Have you ever been turned away at a range

[Maximumbob54]

I only have one range left in Jacksonville that allows hand loads. So I had to be turned away from several for not buying their overpriced range ammo. I was asked to leave a range for breaking their rule of not shooting at human target pictures. I had hung a Barney the Dinosaur target that was a black and white drawing of it with cross hairs. I didn't think that was crossing the line as I thought the rule applied to the old "Hogan's Alley" type targets where the bad guy is pointing a revolver at you or all the Taliban Osama type targets. So FYI, Barney is people too…

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

I understand the policy if they are worried about suicides, but I'm not sure annoying 99.999% of their customers in an attempt at saving 0.001% is a good idea. If a person has already decided to commit suicide, I doubt a little range policy is going to stop them.

I think it is good policy to not rent guns to someone who does not have a gun with him/her. Such policies are not designed to prevent someone from ultimately commiting suicide, but rather to help prevent someone from trying to shoot themself in the station next to you. It also reduces the number of people on the range who have never shot a firearm before without someone experienced with them.

If 99.999% of the customer base for a range comes in alone without a gun then it would be the last range on Earth I would want to be at....

 

[John Ross]

In 1985 I went to a range with a .577 double rifle originally made for black powder loads, like the Trapdoor Springfield or Colt SAA was originally made for black powder loads. I had some mild loads I'd made up for it with cast bullets and 4759 powder.

Range owner threw me off the range for "bringing a black powder gun to his range and shooting it with smokeless loads."

I asked him what he would have done if I'd brought a Trapdoor Springfield to the range and had purchased factory .45-70 ammo from him to shoot in it. He became apoplectic and screamed at me to get out.

A year later he declared bankruptcy and hung himself.

 

[bitstream]

I think it is good policy to not rent guns to someone who does not have a gun with him/her. Such policies are not designed to prevent someone from ultimately commiting suicide, but rather to help prevent someone from trying to shoot themself in the station next to you. It also reduces the number of people on the range who have never shot a firearm before without someone experienced with them.

If 99.999% of the customer base for a range comes in alone without a gun then it would be the last range on Earth I would want to be at....

I understand what you're saying, but what about a guy wanting to rent a gun (or a few) to try out at a range before deciding which one he wants to buy? I'd far rather have a first time gun owner do that and buy a gun they can handle rather than just pick one out and hope.

Everyone starts with their first gun some time. I see all kinds at my local range. If they seem unsure; I try to lend a hand, not run them off.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

I understand what you're saying, but what about a guy wanting to rent a gun (or a few) to try out at a range before deciding which one he wants to buy?

Go to the range with a friend who has guns... then rent. Or... buy a $200 S&W 22A and learn a little something about guns before renting a .357 to see if they can handle it or not. There's lots of options other than just handing out guns to whomever wanders in the door without one.

 

[bitstream]

Go to the range with a friend who has guns... then rent. Or... buy a $200 S&W 22A and learn a little something about guns before renting a .357 to see if they can handle it or not. There's lots of options other than just handing out guns to whomever wanders in the door without one.

Can't argue with that; you're right. I just think there are plenty of scenarios where a single guy walking in without a gun and wanting to rent a gun and shoot isn't really a problem (like the original poster for instance, a traveling worker just wanting to hit the range for awhile).

I guess my point is blanket provisions scoop up unintended people. It's a shame to penalize people like the OP just to catch the ones like you mention. Not sure how to do it right; it might be hard for the range owner to screen everyone properly. Obviously, you're right that handing a newb a .357 isn't a good plan. But denying the OP isn't great either.

EDIT: Just thought of this; how about they allow it if the single guy without a gun of his own has a valid permit/license on his person? If you've got a permit, you've probably got experience and are not as big a suicide threat? maybe?

 

[Maximumbob54]

So while I was active duty USN and couldn't have my own firearm unless I rented a storage unit and kept it there (which I would never recommend for a plethora of reasons) I should have been turned away all the years I went to a range to rent firearms? I sure am glad that some of you guys aren't in charge. I have been told that when suicide has been decided it comes down to where there is a will then there is a way. It's sad when anyone comes to suicide as a course of action and I won't belittle that fact. But if a range wants to deny someone a rental firearm on the ground that they don't want to be liable if they rent it and commit suicide with it at first opportunity… How far does logic like that work for you? So he can't rent one but if he then decides to buy one, what then? You won't let him rent but then you turn around and sell him one? Or do you start telling someone that they have to first have a gun to come buy one from you? This kind of logic in this situation fails me in a huge way.

 

[feralmerril]

Somehow this thread reminds me of a old, rough but funny quip I heard. "He couldnt make out in a cat house with a fist full of twentys"!

 

[Andy Griffith]

The problem is, things have changed- most prominently the fact that people do and have gone to ranges and rented firearms to commit suicide. Although only a very few have done this, it makes the ranges go on the defensive in order to protect their business. Unfortunately, the unintended consequence is not allowing someone that didn't bring a gun is a person that cannot shoot. I honestly don't think I would rent guns on a range if I had one.

