Latest 1st. Mod. .44 Russian

[Exmilcop]

I had hoped to be trading up from the one I sold, but such may not be the case. I just received my latest acquisition, a 1st. Mod.DA in .44 Russian and I should have asked more questions from the seller. My bad. The grips aren't original to the pistol, and there is some damage to the crown so what that will do to accuracy remains to be seen. There's more slop to the cylinder than I'd like but not to the point where it would be unsafe to fire. On the left side of the barrel it says "44 S&W CTG". The S&W logo is barely discernable on the frame. I believe the serial number, though high (#45245) is still prior to 1898 which is our cut-off date for acceptance as "antique" status. On the good side, the bore and chambers are very nice so I'm kind of torn. Someone fixed the "push off" in single action, perhaps badly, so when you pull the trigger in single action, you must pull through or the trigger and hammer will both go back into position. It seems to give a little stutter that you have to pull through. Interesting. I'd appreciate your opinions.

 

[opoefc]

See PM Ed

 

[mmaher94087]

"... or the trigger and hammer will both go back into position." Do you mean that the hammer will return to the fired (down) position as pressure is relieved on the trigger?

 

[Exmilcop]

"... or the trigger and hammer will both go back into position." Do you mean that the hammer will return to the fired (down) position as pressure is relieved on the trigger?

Exactly! If you don't "pull through" the stutter, the trigger and hammer go back to the ready to fire position.

 

[BMur]

Late long frame

Nice late model long frame.
Looks like the hammer stud is a replacement and the ratchet spud is sheared off so this gun has been through the wash a few times. Likely needs several internal issues tightened up. Likely a lot of clearance issues due to wear.

Murph

 

[mmaher94087]

Exmilcop, what you describe is most likely caused by filing/stoning the sear(s) of the hammer and/or the rear sear beyond their limits. This recutting of the sear(s) allows the hammer to fall back (catch) on the double action sear on the front of the hammer. My guess is that either the hammer or the rear sear or both needs replacing. In double action, the DA (front) sear releases the hammer before the rear (single action) sear engages the hammer. By filing/stoning either SA sear too much, the DA sear will catch the hammer as you describe.

"...and the ratchet spud is sheered off ...". I agree. This needs replacing too.

 

[Exmilcop]

Exmilcop, what you describe is most likely caused by filing/stoning the sear(s) of the hammer and/or the rear sear beyond their limits. This recutting of the sear(s) allows the hammer to fall back (catch) on the double action sear on the front of the hammer. My guess is that either the hammer or the rear sear or both needs replacing. In double action, the DA (front) sear releases the hammer before the rear (single action) sear engages the hammer. By filing/stoning either SA sear too much, the DA sear will catch the hammer as you describe.

"...and the ratchet spud is sheered off ...". I agree. This needs replacing too.

Thank you! It sounds like a "repair" by someone who overestimated his skill set, and I think I know who did it. I'm putting it back up for sale. I think the only hope of putting this back to rights would be to try to find a baffed out, or a badly damaged, or a deactivated "donor:" pistol to try to scavenge the needed replacement parts. What are the odds of that? When i was a working tradesman, I can't tell you often someone tried to do a job or repair on their own before I got called in. Usually it took 2 to 3 times longer to put right than if I'd been given the job in the first place.

 

[rct269]

It might well be I haven't been paying attention along the way, and the answer to my question is old news; but given what I perceive as your focus on the DA model, I have to ask why you have not considered the NM #3 as an alternative?

Without really knowing all the nitty-gritty between the two (and knowing nothing about any of the pesky rules and regulations), it strikes me the NM #3 is a much simpler, more reliable, and all around superior choice.

Ralph Tremaine

 

[Exmilcop]

It might well be I haven't been paying attention along the way, and the answer to my question is old news; but given what I perceive as your focus on the DA model, I have to ask why you have not considered the NM #3 as an alternative?

Without really knowing all the nitty-gritty between the two (and knowing nothing about any of the pesky rules and regulations), it strikes me the NM #3 is a much simpler, more reliable, and all around superior choice.

