Lee factory crimp die shaving brass?

[typetwelve]

*EDIT, see post #27 below, I figured out the issue*

Quick data.

-This is concerning 44 magnum with Hi-Tek coated lead projectiles

-Previous to this, I had ONLY reloaded on a Dillon 550 with Dillon dies.

-I bought the Lee carbide pistol set to pull my magnum loaded to my single stage, special loading on the Dillon.

-All the dies work perfectly, but the factory crimp die is, well, weird.

The dillon die is smooth, you press the round in, it comes out crimped. It "feels" like a seating die, not catching, no popping. The Lee die almost has a "catch" to it where the round will hit some serious force-back, you have to press through that with a bit of a "pop", the you get to the actual crimp at the end of the stroke.

Doing some reading, this is normal because the Lee die resized the brass as well? All I know is the process feels odd and there are times when the bullet will come out with a small shaving of brass just sitting there. Loading lead projectiles, the brass is definitely from the case, not the projectile.

Lastly, I use a very light case flare before seating...and I do mean light, so its not that I have a wide case flare sticking out.

Doing some reading, it seems that this may be a bad choice for reloading lead projectiles...thoughts?

 

[M29since14]

I’m not a big fan of the FCD for pistol reloading like I am for hard-kicking rifle calibers. In spite of that, I’ve never heard any of my FCD dies make a popping sound. Are you trimming your cases to the same length? I know a lot of people think that is not important with revolver cartridges. They can do as they like, but I strongly disagree. It is simply not logical to think you can properly crimp cases of substantially varying lengths unless you sort the brass into batches and individually adjust the die for each batch. I just trim the brass. If your brass is all the same length within 0.005” or so (not +/- 0.005”) and you’re not over-crimping by setting your FCD too deep, then I’d say you have a defective die.

 

[typetwelve]

I should stat that by "pop" I don't mean a sound, I mean a feedback from the press. It goes in, hits a wall, I have to press hard, it will "Pop" through the catch, then I can then complete the stroke smoothly.

No, I don't trim my 44 brass...but it never caused me an issue on my Dillon.

 

[M29since14]

Dillon’s 44 dies use a taper crimp that is less susceptible to variation in case length than roll- or FCD-type crimping dies, IMO. That is why they make their dies that way, also IMO.

Trim the cases to a uniform length and try it again. I know everyone hates to trim cases. What I don’t know is why?

 

[MyDads38]

I don't use the FCD on revolver loads, but do on 9mm, 40 & 45 auto. I've never experienced anything like that! :-(

 

[muddocktor]

I used to use a FCD with 44 Mag with my Dillon but replaced it with a Redding profile crimp die. I didn't have the brass shaving thing going on but did have the resizing thing happening with lead projectiles. You could definitely feel it when the upper part of the case that interfaced with the heel of the bullet went through the carbide sizer at the bottom of the FCD and with certain brands of cases the effort going through it was significant. I didn't feel near the amount of effort with jacketed bullets, but then those generally are sized a little smaller than lead. I switched to the Redding profile crimp die and I am very happy with my crimps with it.

 

[PjEagle]

I experienced the same thing with 44 magnum loads a few years ago. You would hit resistance on the way up, add more force to the handle and feel a bump. Then the same thing on the way back down. I don't reload 44 magnums any more, but I always use the Redding Profile Crimp die on my 357 loads and really like it. The only time I experience the brass shaving is when I have my M-die set a little too deep and it flares the case too much. Another good reason to trim the brass to a consistent length.

 

[boatbum101]

If you use lead bullets naked , coated or plated the absolute last thing you want to use is the FCD . Jacketed are OK .