However, I would keep all the lead.

The reloaders I'd let have their own brass back.

 

[Bullseye Smith]

At the one range a lady when in rented a gun and killed herself on the line, and if I remember right she was out of state.

 

[Maximumbob54]

And then there was this guy who got drunk and ran over a few people before crashing and dying in the fire. So do we bring back Prohibition or make everyone use taxis or the bus???

I get that in any business you have to protect yourself, but this just sounds like a signed waiver sheet away from being held liable. I wish a forum lawyer would pop into this. Unless they are all thinking "not even with a ten foot pole" right now…

 

[H Richard]

If you're going to be in this city many times, why not go to the range, introduce yourself to the owner/manager, and explain your situation and request the next time you are in town you would like to shoot, but don't want to bring any guns with you because you would have to have them unsecured in a hotel room etc. I'm thinking a "reasonable" operator, if you speak "gun language" to him, would be open to your exception.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

EDIT: Just thought of this; how about they allow it if the single guy without a gun of his own has a valid permit/license on his person? If you've got a permit, you've probably got experience and are not as big a suicide threat? maybe?

I wouldn't be surprised if some ranges with renting restrictions have certain exemptions for permit holders, service men and women and others...

 

[Fishslayer]

The range I go to won't rent a gun to a solo shooter.

 

[WNC Seabee]

not by a person present at the range.
a nephew and me drove a good ways to a F&G range here in WNC on a Sunday late a.m. once there I wondered about nonone around but we shot some THEN I noticed a sign says 'NO SUNDAY USE'. we hauled bun outta there. can't see the harm in it myself but it's likely a $$ racket with a Warden w/in short distance or Natl Fst Ranger. so didn't press our luck.

HA! I did the same thing, very likely at the same range (Cold Mountain range off of 215?) not to long ago.

 

[Flat]

I was curious about this rule before I started shooting and thought it was silly until they told me why. You can't always tell who is suicidal by looking at them, people will tell you they can but that is nonsense.

Sucks for the guy wanting to try out guns before a purchase but from a business standpoint, I would do the same thing. Insurance is a bitch not to mention the people who have to witness it.

 

[BuckeyeChuck]

I get that in any business you have to protect yourself, but this just sounds like a signed waiver sheet away from being held liable. I wish a forum lawyer would pop into this. Unless they are all thinking "not even with a ten foot pole" right now…

Depending upon the state in which a range exists, I can see how the 10' pole might even be too short for comfort. The latest issue of America's 1st Freedom is littered with bills that have been filed to restrict gun freedom, including the completely unworkable and utterly stupid microstamping.

Right now the current tactic by those who desire to eliminate guns is basic classification of objects: the firearms themselves, their accessories (including magazines), and ammunition. By increasing the number of classifications, they can progressively make illegal classifications, and if a particular classification doesn't work, they can alter or further subdivide them.

I think the focus on objects is natural because they perceive these to be more easily conquered than people or places. So far, gun owners and their organized efforts have been successful at staving off these efforts; indeed, they have managed to actually reclaim surrendered ground in areas such as "shall issue" laws for concealed carry. But the anti-gun guys are very persistent. Eventually they will begin to focus on the places we shoot, instead of what we shoot. I think range owners inherently recognize this and naturally, they want to protect themselves.

Who knows what form that focus will take? It could be new licensing fees and qualifications. It could be laws or (God forbid) unlegislated rules (for which the BATFE is notorious) that expose range owners to tort. Regardless, I don't begrudge a range owner his right to refuse business for any reason he sees fit. After all, he's selling time to people operating a machine whose primary function is lethality. As the saying goes, with a Russian accent: "Is gun! Is not safe!"

In Columbus, the open-to-the-public ranges are all north or northeast of the city. My range is 26 miles from my house. I see a wondeful business opportunity for any range located west, soutwest, or south of Columbus but I also understand why nobody is jumping to open one.

The next time I'm in to Aimhi I'll ask if they have a "solo shooters must bring their own guns" policy.

 

[Mark_T]

BuckeyeChuck
I spoke to the range guy at AIMHI today. I explained that I was a business traveler and just wanted to shoot a Smith 22a like the one I have at home and he said no problem.

Now that I thought about it, I don't have an issue with the manager at the other shop excluding me from his range based on my profile. I just wish that the other guy I spoke to had mentioned this policy before I drove out there.

To conclude my part of this story, I've been reassigned to a new project in a new city. I would have liked to seen AIMHI, oh well that is how it goes.

Thanks to all for the information and comments

Mark

 

[DeathGrip]

I guess now we all learned a good question to ask when out of town.
Thanks Mark_T,Good thread.

 

[Herknav]

Interesting and good to know for those of us who like to shoot alone.