Heavy 45 Colt in Governor RESULTS

[roundgunner]

Heavy 45 Colt in Governor

I have a friend who has a Governor. I gave him some of my 45 Colt reloads to shoot. He would like some with more spunk for camping in black bear country.

Does anybody push anything like 260gr at 1000 fps thru the Governor? If so will you share the info?

The ones I gave him were 8.5 Unique w/240 SWC. It hits about 825 in my 4”, never chronoed in the Gov.

The ones I gave him felt like a fast 45acp.

 

[Rule3]

The Governor is no SW MT Gun nor a Ruger. I would be hesitant to use really hot loads in it. This two article will give some "food for thought" I use the 8 grs of Unique in my Mt Gun and it is more than sufficient for me.


Gunnotes...Smith & Wesson Mod 25-5

The 45 Colt

 

[VAdoublegunner]

If the gun is rated to handle +P 45ACP loads, then it should also handle 45 Colt loads in the same pressure range.

That should get you pretty close to the required specifications.

Looking at Brian Pearce's article on the 45 Colt in Handloader #217, I see that a 255gr Lyman 454424 cast with 12.5gr of HS-6 gives 1113fps in a 5.5" barrel. This is in the 16-19Kpsi load range section. Another classic load is 20.0gr 4227 with a 250gr cast bullet for around 1000fps in a 5.5" barrel.

There are a number of other loads in the 23Kpsi category section, which is in 45ACP+P load territory, including one 300gr cast bullet load at nearly 1000fps. You do not want jacketed bullets, I would think, either for performance or to stay within safe pressure ranges.

I have no idea what the 'extra long throating' might do to velocities or if it is an issue with shooting these loads since they were developed for standard 45 Colt chambers. However, I would suspect that if S&W rates it for 45ACP+P that would be your guide and therefore anything in the 16-19Kpsi range is safely within that.

 

[Rule3]

Is it +P 45 ACP rated? What velocity will be achieved from a 2.75" barrel?

 

[roundgunner]

I will see him tonight and find out if it is rated for 45acp+P.

Good advice, wish I had thought of that.

 

[Rule3]

Even if it is +P rated it still has a short barrel and is a alloy frame gun.

Kinda like shooting a 357 Mag out of a scandium J frame.

I have no need to push my M 25 Mt Gun hard for Bears but still would not use some of those loads mentioned in the articles I linked. A Ruger or Freedom Arms yes.

 

[roundgunner]

The Gov is rated for +P. We decided to bump it up a bit to experiment. shoot a couple, keep the rest for backpacking. He backpack camps in Vermont and needs something light. The toughest critter he will run into is a black bear or love sick moose.

I will run some over the chrono and post it.

 

[akaviator]

My Governor owner's manual says it is rated for 45 acp +p.

I'm very interested in loads you come up with for the heavier cast bullets.

 

[Skip Sackett]

Well, this is my opinion, you can run 45ACP +P in it and what is that PSI/CUP rating? I would NOT go above that for one reason, well, two.

#1 is the two piece barrel. Not a big fan of that regardless. #2 is the flash shield. There have been reports of those coming off with regular loads in other systems of the same configuration. No thanks.

Now, that doesn't mean that you can't go up to the +P in my opinion. I think it is around the 20,000psi mark and Bryan Pearce has some really good 45Colt loads in that range.

You have to get a hold of the data from Handloader Magazine #246 where he tears the subject apart. It is a mandated read for reloading the 45 Colt, in my opinion again.

The one load that sticks out to me is the RCBS 45-270SAA (the bullet used for all loads in the article), that is around 285gr as cast, with HS-6 and they turned in over 1100fps! Now, I cannot remember the length of barrel that they used to test them with, but it was "normal", in the 4"-6" range.

It won't turn that from the short Governor but, it will still be a formidable round, nonetheless.

Then again, I have a 45ACP load that throws a 240gr LSWC out of a 4" tube at that same velocity so....................

FWIW

Only flake powders too, again, in my opinion.

 

[sourdough44]

I'd be very careful with higher pressure 45 Colt loads in the Govenor. 45acp +p loads are still well short of upper end 45 Colt 'Ruger Only' loads. I de have 45 Colt experience with my 2 Rugers, but load the lower to mid(standard pressure) spectrum for my buddies 'Judge',(yes I know it's not the Govner).

 

[akaviator]

Well, this is my opinion, you can run 45ACP +P in it and what is that PSI/CUP rating? I would NOT go above that for one reason, well, two.

#1 is the two piece barrel. Not a big fan of that regardless. #2 is the flash shield. There have been reports of those coming off with regular loads in other systems of the same configuration. No thanks.

Now, that doesn't mean that you can't go up to the +P in my opinion. I think it is around the 20,000psi mark and Bryan Pearce has some really good 45Colt loads in that range.

You have to get a hold of the data from Handloader Magazine #246 where he tears the subject apart. It is a mandated read for reloading the 45 Colt, in my opinion again.

The one load that sticks out to me is the RCBS 45-270SAA (the bullet used for all loads in the article), that is around 285gr as cast, with HS-6 and they turned in over 1100fps! Now, I cannot remember the length of barrel that they used to test them with, but it was "normal", in the 4"-6" range.

It won't turn that from the short Governor but, it will still be a formidable round, nonetheless.

Then again, I have a 45ACP load that throws a 240gr LSWC out of a 4" tube at that same velocity so....................

FWIW

Only flake powders too, again, in my opinion.

Thanks for that info! I got that issue and that is exactly what I was looking for...a bear whacker hardcast at pressures that won't tear up my gun.

Now I just have to put some together and see how they work!

 

[Skip Sackett]

One thing nice about the Governor; it is small enough to have in your hand, down the bear's throat, and still get the trigger pulled, being double action and all!