 

[68Dave]

Weird, I’m also running hitek coated lead bullets. I was having trouble with (new to me) used Dillon dies and switched back to my old Lee 44 dies. The Lee FCD has a ring that runs the length of the case. IIRC the directions state that it’s there to assure proper chambering and cycling through the firearm. My Dillon dies would sometimes seat bullets just a little cocked in the case. The finished product would not easily fall into chamber. I could run the same round through the FCD and it would shave the case a little. Do you see any bulge from bullet inside the case?
David

 

[dave1918a2]

I use Redding, RCBS, and Dillon dies on all My straight wall pistol reloading. I roll crimp 475, 44, and 41, and I taper crimp 45acp, 9mm, and 38. No FCD for ME!!

 

[dave1918a2]

I use Redding, Dillon, and RCBS dies. I roll crimp 475, 44, and 41. I taper crimp 45acp, 38, and 9MM. I use Dillon 550's and haven't trimmed one stick of straight walled pistol brass in 50 years. No FCD for ME!!

 

[Carrier]

I use FCD for all handgun calibers and have never had the issue you are. I also have one FCD for each caliber that I load with lead bullets that I knocked the bottom carbide ring out of so there is no chance of swagging bullet. It works very well.

 

[typetwelve]

I've been doing some digging on this one...yeah, the sizing ring + lead bullets seems to be the no go.

I think I'm going to go this route:

I use FCD for all handgun calibers and have never had the issue you are. I also have one FCD for each caliber that I load with lead bullets that I knocked the bottom carbide ring out of so there is no chance of swagging bullet. It works very well.

KO that ring out of it. If I mess up and ruin the die, oh well, it's no good to me as-is. I'll buy a $15 replacement. Before that, might as well try to work with what what I already have.

 

[zeke]

I have had this happen with fairly frequently with revolver loads. It is common with full diameter lead bullets, especially combined with thicker brass and coatings can add another .001 + inch. The LFC can squeeze down lead bullets and also squeezes in the brass. Another result in a hard effort to get the die to disengage after a full up stroke. Worsened by applying a hard crimp.

Most my lead revolver loads now use a Redding profil crimp die. N ot all bullet diameters are the same, or even what they are identified on the box.

 

[typetwelve]

The crimp it is applying on the round is solid, and almost indiscernible from those loaded on my Dillon.

It's that silly resizing I don't want/need. I'm already having some issues with leading when loading 44 magnum rounds, I don't that die making things worse.

 

[glenwolde]

I'm another fan of the Redding Profile Crimp die and a non-fan of the Lee FCD for revolver rounds. I have upon occasion used a FCD for auto-loader rounds but prefer to try and correct whatever problems there are at the source rather than trying to fix them after the fact.

 

[fredj338]

I use FCD for all handgun calibers and have never had the issue you are. I also have one FCD for each caliber that I load with lead bullets that I knocked the bottom carbide ring out of so there is no chance of swagging bullet. It works very well.

Then you are NOT using a LFCD. You could just have gotten another seating/crimp die & used that instead. The LFCD as issued is just a solution to poor die setup & loading technique, IMO.

 

[boatbum101]

The only thing I've found the Lee FCD to be good for is 38 special wadcutter brass . Take the guts out but leave the ring . Use it as modified to size the wadcutter brass . Doesn't work the cases like a FL sizing die does . Since they're a low pressure load & bullet has a ton of bearing surface you don't need a bunch of neck pull . I don't see why this approach wouldn't work for any straight walled case one would shoot wadcutters out of .

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

I own about 12 Lee FCD's, the only one I ever used was because the thin case walls collapsed on 44-40. (Midway had a sale years ago at $4.99 I couldn't pass. So they just sit on the shelf unneeded!)

Ivan

 

[Carrier]

I've been doing some digging on this one...yeah, the sizing ring + lead bullets seems to be the no go.

I think I'm going to go this route:



KO that ring out of it. If I mess up and ruin the die, oh well, it's no good to me as-is. I'll buy a $15 replacement. Before that, might as well try to work with what what I already have.

I had to take a drill bit and drill out a little of the die body that is just above the ring when looking through the top down to the bottom. Then it just pops out with a punch and hammer. Some came out intact some shattered into pieces.
Can’t remember what size of bit I used for the 44 die but it was around 1/2” or little smaller.