Identity assistance please

[akinaz]

First time posting so please excuse any faux pas.



I am looking at a purchase and trying to get a definitive identification. I am told it is .32 caliber, I can see Winchester on the barrel but the caliber is not clear. I think it is a 32-20.

From what I can tell it is a 5 screw, in decent shape (Love the old style gloss bluing) target model.



Serial number on butt appears not to have an alpha prefix. It is in the 47,7XX range.


Any help would be appreciated!

 

[PeteC]

.32-20 Hand Ejector Model of 1905 - 3rd Change.
S/N 45201-65700, manufactured 1909-1915.
20,499 made

Looks like a target version, but it also looks like a round-butt model, and the SCSW book only mentions target models briefly, and as square butt, not round (?)


edit: ...and welcome to the forum!

 

[murphydog]

Welcome! It is a .32-20 Military & Police Target from about 1909. Collectors call it a model of 1905 3rd change, with a round butt. The ".32 Winchester" barrel stamping was on the earlier guns, later changed to .32 WCF and finally .32-20...S & W didn't want to put the name of even an indirect competitor on their guns.

The Target models are uncommon, thought to be no more than 10% of regular production, and if original is worth quite a bit.

 

[akinaz]

Thank you for quick reply!

Thank you murphydog and PeteC for the quick response. That goes with what I was thinking.

Now I just have to find an FFL that is registered with that site to bid for me


I would like to add this one to the similiar aged one my father left me.

 

[CMudrock]

Thank you murphydog and PeteC for the quick response. That goes with what I was thinking.

Now I just have to find an FFL that is registered with that site to bid for me


I would like to add this one to the similiar aged one my father left me.

I have purchased any number of firearms on line - bidding myself (no FFL) as an individual with a credit card. If you win you can usually get your local ffl to email their license. My friendly local FFL dealer gave me a copy of his FFL I can email.

I don't want to see you loose out & mention this - so you can get busy. Good Luck ! C.

PS. I always hang back on bidding until the last minute on auctions - that way I'm never bidding against myself. When I do finally bid - it's as much as I can - or will spend. Some times I win - other times I watch bidding go beyond my means early on. Hope this helps.

 

[Muley Gil]

I have purchased any number of firearms on line - bidding myself (no FFL) as an individual with a credit card. If you win you can usually get your local ffl to email their license. My friendly local FFL dealer gave me a copy of his FFL I can email.

I don't want to see you loose out & mention this - so you can get busy. Good Luck ! C.

PS. I always hang back on bidding until the last minute on auctions - that way I'm never bidding against myself. When I do finally bid - it's as much as I can - or will spend. Some times I win - other times I watch bidding go beyond my means early on. Hope this helps.

This isn't a standard auction house. It is a sheriff's office in the SW & you have to pick up the firearm in person-no shipping.

tennexplorer found the link for me, but it is an on-going auction and I'm not allowed to post the link here on the forum.

 

[DGNY]

Welcome & Wishing you all the best of luck. Very interesting item if an original target model.

Hope you win so you can share the nitty-gritty after receipt and inspection.

 

[glowe]

Welcome to the Forum. A couple of major negatives with regards to that revolver. First is that the stocks are from a post WWII period and not original to the gun. Original period walnut stocks are rare to find and quite expensive, but most likely what would have been put on a target revolver from the factory back then. Black hard rubber stocks are more common, and maybe an option, but the gun probably left the factory looking like my 32 Winchester below. Second, there appears to be a major ring around the barrel just behind the front sight?? I would be concerned about that as to why is it there, definitely not original.

I have been buying early 32 Winchester and 38 Special Target revolvers and personally would not pay over $500 for that one. While you might be able to find period correct stocks, they will never be original to the gun. Actually, that ring bothers me so much that I might not bid on it at all??

The bottom gun is a 1908 square butt Target with concave stocks, the top gun is from 1910 with gold medallion stocks and the middle is from 1924 with convex style stocks. Both round and square butt stocks from 1905 to 1910 had the same style top round.

Let me add an image of a 1910 to 1920 round butt walnut stocked 32 Winchester M&P Target in case yours proves to be that era.

 

[Mbrgr1]

Welcome to the Forum. A couple of major negatives with regards to that revolver. First is that the stocks are from a post WWII period and not original to the gun. Original period walnut stocks are rare to find and quite expensive, but most likely what would have been put on a target revolver from the factory back then. Black hard rubber stocks are more common, and maybe an option, but the gun probably left the factory looking like my 32 Winchester below. Second, there appears to be a major ring around the barrel just behind the front sight?? I would be concerned about that as to why is it there, definitely not original.

I have been buying early 32 Winchester and 38 Special Target revolvers and personally would not pay over $500 for that one. While you might be able to find period correct stocks, they will never be original to the gun. Actually, that ring bothers me so much that I might not bid on it at all??

The bottom gun is a 1908 square butt Target with concave stocks, the top gun is from 1910 with gold medallion stocks and the middle is from 1924 with convex style stocks. Both round and square butt stocks from 1905 to 1910 had the same style top round.

Let me add an image of a 1910 to 1920 round butt walnut stocked 32 Winchester M&P Target in case yours proves to be that era.

That ring is odd, cut, threaded and screwed in? Strange...

 

[PeteC]

That ring is odd, cut, threaded and screwed in? Strange...

Maybe someone had the barrel clamped in a vise or using some other tool, and it started to turn. Or wanted to shorten the barrel and changed his mind (unlikely on a target gun, but not impossible). I assume the OP knows it is there.

 

[Hondo44]

It doesn't appear to be a "ring" as in ringed or bulged barrel. Just slight dents, but need better photos to ascertain what it really is.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Looks like the end of the barrel was cut and a short replacement with target blade screwed back on. Where's BMur when you need him?

 

[Hondo44]

Guy, you might be right, a clever way to eliminate a bulge in the barrel, maintain the original front sight, and retain as much barrel length as possible. But i don't know how the rifling could be aligned at the joint since the muzzle piece with sight attached cannot be rotated.

I wonder if the muzzle is back bored.

Maybe the OP can confirm if the barrel is a standard length.

However the seam or mark on the right side of the barrel does not seem exactly perpendicular or square to the barrel.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Jim, the gun is LE evidence in Florence AZ. I doubt the OP can see or inspect it. It is being sold "as-is." There are other pictures besides those posted but they don't offer anything new or interesting.

 

[akinaz]

I let it go

Hi All


Thank you very much for all the insightful replies. I walked away from the pistol when it got close to $500 with fees.



All these great comments is leading me to post some info on the S&W my father left me. It is of the similar vintage.

 

[murphydog]

Please do post photos, we like hearing family stories about guns.

And the gun's location brings back memories - my father was employed at the State Prison there in the mid-late 1950s and I visited the town with him back in the 1980s. It appears the old facility is being closed after 113 years but apparently there is a newer one and also a privately run operation there. I doubt there would be much economic activity there without them.