Looming California nightmare ...

mc5aw

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I cannot recall a year during the past 20 without reading about California's penal system releasing hundreds of serious violent criminals due to overcrowding.

California's budget deficits and public debt are into epic proportions with no end in sight other than bankruptcy for state and local governments.

It occurs to me that even a relative handful of Californians could easily band together and announce to their state legislature that they simply refuse to comply with any state gun control laws, and if the legislature wants to enforce those laws it will be necessary to arrest, detain, try, convict, and imprison thousands of otherwise law-abiding citizens, all at public expense, and done while explaining why they must release murderers, rapists, arsonists, and other menaces to public safety in order to lock up peaceful taxpaying citizens.

No violence. No force. Just peaceful civil disobedience on a large scale, no plea bargains, no bail posted, jury trials for everyone charged (further choking a court system that is barely functional anyway), appeals of every conviction, with federal and state civil rights lawsuits in every case.

California has always been at the leading edge of the gun control movement. The citizens of California have always tried their best to preserve their rights in responsible and lawful ways, with the response always being greater and greater restrictions with the end game becoming more clearly visible all the time.

I would suggest that if even 1/2 of 1% of California's population banded together and drew this line in the sand the result would be complete collapse of the gun control movement, first in California and then nationally as the force of such an example became fully understood.

The rest of us should be prepared to support our cause with funding for legal defense and litigation expenses as well as publicity on the issues and specific cases.
 
I like your idea and I hope it catches on. In a State like California it's probably the only alternative to continuing to fight a delay action as they push towards their goal of total civilian disarmnament.
 
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I like your idea and I hope it catches on. In a State like California it's probably the only alternative to continuing to fight a delay action as they push towards their goal of total civilian disarmnament.

This is the only plan with any chance of shutting down the anti-gun movement completely. Make it very clear that we know what they want and we will not allow them to have it.

Turn it around so that the "looming California nightmare" would be a nightmare only for those trying to strip peaceful citizens of their constitutionally-guaranteed rights.
 
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+1 on what Lobo states. Those of us in Colorado are experiencing our own trying 2A battles. Every defeat the anti-rights group suffers, even in other states, may help preserve our liberties in our own state.
 
I don't know about California, but a few folks in Washington State tried to get the State Police to do the whole "arrest, detain, try, convict, and imprison" routine. A few people refused to comply with a new law. The people openly disobeyed the law. The State Police arrested nobody! The mass civil disobedience thing resulted in nothing.
 
I don't know about California, but a few folks in Washington State tried to get the State Police to do the whole "arrest, detain, try, convict, and imprison" routine. A few people refused to comply with a new law. The people openly disobeyed the law. The State Police arrested nobody! The mass civil disobedience thing resulted in nothing.

The message will require repeating, over and over in more than one state. "You can pass any foolish and unconstitutional law you wish, but we will not comply. The only way you can achieve what you want is by brute force".
 
Is this that micro stamping being pushed by the company that owns the patents and manufactures the only machine capable of the stamping? As I heard once, if you want to find the leader follow the money or words to that effect.

It's for the children you know.
 
If they want to provide law enforcement with the tools to solve homicides, they should start attacking the roots rather that try to crush one of the perceived symptoms. I will be the first to admit that there are a number of clueless gun owners in CA just as there are in the rest of the nation who provide burglars with a steady supply of handguns for criminal activity. Putting a guy through the ringer who left his gun on the night stand while he was at work is not going to do anything to stop the violence. To everyone who is casual about their gun security, wake up and be responsible regardless of the law or attitude about guns in your area. Anyway, every time I go to Southern CA, I am amazed by the taxes i have to pay, the taxes my in-laws complain about, the general lack of employment or under employment of people who don't see employment as a way of supporting themselves. Then there's the left wing community organization efforts that live off of and fuel the fears or angst of scared sheep or those who believe they deserve an equal share of someone else's pie. I agree that a grass roots effort needs to rise up and deal with the chaos. Otherwise, the chaos is ultimately going to explode from the left when the money runs out and it ain't going to have anything to do with the availability or restrictions on guns. Any grass roots efforts ought to also focus on Glock, SIG, Colt, H&K , etc to stop selling firearms out there because of the ridiculous state laws. I know it would be a bitter pill for some gun owners to take in the interim, but in the long run a more reasonable line of thinking might emerge. Remember when CA DOJ tried to ban main street handguns and Glock and others stepped in and told them they would no longer arm LE because of the risk of litigation when a pistol that didn't meet standards for civilian sale was stolen from a cop...?
 
