In Between Loads

[sjs]

I am trying to load 158 grain, XTP bullets for my .357 using HP38.
My Lee Reloading Manual lists the minimum to maximum loads as
1. 3.8 - 4.3 grains for 38 special
2. 4.0 - 4.6 grains for 38 special +P
3. 6.2 - 6.9 grains for .357 mag.

My other manuals are similar.

This leaves 4.7 to 6.1 grains as uncharted territory. If I want to try loads within this uncharted area, do I:

A. Use 38 Special brass,
B. Use .357 brass,
C Use either one, or
D. Use neither one.

I don't normally go below minimum or above max, but in this case I think the in between loads would be safe. Not too light in .357 brass to end up with a squib or other safety issue, but perhaps too hot for 38 special brass.

I am responsible for my loads, not anyone else, but I would enjoy hearing any comments on this.

Thanks.

 

[jonnnyboy]

B. 357 magnum brass

Many reloaders use magnum brass for 38 special loads as well to alleviate the carbon ring buildup caused by using 38s in 357m chambers. Also, many reloaders use 38s recipes for 357 lite loads.

Therefore, for anything over 38+P loads, use magnum brass.

 

[mikld]

No difference in strength of 38 vs. 357 brass, just length. What are you looking for in a load? Light Magnum? Heavy Special? I have taken 38 Special loads out of my manuals and put them in 357 brass. No big deal, I just realize the listed 38 data/velocities is going to be higher than what I'll get in 357 brass.

If I wanted light plinking loads I'd use 38 Specials starting loads in 357 brass. You can load anything from light 38 Special target loads up to max 357 Magnum loads in 357 brass. I've never had a "squib" in my 4" 357...

 

[fredj338]

I just use max 38sp data in my magnum brass & call it good for plinking ammo.

 

[sjs]

Thanks much guys. I just want to try this range of loads in case I stumble onto a load for target shooting that is more accurate than what I now have. I wasn't sure if there was a safety issue. I think I will start with the magnum brass and standard primer.

 

[Wise_A]

I would use .357 Magnum brass--

1) For .38 Spl-level plinking loads, to prevent carbon ring buildup and minimize the distance between the bullet and the forcing cone

and

2) For any load intended for a .357 Magnum, that exceeded .38 Spl data. Why risk it? Even if I'm bright enough to always read the box, it's always good practice to act as if someone else were about to replace you. Hence the one-powder-on-the-bench-at-a-time rule, and the no-Magnum-loads-in-Spl-brass rule.

 

[Nevada Ed]

Big 10-4;

Anything above a +p 38 goes into a 357 magnum case.

It's the correct thing to do.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

You're not going to cause a squib with lighter loads in .357 Magnum brass. There is only a 1/8" difference.

When loading to higher pressures than a .38 Special would be I would always use .357 Magnum brass. It's not because the brass is stronger, it's because it's always possible a hot load in .38 brass could find it's way into a revolver that can't handle the pressure. This way it's another layer of safety.

 

[Boogsawaste]

I do this quite frequently and as the others anything above book +p goes into 357 brass. I found some good accurate loads this way.

 

[gwpercle]

Loading them in 357 cases will keep them out of small framed 38 special guns. Since they are above 38 special +P , no sense taking any chances.
Gary

 

[Willyboy]

Hp 38 loads

I use a load slightly greater than the +p with HP38 and the 158 gr bullet.
I use 357 brass to prevent using them in a 38spcl. And it is a nice target load
for my 357 magnum. Willyboy

 

[noylj]

B. Use .357 brass. You are NOT shooting .38 Special loads. Remember, all the start load means is:
1) a 10-12% reduction from the max load
2) the loads are listed to produce the same velocity (i.e., the load data goes in steps from 800, 850, 900, 950, 1000 fps) such that the start load for fast powders is often a bit more than load manuals who go with method (1) above and the slow powers often have start loads less than found in load manuals who go with method (1)
3) The loads are listed for the same max average chamber pressure
In none of the manuals, is the START load a MINIMUM load (no matter what Lee calls it--as he just "normalized" lots of data and often has a "minimum" and "max" load at the same charge weight.


Personally, all I use in a .357 Mag is .357 Mag cases, and I load them to the same charge as .38 Spl and adjust as desired.

 

[Jupiter01]

Good information!
Magnum brass, unless .38 is all you have. If starting out, there is not much difference in co$t between the two sizes of brass, and it fades into insignificance after 4-5 reloads. But...I have noticed that .357 magnum brass is less available in stores than .38 Special.
I take my reloading manuals, and go to the .38 Spl. +P loads. I then add 5-10% to the max. powder/bullet load I choose, which most of the time produces less velocity than the starting loads listed for my .357 Magnum. The pressures are safe in a Magnum, but maybe not so much in a .38 Spl. pistol.

Neither my brother-in-law nor I have any love for full-charge 158 gr loads, or 125 gr. ~14-1500fps loads, and we have chosen what we call "hot .38-mild Magnum loads" and figure they will be effective for almost any purpose. Let's face it, we are not all steely-eyed gunfighters, as much as we would like to be!
I have found these sort of loads much more pleasant to shoot than full-charge 357s, nor do I feel under-weaponed.

There is an article, somewhere, about full charge (about 800-900 fps) Wadcutters being useful for hunting and self defense. I didn't copy the article, but I did recognize the name, and it was a very thought provoking article.

The takeaway? 38 +P or +P+ loads in +p rated or .357 magnum revolvers are significantly effective defense or hunting loads, as are full Wadcutters at reasonable velocity/recoil levels...8-900 fps. And...we shoot best with what kicks us least!

 

[BLUEDOT37]

No difference in strength of 38 vs. 357 brass, just length.

I'm not sure that's a good assumption to make. It may be true some of the time but definitely not all the time. Here's one example:

"Winchester (W-W) .38 Special wadcutter brass has a longer straight untapered thin case wall from the case mouth to the first cannelure than the standard case. This allows the deep seated wadcutter bullet to not hit the thicker wall of the case toward the case head. This can cause the loaded case to bulge and/or the bullet to be damaged. This also gives an even case tension on the entire length of the bullets. Wadcutter brass can often be distinguished by it's double crimp ring."

Use 357 Mag cases for your in-between loads.

.

 

[rwsmith]

Anything over....

Anything over .38 max load should be loaded in .357 brass so they won't be used in a .38 gun.

I only use .38 brass in my .38 guns. And .357 brass in my .357, regardless of load.