Know your first aid...

[sipowicz]

Last night from one of our Sgts...

At 0302 hours, 05-03-10, WHD personnel responded to a vehicle / pedestrian traffic accident in the parking lot of West Hollywood Park. The female victim was found stuck beneath the driver’s side of the suspect’s vehicle. She was pinned at chest level by the vehicle, with her body exposed from mid-torso to her feet. Although pinned beneath the vehicle, she was breathing, moving, and somewhat communicating. There was also a trail of blood behind the vehicle where she had been drug.

There was talk of jacking the vehicle up and removing the victim from beneath. A tow truck driver was flagged down and had a jack in place, ready to raise the vehicle. Based upon the victim’s breathing and movement, the decision was made to not raise the vehicle, but to continue talking to her until paramedics arrived. Paramedics arrived within minutes and freed the victim.

When faced with an incident like this, on or off duty, you must consider the possibility that your initial, instinctive response might make the situation worse. In this incident, lifting the vehicle off of the victim could have led to more severe bleeding, or allowed the victim the freedom to move around and possibly cause further injury to herself. When the vehicle was lifted from the victim in this incident, she did just that, but was restrained by paramedics.

I conferred with the Fire Captain on scene and he was very complimentary of the way deputy personnel handled the incident. Had the victim not been breathing or responsive, he said that lifting the vehicle would have been the correct response so that immediate care could be given. In this incident, we did it right.

Please use this incident as a reminder of how important it is to be proficient and knowledgeable in your first aid techniques. It is not uncommon that we arrived first to a 902R call or traffic accident where we have to take some form of initial first aid action. Off duty, it could be family or a friend in need of your proficient and immediate care.

 

[BarbC]

My grandmother once had to jump on the running board to stop her runaway vehicle with her son in it. They crashed into a tree. The first people on the scene wanted to put a pillow under her head and she said to leave her be. Good thing they didn't because her broken ribs would have pierced her lung.

First, do no harm.

 

[NFrameFred]

I worked in the mining industry for 15 years where semi-annual ( at the time, as I recall) safety/first aid re-training was mandatory for all personnel. I've always thought it was something that should be required in schools, but our litigious society finds all kinds of ways to wring it's hands over common sense things that would benefit everyone on the the assumption that someone will make a mistake and cause someone to get sued ( like it doesn't already happen anyway).

Basic first aid training is valuable as much for knowing what NOT to do as Sip points out. Scouting organizations and the Red Cross and many others offer such classes (usually for free) and it's a good thing to know.

I've been in public situations on more than one occasion where a medical emergency through accident or illness arises in the midst of multiple onlookers and my experience has been the majority of folks freeze and are afraid to help out of fear of doing something wrong. If it's someone you care about, you'd want them to get help as quickly as possible, however basic until trained responders can make it to the site.

 

[ingmansinc]

How do you feel about this plan? If I was the only person available to provide first aid and wasn't sure what to do I think I would attempt to stop bleeding, keep air passages open, and keep victim warm until help arrived. I would not move the person unless it was necessary to prevent further injury.

 

[Damn Yankee]

Two weeks ago I was in my unit sitting in the parking lot of a Funeral Home waiting for some other officers to do a escort. I was about fifty feet and parallel with the road with cars on both sides of the unit. I heard this loud thump and looking out the side window I saw a man flying through the air about as high as the telephone wires.

I called dispatch informing them of a Signal 1 involving a pedestrian. When I reached the road there was a motorcycle on its side smashed all to pieces. The Van's front fender caved in windshield broken and both airbags deployed. About thirty feet away lying in the ditch on his back was the rider of the motorcycle. I went to him and he wasn't breathing. I started CPR and worked on him for a few minutes with no results. His mouth opened and closed a couple of times and then there was a slight moan. I think he died then.

 

[handejector]

Please use this incident as a reminder of how important it is to be proficient and knowledgeable in your first aid techniques. It is not uncommon that we arrived first to a 902R call or traffic accident where we have to take some form of initial first aid action. Off duty, it could be family or a friend in need of your proficient and immediate care.

