Hornady LNL Powder Through Expander

[Maximumbob54]

This is my opinion talking but I think the PowderFunnels.com PTX insert beats the tar out of the Hornady PTX inserts. I bought a few bullet seating dies and they come with the latest Hornady PTX inserts and I quickly rebuilt it with the PowderFunnels PTX instead. Add to that it works much better when seating a cast bullet. Now let Hornady stop screwing around a make a copy of the M-die for a PTX insert and that might have me sing a different tune.

 

[B's640]

That's a great series, I've watched and recommended it many times. Good call out, can never highlight good stuff too many times Is there a specific section on the PTX I've missed or forgotten about

I recently spoke to Jim who is the maker of these videos about this very thing. He told me that he does not have a PTX video, and that he's not used one. Oh well. Maybe one of the folks here who have been successfull setting theirs up would do a video for us with their tips and tricks. That would be cool

 

[dickttx]

This is my opinion talking but I think the PowderFunnels.com PTX insert beats the tar out of the Hornady PTX inserts. I bought a few bullet seating dies and they come with the latest Hornady PTX inserts and I quickly rebuilt it with the PowderFunnels PTX instead. Add to that it works much better when seating a cast bullet. Now let Hornady stop screwing around a make a copy of the M-die for a PTX insert and that might have me sing a different tune.

The powder funnel is only a flare insert. The PTX is an expander/flare.

 

[Twoboxer]

So I thought I'd post this here . . .

Last night I went downstairs to do 1k 9mm rounds on my LnL AP. Had nothing but trouble . . . cases were sticking to the PTX Expander, popping loose, and spitting powder all over the place. Cleaned the PTX, buffed the PTX, ground the PTX, tried case lube . . . no change. Frustrated, I went upstairs, priced some Dillon equipment from Brian Enos, and went to bed

Today I went back down to give it one more try. Found the problem . . . because I have a lock washer on the shellplate it looked/felt secure . . . but it was not tightened sufficiently.

So the cases would "stick" to the PTX . . . hard enough to lift the shellplate . . . until it reached its limit . . . releasing the case . . . which then rocketed back down to the subplate . . . popping powder out.

Tightening the shellplate allowed the "stuck" cases to come off the PTX Expander at the speed of the ram's movement, eliminating both the feeling of a stuck case and the powder spills.

Probably saved me $2k too lol.

 

[smokindog]

Loose shellplate seems to manifest itself in many ways!!! I'm still debating the PTX

So I thought I'd post this here . . .

Last night I went downstairs to do 1k 9mm rounds on my LnL AP. Had nothing but trouble . . . cases were sticking to the PTX Expander, popping loose, and spitting powder all over the place. Cleaned the PTX, buffed the PTX, ground the PTX, tried case lube . . . no change. Frustrated, I went upstairs, priced some Dillon equipment from Brian Enos, and went to bed

Today I went back down to give it one more try. Found the problem . . . because I have a lock washer on the shellplate it looked/felt secure . . . but it was not tightened sufficiently.

So the cases would "stick" to the PTX . . . hard enough to lift the shellplate . . . until it reached its limit . . . releasing the case . . . which then rocketed back down to the subplate . . . popping powder out.

Tightening the shellplate allowed the "stuck" cases to come off the PTX Expander at the speed of the ram's movement, eliminating both the feeling of a stuck case and the powder spills.

Probably saved me $2k too lol.

 

[63expert]

I use the PTX setup for .40 and .38. I use a Lyman M die for .30 carbine. My PTXs work great.

Here is a write up I did about making the AP run better:

Originally Posted By TZ250:
I received a Hornady LNL AP for my birthday. I have read a great deal about the care and feeding of these machines, and the trials and tribulations that some experienced. My press ran well for me after the initial setup, but there was one issue that bothered me. At index on the downstroke of the ram(handle moving up), the shellplate would jump the last few degrees as the balls went home into the detents. No amount of tuning with the pawls would cure the abnormal movement. Closer examination showed that the shell plate was riding slightly above the sub-plate until the balls started to ramp into the detents. As the balls tried to go home the shellplate would leap forward and then sit down onto the sub-plate. This was not so bad except for the fact that I was loading .40S&W and the flake powder would occasionally hop out of the cases. I went looking for a solution. I took the shellplate off and then removed the sub-plate, exposing the drive hub and drive shaft. Seeing the relationship of the parts showed that the height of the drive hub and the height of the sub-plate set the clearance for the shellplate against the sub-plate. I called Hornady CS and described my problem. They sent a new drive hub but it was identical to the one in the press.

