LR (7 shot) and the large frame in 38 S&W (5 shot) and 32 S&W Long (6 shot). I'm not trying to distract from the piece, the condition, longer barrel and oversize grips do make it unusual. I'm just trying to correct the misunderstanding about the caliber.

 

[jsmith]

This gun is not rare but it is scarce. I do know that top-break's in 32 S&W Long were made and this is the first one that I have ever seen. It's just an unusual chambering for a top-break. I'm not sure but Iver Johnson may have made some as well. Bill Goforth, the expert of H&R's and IJ's (wrote the books on them), told me that the 32 S&W calibers are rarely seen in H&R's Hammerless models.

It did originally leave the factory chambered in 32 S&W Long. This caliber, along with the 38 S&W, could only be built on their large frame top-break's due to the longer cylinder and more powerful cartridge. The small frame top-break's were chambered in 32 S&W (short) and 22 rimfire.

Top-breaks in general are almost always found with the standard 3-1/4" barrel and occasionally with 4" barrels. Lengths of 5" or 6" are scarce and anything over that are rare.

Most likely this gun was special ordered. Over-sized extension grips and a 5" barrel were an extra cost.

This is about a 90 year-old revolver in excellent condition that I couldn't pass up for $200. It's definitely worth more!

 

[Jim Watson]

Scarce, maybe, but it was a cataloged item in 1939.
From Stoegers of that year
"Ammunition... .32 arm 6 shot shoots the .32 S&W, .32 S&W Long and .32 Colt New Police."
and
"This revolver may be supplied with "Checked Walnut Target Grip" at an extra cost."
Pity they don't say how much extra cost.
The 5" revolver was $15.50 at the time while the more usual 3" was $14.75 and 4" was $15.25.
About half the price of a Smith & Wesson Hand Ejector or late Safety Hammerless.

 

[walnutred]

It's an interesting phenomena that items which were not popular when new are very collectible now. Every time I see one of the old catalog reprints that have the H&R revolvers with the folding bayonets I think of this. I think I have personally only seen two in my life, yet the bayonet was only a 25 or 50 cent option when new.

Why there would not be much demand for a 5" barreled hammerless revolver with oversize grips is obvious now. I guess just like now I tend to accumulate 4" I and J frames. They are a bit of an oxymoron and tend to be a little cheaper than the 2" versions. Maybe someday they will be considered "rare" and I can cash in.

For many years I collected sxs 16ga shotguns. I started with 16ga 30 years ago they were the least desirable, and so cheaper. Now the 16ga has been rediscovered and prices have gone up at least in relation to 12ga versions of the same firearm.

 

[jsmith]

That's the way things go. Whoever thought there would be people out there collecting guns, sometimes over a hundred years after they were made. Most of the guns that I collect are antique's. Modern guns just don't seem to have the appeal as due to older designs and makes.

H&R's, IJ's and the other gun manufacturers out there are often over looked on the collectors market. Guns such as these are difficult to find in excellent condition, but when they are found, are usually reasonably priced. Unless you have something unique, such as an H&R with a folding bayonet. Often these guns are found rusted up, worn out, out of time, pitted barrels or just neglected from not being taken care of. They were just considered 2nd rate compared to Smith & Wesson's or Colt's. But they were very practical guns for their price which was sometimes more than half of a Smith & Wesson or a Colt. They were considered to be cheap and throwaways!

This was an unusual gun due to its barrel length, grips and chambering. Guns that are unusual, scarce or rare are always sought after by collectors. A lot of people at the gun show where I bought this realized it and were making good offers to me to buy it. Turned them all down! This ones a keeper.

I took this to a local gun dealer to get a written appraisal. He appraised it for $500 and I agree with him. It's worth it!

I normally obtain a written appraisal on all my valuable guns. That way I have written proof that I own the guns; with the make, model and serial numbers; and the current market value. Just in case the worst scenerio could happen...being stolen! Which I hope never happens.

 

[geek4u86]

H & R S & W .32 5 shot hammerless

is this one like the ones mentioned?

 

[ddeanjohnson]

Iver Johnson

Here is my 1935 Iver Johnson Safety Automatic Revolver (Third Model, Special, Large Frame), which is chambered in .32 S&W Long. Six-inch barrel.

Douglas Johnson

 

[Speedo2]

removed PC

 

[Chubbo]

H&R 3" .32S&W

I have a H&R 3" .32 S&W blued revolver Ser.#176857, with Mother of Pearl grips, in about 80%, obtained in a deal with some S&W lemon squeezers. I have not been able to find out much about it, and stumbled onto this post about the 5" that jsmith started this thread about. The ser# is close to jsmith's, and was also bought at anOhio gun show.
I would like to find out more about the little H&R, and will probably sell it later.
Sut