Lee 158 lswc, TL 158-358 recipes?

[gehlsurf]

Hi guys, So I bought a lee bullet caster, the TL 158-358, NOT the RF. Thus bullet style has small grooves in it for the Alox, as compare to one large groove for lube. Problem is, I can't seem to find data for it. I'm looking for my 357 or 38 special.

I was thinking of using data for the lyman 158 lswc at the lowest charge, and going from there. Is this a good approach? Or anybody have good data for these?

By the way, just for poops and giggles.... what does TL and RF stand for? Still new to casting, and fairly new to reloading.

Thanks in advance!!

 

[OKFC05]

I have that Tumble Lube mold (TL-158-358) and there is no reason to "start low and work up" with that bullet in a .38 special or .357 in good condition. Just start right in the middle of the data for HP38 or Titegroup or ?many medium powders? and go shoot. No need to reinvent the wheel for this bullet. Just be sure to dribble some Alox on it for lube per Lee instructions.

 

[gehlsurf]

Ok cool..... ah!!!! TL..... Tumble lube, makes sense. How about overall length? Just stick to the OAL that is provided for the Lyman bullets?

I cast for my 44 magnum, but that was a lyman mold, so had data for it, but yes, I Alox, sit 24 hours, then size, then alox again, so twice my bullet's are essentially aloxed. I had some leading in my 44, hence me getting the tumble lube bullet, thinking the micro grooves would help coat more alox onto the barrel.

 

[gehlsurf]

Avtually, I think I answered my own question on OAL, seems 90% or so are 1.58", give or take a .005", which to me isn't gonna build up too much pressure at my velocities.

Before I get yelled at here, I never load to maximum, in fact I only go middle of the road, if I need more, I'll pick up my 10mm or 44 magnum, which I load to middle, too. I just rarely see a need for full throttle where I am. No grizzlies, pigs and deer are small, welcome to FL, haha

 

[LoboGunLeather]

The "TL" stands for "tumble lube", designed to be used with liquid Alox lubricant applied by tumbling in a container.

"RF" generally means "round nose, flat point", somewhat different bullet design profile than what you are playing with.

I've been using Lee molds for over 40 years, mostly with complete satisfaction.

For your TL 158-358 I would recommend tumble lube, either unsized or sized no smaller than 0.358", cast of lead alloy providing a minimum hardness of 12 on the Brinell hardness scale (approximating older lead alloy wheel weights). In .38 Special I would suggest standard small pistol primers, starting load of 4.4 grains Unique, and not to exceed 5.0 grains Unique. In .357 magnum I would suggest standard small pistol primers, starting load of 6.3 grains Unique, not to exceed 7.0 grains Unique.

Since you are new to reloading and bullet casting I will offer some further suggestions:

1. Find a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet manual, read it cover to cover at least 3 or 4 times. Equivalent of a semester or more at barber college.

2. Load up on reloading manuals from every source you can acquire. Study what seems to work, what appears to do what you are trying to accomplish, etc.

3. Never use maximum loads. Period. End of discussion. If you feel the need for more power get yourself a more powerful gun. HAVE FUN SAFELY.

Cast bullets can serve nearly any need in most handgun applications. Decide what you want to accomplish and work toward that goal.

 

[gehlsurf]

Thank you lobogunleather. I have a good amount of manuals, but I always ask some issues like this because the manuals are so stringent on sticking to particular loads and not varying anything, which I rarely do, with exceprion of this.

Totally agree with no max loads!!

I'll try some of the lead I have now, but it's at a 22, or linotype that I made for my 44 magnum. I realive this may be too hard for the little 158 grn bullet. But I do seem to go heavy on the Alox, or it feels like it atleast.

 

[Luke Duke]

6.0 grains of Unique, lightly crimped in the last groove. Have the same mold. No leading and has shot good in every 357 Ive owned. my old S&W 13-2 stacked them.

 

[gehlsurf]

Thus sounds great Lukes Duke, do you happen to know what BHN your bullets are?

 

[cowboy4evr]

Everyone has their own opinion , so here is mine . I have NO problem shooting max loads using cast bullets . There is nothing unsafe about it . I have for yrs shot a 180 gr cast bullet on top of a max charge , current data of W296 in a 357 magnum case . It makes a great hunting round , being heavier it bucks the wind better , gives great penetration . My gun is as tight today as the day I bought it . For yrs I used a K-frame model 19 , 4" barrel . Lately i have switched to a 6" model 28 . Just this last week I went to the range and shot some max loads in my 41 mag and 44 mag using cast . The powder companies list load data for cast , usually a min and max . So they must feel there is nothing wrong with a max prescribed charge according to their data . So decide for yourself

 

[gwpercle]

And just crimp the case in the top groove , the TL designs don't have a dedicated crimp groove so just use the top one for crimping. That way you don't have to be concerned with a specific OAL measurement, do this for both 38 special and 357 mag.
If you would like to seat the bullet out farther, seating in the second groove will not hurt anything, just make sure the bullet nose doesn't extend past the front of the cylinder.
Gary

 

[mikld]

For what it's worth; starting a new to you caliber reloading and jumping in somewhere in the middle of the load data is just plain poor reloading technique. Starting loads are there for a reason, and guns are individuals, so a particular load in one gun will perform differently in another. Some of my most accurate loads were near starting loads...

You prolly won't find data for that particular bullet, but the data from a same weight, same design (RNFP) cast lead bullet can be safely used.

My second mold was the same as yours, the first was a .44 cal, 240 gr. SWC T/L. I had no problems with that design and got a lot of good accurate shooting in my .38 Specials and .357 Magnum. I switched to "dip lubing" with thinned alox and 45-45-10. For some of my 357 loads I pan lubed with C-Red and got good results...

 

[Qc Pistolero]

I always start a new gun at the suggested minimum load.Reason:I've had 2 guns that would show definite pressure signs at a little above middle of the road loadings.One,a model 66 in 4'' that was flattening primers with a load that was only about 65% before max load suggested in many reloading books.The other,a Colt Combat Commander(4 1/4''bbl)that outchronoes all the 5'' govt or Gold Cups by 80FPS with 6.2 Unique while all others are using 6.5 to 6.7 Unique.
But once you know the gun,there's no reason not to go to max for said gun with cast bullets.Doing it safely and in an intelligent way is the secret.
Qc

 

[ArchAngelCD]

No need to look for specific data for the Lee mold. Data for a 158gr LSWC is good for all 158gr LSWC bullets.

One of my two favorite .38 Special loads is a 158gr LSWC over 4.0gr W231/HP-38. That load shoots well in every revolver I have loaded them in.