I leave all my mags unloaded for long periods of time as I have so many of them for my m41 and M46. I rotate them every week that I shoot these handguns. I own at least 12 mags for these two guns and at least 5-6 for my 45APC as well. My 357 is a 8shot wheel gun so NO mags needed for it at all.
HOW LONG OKAY TO KEEP MAGAZINE LOADED?
- Thread starter JG1947
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smoothshooter
Member
Why not clip off a few coils, going carefully by doing one at a time, shoot a few rounds, and clip more as necessary.
Never understood people's reluctance to try such a simple operation.
Kahr pistols are the worst. I have had to cut a third of the coils off on several magazines to get them to work.
There is no excuse for having to shoot 200 rounds of ammo per Kahr's recommendation, and clip a bunch of coils get their guns to work considering what they charge for a gun.
Neither S&W, Springfield Armory, or Glock requires a break-in period. And their magazines almost always work.
For the rest of the shooting public, if you choose to so butcher a magazine, please make sure you notify the potential purchaser when you sell the pistol . . .
leonardocarrillo
Member
Estoy de acuerdo con usted yo tengo los cargadores de mi SIG SAUER P220 completos desde varios años y nunca tienen problemas.Lo mismo con mi BALLESTER MOLINA calibre .45 que llevan 35 años completos sin ningun defecto.
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"Agree with you. I have the Chargers (magazines) of my SIG SAUER P220 complete for several years and never have problems. The same with my BALLESTER MOLINA caliber. 45 that carry 35 full years without any defect."
Gracias
.
Ribwizzard
Member
I worry more about the ammo, than I do the springs.
Bought a Beretta 92 off a busy that needed the money.
It was barely a year old ( I was there when he bought it) and he lived in Florida and the humidity got to it. The copper jackets turned green and stuck together inside the mag. Nothing hard to fix and clean, but sure wouldn't feed correctly if he grabbed it in that condition in a emergency.
So it's always good to rotate fresh ammo or at least inspect them every so often.
Bought a Beretta 92 off a busy that needed the money.
It was barely a year old ( I was there when he bought it) and he lived in Florida and the humidity got to it. The copper jackets turned green and stuck together inside the mag. Nothing hard to fix and clean, but sure wouldn't feed correctly if he grabbed it in that condition in a emergency.
So it's always good to rotate fresh ammo or at least inspect them every so often.
Moisture can be an issue with it corroding the ammo and rusting the spring and magazine, but if stored in a dry environment, a magazine can be left fully loaded for decades, if the spring is of reasonable quality.
smoothshooter
Member
I don't think the term " butcher " applies here.
If clipping a few coils changes the magazine from one that malfunctions to one that works, I am doing the next owner a favor. Believe me, there is still plenty of tension left.
There is no reason for magazine spring tension to be as high as some of them are nowadays. Especially in single-stacks.
The Kahr magazine springs I have modified were 3 times the length of the magazine body when the parts were disassembled and laid alongside each other.
We will agree to disagree. Not knowing anything about magazine manufacture, I like to assume that the nice engineer fellas knew what they were doing. Too many times I (and others, I'm sure) have been the ultimate victim of a previous owner's Dremel tool . . .
I asked my PhD Metallurgist friend about keeping magazines loaded. Here is his reply:
As is usual with situations like these, there is no easy answer. As far as I can determine, these are the factors involved.
Gun magazine springs are generally made of spring steel. These are fairly high-carbon steels (0.50-0.60% C) and have other alloying elements like Mn, Cr, and V. The Cr and V affect the ability of the steel to attain hardness under heat treatment (hardenability to us metallurgists).
Apparently, spring steels vary in quality (one factor of which is chemical composition), which may be a reason for the difference in observed behavior.
Another reason for varying behavior could be the heat treatment. Generally, items like springs are heat treated in batches. After heat treatment, a certain number are tested, and if they pass the specifications, the batch is considered OK. This statistical testing scheme can fail to catch the ones that are too soft or too hard.
Therefore, if you got a gun magazine spring made of good material that was heat treated properly, you will probably not see weakening. But if you have a spring that was not manufactured to high quality standards, you could see weakening. I suppose that cheap magazines would have lower-quality springs.
The links below discuss gun magazine springs.
Magazine Springs - Quality Spring, Affordable Prices
What You Should Know About Magazine Springs | Gun Belts Blog
Spring Steels :: Total Materia Article
My own experience is with Ruger 10-round magazines for the 10/22 and the Butler Creek 25-round magazines. The 10-round magazines have a coil spring, much like a clock spring. After about two to three years (perhaps about 10,000 to 15,000 rounds), I notice that the rounds do not feed as forcefully as they once did.
For the Butler Creek 25-round magazine. I've noticed that there is also a decrease in the force of the feed. The above indicate that the springs are weakening with use.
As is usual with situations like these, there is no easy answer. As far as I can determine, these are the factors involved.
Gun magazine springs are generally made of spring steel. These are fairly high-carbon steels (0.50-0.60% C) and have other alloying elements like Mn, Cr, and V. The Cr and V affect the ability of the steel to attain hardness under heat treatment (hardenability to us metallurgists).
Apparently, spring steels vary in quality (one factor of which is chemical composition), which may be a reason for the difference in observed behavior.
Another reason for varying behavior could be the heat treatment. Generally, items like springs are heat treated in batches. After heat treatment, a certain number are tested, and if they pass the specifications, the batch is considered OK. This statistical testing scheme can fail to catch the ones that are too soft or too hard.
Therefore, if you got a gun magazine spring made of good material that was heat treated properly, you will probably not see weakening. But if you have a spring that was not manufactured to high quality standards, you could see weakening. I suppose that cheap magazines would have lower-quality springs.