First, do no harm.

How do you feel about this plan? If I was the only person available to provide first aid and wasn't sure what to do I think I would attempt to stop bleeding, keep air passages open, and keep victim warm until help arrived. I would not move the person unless it was necessary to prevent further injury.

Excellent post, Sip, and excellent points made by all.

I know a lot of first aid. I have been in situations many times in my life where I could use it. I can't really account for why, but there have been some doozies. I sat stopped one day on the interstate while cranes were lifting a precast beam for into place for a new bridge. One of the crane booms BROKE, dropping the beam and the boom! I ran down to the scene, and could see an arm hanging over the side of the beam they were about to set the beam on. The crane operator was simply staring wideyed at the arm, frozen. I said "Come help me" and took off climbing the boom- the only way up to the guy 20 feet or so up. Got up on the beam, crane op behind me. The arm's owner starts coming to. BIG guy, maybe 220 or more, and not in a real good mood! Remember- it's 20 feet or more DOWN to the road, and we're on a beam 20-24 inches wide. He calmed down after some yelling. Glad the crane op knew his name. He wanted off that beam, and I really did not want to tell him no, if you get my drift. I was sure he was basically OK. Got him up, and walked the length of the beam to the old bridge. Whew! A cable from the crane's boom had apparently slapped him up side his head, only dazing him a mite. Just a guess, but he looked like a rough enough ol' boy to have been hit harder, somewhere, sometime.

Another time, outside a bar, a few friends and I were saying goodbye when we heard BLAM-BLAM. A station wagon had run over a guy- both axles. Alive, but not much to do there. Airway checked, elevated feet, covered with jackets requisitioned from the crowd till the wagon showed. Sure knocked the edge off a rather good buzz. No clue if he lived.

There have been others. I've always found it remarkable how many people in a crowd are willing to take orders if you just start giving them.

.........and there is always that exception- the point of all this rambling-

Driving down a country road one day, beautiful hot afternoon. Round a curve, see a car upside down to the right, 25 feet off the road, against a tree, wheels still turning!
The bark is knocked off that 20 inch poplar about 15-18 feet above the ground. I don't know how, but the car had been airborne and upside down when the driver's door hit the tree, and it slid down to the ground. It is a large, 70's land cruiser of some brand. I get to it. It is wrapped significantly around the tree. We are on a slope, and I can't open passenger door. Windshield is broken, and one corner hanging out of the frame. Peeking in, I see a stocky guy in his late 30's laying on his back, breathing very loud, raspy, labored, and bloody and unconscious.

Well, I got the windshield out. Crawl in. Clear the airway. I think that's when my shirt came off. Bad situation. Cut switch off. Gas tank is intact, but some gas is running out the spout. Not much, but enough to worry me.
Hmmmm. I'm thinking- if we burn, this will be tough. Pretty good sized guy. Definite chest injury, but no holes. Only way out is through the windshield. Steering wheel and terrain won't make this easy, and the hood is an overhanging awning that only cramps the space more.
This is before I had a cell phone. An off duty fireman showed up that had a cell.
I am thinking I want to pull this guy out and have him laying in the grass when the wagon arrives. I am also thinking I might punch lots of holes in his already bad lungs or heart. We're not gonna burn, though. I've seen that happen to a Huey. Oddly, the thought crosses my mind that if I can't get him out, and it burns, should I shoot him?
Got off that thought and decided I would pull harder. Guy is wearing a T shirt and jeans. No belt. Will have to pull by the wrists, arms obviously above head. Bad postion for a mushy chest.