What follows is my solution to this problem.

I started by measuring the height of the drive hub and the height of the sub-plate. I found that the drive hub was .014" taller than the sub-plate. This difference is what allowed the shellplate to float above the sub-plate during indexing. I am a machinist and I knew the issue could be solved on a milling machine, but I wanted to come up with a no-cut solution. The drive hub is 1" in diameter and the ram area that it sits in has a 1.562" bore. I began to search for a shim set that would work and found one without to much trouble or cost.

Now to the good part.

This is the shim assortment, with sizes from .001 to .125". 1"ID and 1.5"OD. $7.90 to my door from eBay.

[url=http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7420/11656897056_a07881a0c0_c.jpg]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7420/11656897056_a07881a0c0_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr


Here you can see the drive hub sitting on the drive shaft.

[url=http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3780/11656630066_3ed10917f0_c.jpg]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3780/11656630066_3ed10917f0_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

Measuring the drive hub from shoulder to face shows that its critical dimension is .942"

[url=http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5485/11655871145_56540e8f06_c.jpg]http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5485/11655871145_56540e8f06_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

Measuring the sub plate shows a height of .928"

[url=http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5519/11656233914_46c0b987bb_c.jpg]http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5519/11656233914_46c0b987bb_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

This results in a .014" clearance. I knew it needed to be less. I decided to try a .004" clearance. Using the .01" shim showed great improvement, but I thought the clearance could go to .003". No .011" shim is provided so I made a stack out of a .005 and .006" shims.

Checking the stack.

[url=http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5490/11656238594_e0d690a725_c.jpg]http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5490/11656238594_e0d690a725_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

The shims in place on the drive hub.

[url=http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7407/11655884295_6aa393a687_c.jpg]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7407/11655884295_6aa393a687_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

Now when the shell plate is tightened the drive hub will be pulled barely above flush, keeping the shellplate in contact with the sub-plate and making the indexing of the press ultra smooth.

[url=http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7338/11655857285_1ed8284773_c.jpg]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7338/11655857285_1ed8284773_c.jpg[/url]
Untitled by zweitakt250, on Flickr

If you read much at all about the AP you will find many that complain about the lack of ability to seat primers below flush. My first run of 100 rounds resulted in two high primers, the rest just flush. I determined that this was also a result of the shellplate rising from the sub-plate. Pushing harder on the handle only resulted in the primer punch housing bottoming against the frame. Now with the clearance set the press will seat primers below flush with ease.

I hope that this thread will help those with a Hornady AP to create better ammo and be able to enjoy their press even more. Thanks for looking!

The rest of the thread, which has some good info, can be found on your favorite black rifle website..

 

[Twoboxer]

Thoroughly enjoyed that thread. Sometimes the shims are the fix, sometimes you can just tap the ball bearings deeper into the shellplate.

I bought the shims, but after raising the ball bearings haven't needed to use them yet.

 

[smokindog]

Hey, I may be "thick" here but could you post a link to that thread? I don't THINK it violates any rules!

I use the PTX setup for .40 and .38. I use a Lyman M die for .30 carbine. My PTXs work great.

Here is a write up I did about making the AP run better:





The rest of the thread, which has some good info, can be found on your favorite black rifle website..

 

[Twoboxer]

Hope it's not against the rules, because this thread is long and a very helpful contribution - pro and con - on how to deal with "tolerance stacking":

How to Tune the Hornady LnL AP Progressive Press

 

[63expert]

I didn't post the link because I didn't know if it was cool. Glad you all liked the thread.

 

[peterthefish]

Thanks for that! Just ordered the shims!

 

[Twoboxer]

Thanks for that! Just ordered the shims!

If the only issue you have is "popping powder", tapping the ball bearings further into the shell plate can often eliminate the problem. This allows them to settle rather than slam into their detents (early), jerking the shellplate forward.

 

[peterthefish]

Tried this first but no joy.

 

[Twoboxer]

Tried this first but no joy.

Shame lol . . . now there's more work to do. Good Luck!