Be safe out there!

 

[roundgunner]

I agree with not trying to make Ruger only work in the Smith, that was not the plan. I'm just going to bring it up a bit like a 45acp+P. Still don't have it done yet, need to catch up on 40S&W and I have been socializing on the forum a lot.

 

[wildcatter]

I agree with not trying to make Ruger only work in the Smith, that was not the plan. I'm just going to bring it up a bit like a 45acp+P. Still don't have it done yet, need to catch up on 40S&W and I have been socializing on the forum a lot.

I think I would pick something a little less anemic if I was really concerned about black bear attacks and especially MOOSE!! most don't realize how big how agile and tough a peeved moose can be, they are much more dangerous than a black bear, which is not to be taken LIGHTLY either, (LIGHTLY) no pun intended.

if you do get around to it please give some results, as I have never seen one of these type of revolvers with there cavernous chambers shoot better than patterns out to 25 yards or so. I have seen a few and a pop can at 10 yards is a challenge, so please let us know the outcome??

 

[roundgunner]

I have some results.

load---------------------------Governor-------4" 25
260gr RNFP---6.2 Titegroup-----709--------- 780
260gr RNFP---6.5 Titegroup-----751----------805
260gr RNFP---8.5 Unique--------836----------899
260gr RNFP---8.8 Unique--------851----------916

I'm not going to go any hotter. My friend is happy and it is pretty snappy at 850 fps. I would feel pretty good hiking around with it here in the eastern mountains.

A couple bear hunters were going on about the 45 Colt not being enough gun and on and on BUT, we are not talking about hunting bears, we are talking about a light weight revolver he already has to hike with.

I would bet in the last 130+ years many many black bears have been done in with a 45 Colt with no damage to it's owner.

 

[Rule3]

I have some results.

load---------------------------Governor-------4" 25
260gr RNFP---6.2 Titegroup-----709--------- 780
260gr RNFP---6.5 Titegroup-----751----------805
260gr RNFP---8.5 Unique--------836----------899
260gr RNFP---8.8 Unique--------851----------916

I'm not going to go any hotter. My friend is happy and it is pretty snappy at 850 fps. I would feel pretty good hiking around with it here in the eastern mountains.

A couple bear hunters were going on about the 45 Colt not being enough gun and on and on BUT, we are not talking about hunting bears, we are talking about a light weight revolver he already has to hike with.

I would bet in the last 130+ years many many black bears have been done in with a 45 Colt with no damage to it's owner.

That 8.8 gr load must be a BEAR out of the Governor

 

[David LaPell]

I think a .45 Colt would be enough on a black bear given correct shot placement and the bullet used it ok. A good cast bullet would do ok, but so wouldn't a good .357 with a good bullet (has done so in the past). A moose, well having seen them up close can tell you that when they want to move, they can do so with ease and can cover alot of ground really quickly. Tell you friend he should be practicing out to 25 yards and trying to put all of his shots in something the size of a paper plate. Remember that if a human can cover 21 feet (7 yards in under 2 seconds) how fast do you think a bear or moose can cover the same distance? I would not want to let either of those two animals any closer than that.

 

[roundgunner]

I know what you are saying about Moose, I was driving my old ugly van thru the mountains of Wyoming a few years ago wearing some loose fitting moccasins because they were comfortable to drive in.

I saw a moose feeding in a creek about a hundred yards off the road so I quickly stopped grabbed my Nikon and started down the creek bank to get some nice photo’s. it was snowing lightly (late spring) and just beautiful.

A car with three girls was behind me and saw me get out with the camera so they are now trailing behind me a ways. Now these loose fitting moccasins are real loose and I had to kind of curl my toes to keep them from falling off as I was slowly moving thru the high grass and low brush getting pix of Mr. Moose.

The moose moves off and starts thru the heavily treed forest towards a meadow a bit further away from the van, the young girls are still behind me taking pix too and now I’m using all my Cherokee skills to move thru the forest getting nice photo’s and impressing the ladies.

Well Mr. Moose breaks into the meadow, it is really pretty with some wild flowers and falling snow so I stop at about the tree line so I don’t spook him into running off (he has been watching me the whole time, my Cherokee skills are way past their prime) the ladies are still 100 feet back or so when Mr. Moose alerts, turns his head to look off to my left, then bolts at full clip (fast as a horse) towards the tree line to my right!

Oh man! I’m trying to think of all the things that would scare the bejesus out of a moose and none of them seem like anything I want to meet up with right now either!

I run towards the van, now a few hundred yards back and yell for the girls to run too. Those stupid moccasins are trying to come off so I’m running with my toes curled and jumping logs and rocks etc. all the while knowing we are closer to whatever scared the moose than the moose is, and going slower and louder!

I never did see what scared the moose, decided never again to go off thru the forest in ill fitting shoes & left without even saying high to the young ladies following me thru the forest.

I did get some nice photo’s but that was the days of negatives and I can’t put my fingers on them right now. I will post a photo of what I think scared the moose instead, taken years later.

 

[Rule3]

The moral of the story is: You should have been talking pictures of the ladies.

This thread has the makings of a all time great. Bears, Moose. +P 45 and Women!!

 

[Skip Sackett]

That 8.8 gr load must be a BEAR out of the Governor

No, it's still a 45 Colt.

I have a load with some Surplus Unique, 9.2gr, with a 454640 255gr HP boolit it that I cast here at home, that develops 1050fps out of a 5 1/2" Ruger Blackhawk 45 convertible.

Accurate enough to put them all in a pocket notebook size piece of paper @ 25 yards.

Check out the pictures in the "What did you load today" thread.

They are super cool looking and very accurate!