So, we wait. He blows red bubbles, I clean them out.
Paras arrive. I'm thinking we'll slide a board in, tie him to it, and slide him out.
Not procedure. My suggestion was not welcomed.
We wait for the rescue crew. They want to cut the car apart, and lift it OFF HIM. Great. Now we wait for a wrecker.
Wrecker arrives. Everybody is setting up their toys. We are stacking timber blocks to keep the car from falling or shifting when they cut the roof off it. We are dragging chains to hook up the wrecker. We are jawing the roof posts in two because the saws might light the gas.
Finally, the car is pulled off, and THEN they bring in the board!
The golden hour is about gone.
When I walked toward my truck, he was on a gurney behind the wagon, and they were bagging him and giving him manual chest compressions. So much for the mushy chest.
I drove home shirtless, bloody, and dejected, figuring he was dead.
He was buried three days later.
I always wondered if he'd have lived if I'd drug him out. Dunno. Might have killed him. But, the fact is he'd have been rolling about 40 minutes sooner, assuming I had gotten him out alive.

No secret- I support Paramedics, LEO's, and Firemen. They do a great job by and large.
Sometimes, though, I think 'the book' can get somebody killed.
It haunts me, and I will always wonder. I watched the tree die from the large amount of bark he knocked off it, and it stood for years as I watched it rot when I drove that road daily.

 

[Bullet Bob]

As an USAF medic for 15 years, I can't tell you how many well-meaning good samaritans I've had to knock off of people who had an accident. Giving CPR to someone who is breathing on their own is *not* a good idea.

I think some people take the basic training and have a real desire to use it, as well as wanting to help people in need.

 

[USAF385]

I think some people take the basic training and have a real desire to use it, as well as wanting to help people in need.

My only first aid training was during basic training and SERE school. I had a few refresher courses but nothing major. I know that I personally am hardly qualified in these situations, so my first thought would be to call 91 and try to keep everyone calm. As much as I would like to help, hopefully at the time I'd be cool enough to asses the situation and determine if my actions will cause harm.

I was at a wedding recently where one of the guests collapsed to the ground. Another guest (a nurse) ran over and was about to start CPR when two other guests (both doctors) had to almost pull her off of the collapsed woman... she was breathing on her own.

 

[ladder13]

In my past experiences as a career FF/EMT, I can say some of the worst care given a person in duress happens in Doctors offices.Not trying to offend ALL doctors here, just the bad ones. Can't recall how many times we were called to an office for "patient not breathing" or "cardiac arrest", only to arrive and see everyone standing around, including the doctor and staff. Seemed like all they were interested in was for the "problem to go away", not wanting us to perform CPR or other life-saving methods while in the waiting room. We used to get the feeling they were telling us to "do your thing outside the office".
Best feeling was when we transferred care to the ER, those folks were always ready for anything and topnotch caregivers.

 

[NFrameFred]

I'm certainly no expert or a trained responder, but the basics are check to see if the victim is breathing, position the head and clear the airway if they aren't and check for a pulse. Then, IF you have some knowledge of it, artificial respiration and CPR can be attempted if necessary.

You don't move them until someone who knows how can evaluate their injuries unless they're in danger of death or worse injury from not being moved. The best thing anyone can do waiting for trained personnel to arrive is the least possible to keep the victim stable and from worsening the effects of shock which can kill as easily as a severe injury.

And there are always going to be those exceptions to the rule when any rational person will have to question what is exactly the right thing to do. It's like a shoot/no shoot situation where you have seconds or less to decide what someone else will have weeks or months to pick apart and second-guess.

 

[sureshotbob]

I take a CPR and basic first aid course every year for my OSHA 30 training .I hope I never have to use it. Years ago I was at a party and a guy passed out .No one knew that he had drank a quart of Wild Turkey and did some kind of pill's my girlfriend and I did CPR till the paramedic's got there but the guy ended up dieing anyway's.

 

[JayCeeNC]

I've had a lot of experience. LEO for 25+ years, worked for EMS for a few years on an ambulance, been in 3 wars.
Yesterday I watched a helicopter crash into the ground trying to land, wound up on it's side. 3 casualties, all rescued while the engine was still running and the remnants of the rotors were STILL SPINNING furiously, digging into the ground, and the body of the chopper was bouncing around due to the still spinning rotors. Oh, yeah...cargo was 60mm mortar rounds, lying all around after the crates splintered on impact.
Guess I can check "chopper crash" off my list.

 

[mm6mm6]

Good points. Reminds me of Steve Irwin and the stingray barb. Leave it in.