Ralph Tremaine

Good day Ralph. To make a long story short, the only pistol I can legally carry when I'm in wild country is an antique. With my arthritic thumbs, a single action (which are scarce up here anyway) is OK when time permits but I like the option of more rapid fire, which is of course a double action. Just for chuckles, go to "Old Guns Canada" and look at the American guns section. I think you'll shake your head at the prices good shootable antiques command up here.

 

[iby]

Is it difficult to buy USA?

Thanks for the reference to Old guns of Canada.
Their 2nd Model American looks like a dandy.
(less the $3k scratch)

 

[Exmilcop]

I made a new to me discovery. While working on this old pistol, I removed the star extractor and much to my surprise, I found that the serial number is hidden on the underside of it. I'm assuming most of you guys familiar with these know this but it was a revelation to me.

 

[Exmilcop]

Is it difficult to buy USA?

Thanks for the reference to Old guns of Canada.
Their 2nd Model American looks like a dandy.
(less the $3k scratch)

Did you note the price tag on the German shooting club pistol? Talk about sticker shock!

 

[Frontier44]

Since all of the S&W 1st model DA frames were manufactured prior to 1899 that particular model is classified as an antique here in the United States however I am not familiar with Canadian laws regarding antique weapons.

 

[Exmilcop]

Since all of the S&W 1st model DA frames were manufactured prior to 1899 that particular model is classified as an antique here in the United States however I am not familiar with Canadian laws regarding antique weapons.

To be classed as "antique", a pistol has to have been made before 1898 and the ammunition must no longer be readily commercially available. The RCMP has a list of cartridges deemed to be "antique". Stupidly, a S&W 1st. mod. in .22 is a restricted firearm due to calibre but the 1-1/2 in .32 rf is antique status. I could go on, but you guys get the picture.

 

[Frontier44]

To be classed as "antique", a pistol has to have been made before 1898 and the ammunition must no longer be readily commercially available. The RCMP has a list of cartridges deemed to be "antique". Stupidly, a S&W 1st. mod. in .22 is a restricted firearm due to calibre but the 1-1/2 in .32 rf is antique status. I could go on, but you guys get the picture.

I feel bad for y'all up there in the north woods. I tried reading the Canadian law regarding antique firearms but it gave me such a headache that I had to quit reading. BTW, did you ever get those grips to work on that Frontier model?

 

[Exmilcop]

The grips were for a later model I assume as the hole didn't line up with the indexing pin. I used a fine diamond dust round bit to re-dimension the hole and then used auto body to filler to make it an exact fit.

 

[Frontier44]

The grips were for a later model I assume as the hole didn't line up with the indexing pin. I used a fine diamond dust round bit to re-dimension the hole and then used auto body to filler to make it an exact fit.

That's about the only way to get the aftermarket grips to fit but it works just fine.

I bought a pair of aftermarket grips for my DA Frontier and New Model #3. The panels for the DA are about 1/32" smaller than the frame. Panels for the #3 cover the frame but do not mate with the frame around the medallion. If I remove just enough material from around the medallion they will be too short at the butt. The grips look great and are difficult to distinguish from originals but I was nonetheless disappointed.

Good, original grips have become as scarce as hen's teeth.

 

[deadin]

I like the option of more rapid fire

I have a 44/40 DA and I don't think I could rapidly pull the trigger 6 times in a row.....

Maybe if the adrenalin was high enough....

 

[Exmilcop]

I have a 44/40 DA and I don't think I could rapidly pull the trigger 6 times in a row.....

Maybe if the adrenalin was high enough....

I have one also in very high condition and I concur fully. It's got a heck of a heavy trigger pull in DA. I assumed that because it is in high condition and gently used, it isn't really "broken in" but I could be dead wrong on that. You more experienced gentlemen would know best.

 

[Frontier44]

I have one also in very high condition and I concur fully. It's got a heck of a heavy trigger pull in DA. I assumed that because it is in high condition and gently used, it isn't really "broken in" but I could be dead wrong on that. You more experienced gentlemen would know best.

Very few gunfights that ever took place in the old west were like those depicted in Hollywood movies but given the choice of pulling and firing a revolver or going to jail, the outlaw in those days wouldn't have given a stiff trigger pull a second thought. The jails in those days were a worse fate for the outlaw than dying from a bullet.