Is the quality of S&W actually not great, not terrible?

[jurek]

Note about the M&P Shield EZ, if it shoots low it's still yours,
S&W will not repair it.

I didn't notice 9mm EZ shooting low... I'd say it is personal experience.

I was shooting dozen different manufacturers, after 16 months I came back to M&P and found it the best tools for me.
Even I love H&K, Walther and CZ (I'm European) - M&P is my first choice.
I can still consider SIG as an option... but as second choice.

I know everyone has its own experience and thoughts - this opinion is mine - no matter what, M&P is one of the best series of firearms.

 

[newpewpew]

Let me put my comment another way. If I bought a certain brand of gun and had problems with it that might not stop me from buying another of that brand. But if I had problems with every single gun I bought in that brand I'd never make it to owning five of them. If two bad ones didn't turn me off that brand the third one would for sure.

Every manufacturer turns out a lemon from time to time but the odds that one customer will get five of them have to be really high. So excuse me if at that point I think the problem lies not in the product but instead with the user.

First, you blamed the operator without explaining what you thought the operator's mistakes were, and without giving advice on what could be done better. This doesn't help anyone, other than maybe your own ego. I hope you don't have the same approach to friends and family in discussions of problems they're having.

Next, it's natural to form conclusions by making generalizations based on personal experience (you didn't have issues with a specific situation, other people must be at fault if they have problems in the same situation), especially when information is limited. But details of each problem were provided.

In case you skipped over the descriptions of the problems, I pointed out that it's unreasonable to fault the customer for parts missing before delivery. Or for poor tolerances that were confirmed by local FFLs. Instead of discussing these points, you ignore them and double down on your original opinion.

Regarding avoiding a brand after experiencing a problem. Yes, many people would not wait to switch brands. Others stick with what they're familiar with, if the severity does not pass a threshold. I'm part of the later group, and I admit that I am hesitant of change. People react differently to problems.

If you read the descriptions of the problems, 4 of the 5 were either minor, or had simple fixes with common household tools or available replacement parts. I felt the severity was low enough to be overlooked. The BG 380 is the 5th and newest M&P purchased. It is the one that has an unresolved problem that I'd consider dangerous, and spurred my rant.

 

[mmb617]

I now have 5 handguns of the M&P line, and every single one has had issues ranging from annoying to dangerous. I contacted S&W customer service for 2 of them and didn't get very good help. I had to fix or am in the process of fixing all the issues myself.

This is my final comment in this thread. It's the point I can't seem to get across.



“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

 

[4506517]

Almost every M&P user is happy, only few are unlucky.

I must be unlucky. I was issued the original "full size" M & P 45. I ended up going through multiple pistols personally. At one point S & W, or the distributor, replaced my entire agency's "fleet" of the handgun. Everyone went through at least 2.

The agency finally got smart and ditched the thing. Our problems ran from front sights falling off, rusted magazines, premature magazine spring failures, cracked followers, rusted slides, rusted internal parts, broken extractors, broken strikers, and many other broken internal parts. Quality was horrible.

Let me say, prior to the M & P, we issued the 4566. Heavy, but I trusted it. I did not trust the M & P. It is a tad unnerving working and constantly wondering if the darn thing would work when you need it.

We replaced it with the Glock 17, Gen 4. What a superlative pistol. Almost every agency in our area? Yep, that's right, replacing their M & P pistols.

I will give the gun credit: for a 45 it was quite soft shooting. The trigger was a nightmare, but when it worked it wasn't that bad to shoot.

As I travel and attend training across this state, I am seeing fewer and fewer M & P pistols in LE holsters.

While I think the M & P line has enjoyed limited commercial success, I really don't think it has enjoyed the wide spread LE success that S & W anticipated it would.

 

[cowboy4evr]

I've only owned 2 S&W MP's , a 45 compact and a 40 compact . Both were brand new and both ran " perfectly " POA=POI and zero FTE , FTF etc . They both are now gone only because I'm just not a semi auto fan . My decision to sell had nothing to do with performance . Just a personal thing . If I decided to buy another semi auto in polymer frame I would have no problem again buying S&W MPs . regards Paul

 

[UTGuy]

I've owned several M&P pistols, going back to a 1.0 Shield in .40, then 9. I then switched to the M&P 2.0 for duty in 2018, carrying both a full-size for uniformed work and Compact 3.6", then later a Subcompact 3.6", for plain clothes work and a Shield 2.0 for off-duty. I've just added a Shield Plus.

Aside from an occasional FTF or FTE, I've never had a defect in any of them. No broken parts, no sites falling off (though I switch the factory 3-dots with TFX sites almost immediately after purchase), or any other malfunction or defect with the gun that required more than a take-down and cleaning at home.

I wouldn't blame the user for a slew of problems, such as the OPs, but I would blame their bad luck.

That said, I've never had problems from any of my handguns, including my Glock 22G3, 19G3, 19G4, my Sig P320 XCompact, or any of the dozen or so Springfield XD/XDm/XDs pistols I've owned over the years. The only gun I've owned that required a trip to the mfg was a Springfield 1911 I bought second hand that had a broken extractor, that Springfield fixed for free with a complete turn-around of 5 DAYS.

 

[ShieldDriver]

Dang, sorry for your run of bad luck. I currently own two M&P (Shield 2.0 and Shield Plus) Both of mine are just fine. I also have a few older smiths. 3913, M29, M60, and they have been outstanding quality wise.

 

[Miami_JBT]

The M&P line never won me over and I tried to like my M&P .45. But it just sacked and couldn't hold a candle to my GLOCK 21. I got the M&P when it first came out. The accuracy was bad and the trigger was horrendous.