The links below discuss gun magazine springs.
Magazine Springs - Quality Spring, Affordable Prices
What You Should Know About Magazine Springs | Gun Belts Blog
Spring Steels :: Total Materia Article
My own experience is with Ruger 10-round magazines for the 10/22 and the Butler Creek 25-round magazines. The 10-round magazines have a coil spring, much like a clock spring. After about two to three years (perhaps about 10,000 to 15,000 rounds), I notice that the rounds do not feed as forcefully as they once did.
For the Butler Creek 25-round magazine. I've noticed that there is also a decrease in the force of the feed. The above indicate that the springs are weakening with use.
03hemi
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English Vaquero, cause this is Merica!
Bacon grease - that way a good day at the range also smells like a good breakfast.
Sure, turn this into a "bear gun" thread!
Take two brand new magazines today, and load one. Come back in a year and inspect the springs. The one that was loaded will be noticeably shorter. This is called spring set. Load that same magazine, and then come back a year later, and it will be a smidgen shorter than it was last year. Eventually, the spring will "balance out" and wont get noticeably shorter, year after year, once the spring has already taken a set.
Every gun is different. Use one type of gun for a few years and the spring will be slap worn out. Use another type of gun for 40 years and the spring will still be strong. There are too many variables here at play.
Basically, if the gun is a plinker or is otherwise not used for defensive purposes, then who cares. But if you use that gun for defensive use, I would inspect the springs yearly or every other year. When it starts getting weak, swap the spring out for a new one.
In the case of my Glock magazines, new magazines are cheap. I just sell off my old magazines every 4-5 years, and replace them with new ones. I can buy ten new magazines for about $170, and sell off all my old ones at $15 a piece. $20 to replace all my "old" mags every 5 years, and have new magazines, with new springs, is a bargain.
Every gun is different. Use one type of gun for a few years and the spring will be slap worn out. Use another type of gun for 40 years and the spring will still be strong. There are too many variables here at play.
Basically, if the gun is a plinker or is otherwise not used for defensive purposes, then who cares. But if you use that gun for defensive use, I would inspect the springs yearly or every other year. When it starts getting weak, swap the spring out for a new one.
In the case of my Glock magazines, new magazines are cheap. I just sell off my old magazines every 4-5 years, and replace them with new ones. I can buy ten new magazines for about $170, and sell off all my old ones at $15 a piece. $20 to replace all my "old" mags every 5 years, and have new magazines, with new springs, is a bargain.
I have no problems clipping coils.
However, I wanted to test the old wives tale about leaving magazines loaded.
At the time I had 10 additional magazines for my P220s that worked perfectly
one eye joe
US Veteran
I SHOT 6 FULL GI MAGS OF .45ACP BALL AMMO, WITHOUT A HITCH, FROM MY 1911.....
I FOUND THEM, ALONG WITH SOME BAYONETS, IN AN ABANDONED WW II COASTAL FORTIFICATION, SOME 50 YEARS AFTER THE END OF THE WAR........
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smoothshooter
Member
I inspect, evaluate, and repair shockingly expensive and very close tolerance turbine aircraft engine component parts for a living, using precision instruments, and a LOT of hand work with fine abrasives, needle files, polishing by hand, etc.
I also know about performance testing, the subtleties of temperature effects on metals, and friction and proper clearance dimensions. I am accustomed to working on items/components that people's lives depend on in the military and civilian world.
I am no master gunsmith, nor claim to be.
But I think I do okay on magazines and magazine springs.
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Wolff Gun Springs
The OEM spring supplier for many fine firearms made in the USA
No SW and Ruger don't have their own spring companies, Neither does Wilson Combat or Jerry
But what do they know?
https://www.gunsprings.com/index.php?page=FAQ#question5
5. How often should I change magazine spring? Should I unload my magazines, rotate magazines, load with fewer than the maximum rounds?
Magazine springs in semi-auto pistols are one of the most critical springs and are the subject of much debate and concern. Magazines which are kept fully loaded for long periods of time, such as in law enforcement and personal/home defense applications, will generally be subject to more fatigue than the weekend shooter's magazine springs in which the magazines are loaded up only when shooting.
Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.
More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.
In applications where the magazine must be kept loaded at all times, a high quality magazine spring such as Wolff extra power magazine springs, will provide maximum life. Regular replacement of magazine springs will provide the best defense against failure from weak magazine springs. Regular shooting of the pistol is the best way to be sure the springs are still functioning reliably.
The OEM spring supplier for many fine firearms made in the USA
No SW and Ruger don't have their own spring companies, Neither does Wilson Combat or Jerry
But what do they know?
https://www.gunsprings.com/index.php?page=FAQ#question5
5. How often should I change magazine spring? Should I unload my magazines, rotate magazines, load with fewer than the maximum rounds?
Magazine springs in semi-auto pistols are one of the most critical springs and are the subject of much debate and concern. Magazines which are kept fully loaded for long periods of time, such as in law enforcement and personal/home defense applications, will generally be subject to more fatigue than the weekend shooter's magazine springs in which the magazines are loaded up only when shooting.
Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.
More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.
In applications where the magazine must be kept loaded at all times, a high quality magazine spring such as Wolff extra power magazine springs, will provide maximum life. Regular replacement of magazine springs will provide the best defense against failure from weak magazine springs. Regular shooting of the pistol is the best way to be sure the springs are still functioning reliably.
After reading everything above.......
I don't think I'll keep mine loaded beyond forever.
I don't think I'll keep mine loaded beyond forever.