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The way for CA residents to deal with CA is to leave. The electorate out there has spoken years ago. They choose to mirror East Germany or the USSR as best as they can. Look at the Senators they elect; Feinstein, Boxer. Look at the reps; Maxine Waters, look at the Govs, Brown, Davis, RINO Schwartsenegger (sp?). I don't see it ever getting better out there.
 
One thing to always keep in mind is that the requirement for micro-stamping (as well as "safe storage", background checks, registration, licensing, permits, and all other so-called "common sense" firearms laws) has nothing to do with stopping crime or preventing injuries. The goals of all these things include first making the acquisition or possession of a firearm increasingly more difficult and expensive, then to vilify gun owners as the cause of crime and firearms injuries, thus discouraging the exercise of constitutionally-guaranteed rights that they cannot legislate out of existence.

Tracing a firearm back to the original retail purchaser has seldom been of much investigative value following a criminal act with a firearm. Tracing a firearm back to the original purchaser for the purposes of enforcing registration/transfer laws, safe storage laws, or other administrative measures leading to virtual criminalization of lawful firearms ownership is another matter.

I built my home 16 years ago. It is very solidly built. Steel entry doors in frames mounted to triple-stud jambs, deadbolt locks with strike-plates secured with heavy-duty 3" screws into the jambs. The home was broken into using a sledge hammer to destroy 2 steel doors (back yard to garage, garage into house). Among the items stolen were two firearms.

Were those firearms secured (i.e.: safe storage)? I believe that I took reasonable precautions, but California DOJ would say no (approved safe requirements), so I could be held responsible for subsequent misuse.

The California authorities would probably want to punish me for those firearms not having micro-stamping technology as well.

Owner licensing? Registration? Current permit? Background check? Mental health screening? Training requirements? None of these things would have prevented those who did thousands of dollars in damage to force their way into my locked home from stealing those firearms. But with properly written laws I could easily be made the criminal and held up to the public as the problem, rather than the victim.
 
I look at the intent. I believe the intent is just a different trip around the commode. Invoke convoluted and unrealistic laws/procedures and fees that are unrealistically expensive in an effort to achieve the real goal. No firearms sales. A couple of the major arms producers (S&W, and Ruger) have quit selling in California. I understand the decision by those producers. It isn't worth the cost and aggravation. I expect that, what Lobo said above, has to happen if those in CA wish to be able to practice their 2nd Amendment rights. It has nothing to do with the "being able to ID the owner of the gun". Call it what it is....
 
I don't know about California, but a few folks in Washington State tried to get the State Police to do the whole "arrest, detain, try, convict, and imprison" routine. A few people refused to comply with a new law. The people openly disobeyed the law. The State Police arrested nobody! The mass civil disobedience thing resulted in nothing.

I don't see it accomplishing anything either. The county sheriffs assoc. said they opposed I-594 because they don't have the resources to enforce it. I just got an email today from my state rep saying the same thing.

Hayes, Rep. Dave <[email protected]>
9:56 AM (9 hours ago)
Hello James and thank you for your thoughts regarding the proposals to amend I-594. There were several proposals brought forward that would amend this initiative in one way or another. However, these bills were held in the House Judiciary Committee and not allowed a hearing by the Chair. They will not receive any additional consideration in the current legislative session.

For full disclosure you should know that I signed on in support of a few of these I-594 amendment bills. I did not personally support I-594 on the ballot and continue to oppose many provisions of the initiative as they are not enforceable by our local law enforcement. This initiative was poorly written and contains numerous unintended consequences. As time moves along we will work to correct these provisions and attempt to make the effects of the initiative less burdensome on our citizens.

Again, I appreciate reading your thoughts on this matter. I hope that you continue to contact me when you have questions or concerns regarding legislation or state operations.

Sincerely,

-Dave


As for CA. Well, they need a reality check. Shouldn't be too long now.
 
Seems like the gubmint figgers, it's easier and more profitable to criminalize the law-abiding, rather than try to make the criminals abide by the law.... :(
 
The Manufacturers should just tell Kalifornia that The State would have to build a Facility where the Ammo would be shipped and stamped at the States expense before releasing it to retailers and Police.
Maybe when They see the added cost to Them They would forget this stupid idea.
 
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