M 18 and 22/32 hard ejection

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jkingrph

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I got a M 18 and a 22/32 Kit gun (I frame) last year and when I shot them the empties were so tight I could not eject them. I took both guns to local gunsmith and they supposedly reamed the cylinder chambers. I had a sudden onset of arthritis, and that among other things it was not until last weekend I had them out and the same problem. Carried them with a box of ammo I had used and the gunsmith remembered working on them. but said there was nothing else to do, that it was probably the ammo GECO, which I have used successfullly in several other guns a S&W M 41, Ruger 10/22, Winchestere 52b(repro) and 3 Marlin 39a models.
I brought them home, took cylinders off, got a brass .22 cal bore brush and some breakfree clp, put the brush on a cordless drill and really cleaned the cylinders, then polished the chambers with some Flitz, a super fine polishing compound, Same problem

Any suggestions
 
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I have a nickel 34-1 that had really hard ejection. I ended up polishing the chambers with Mothers Mag Polish, some bore mops, and a cordless drill. I had to do it over the course of an afternoon, but it ejects smooth now. My other three Smith 22lr's very in tightness, but the 34-1 nickel was definitely the worst.
 
Forget the polish IMHO, that's too imprecise a solution for an engineer like me. I've used a Brownells reamer on over a dozen 22's, including S&W m18, m17, m617, and m317. All work great now, easy extraction and no loss in accuracy whatsoever. To my thinking that is the only solution, and if you're reasonably mechanically inclined, it's an easy DIY job, all you need is the reamer and a padded bench vise.

Lou
 
Lou_NC said:
Forget the polish IMHO, that's too imprecise a solution for an engineer like me. I've used a Brownells reamer on over a dozen 22's, including S&W m18, m17, m617, and m317. All work great now, easy extraction and no loss in accuracy whatsoever. To my thinking that is the only solution, and if you're reasonably mechanically inclined, it's an easy DIY job, all you need is the reamer and a padded bench vise.

Lou
Click to expand...
I ordered a Manson finish reamer specific for cylinders. along with some cutting oil. I thought I would follow up with what the gunsmith might have done, with it.
 
bigggbbruce said:
Some 22 brass is soft. I've had problems in revolvers because the brass expands and gets hung up on the cylinder and extractor. My best luck is with Federal.
Click to expand...
I initially was using GECO which I have had luck with in a K 22, Ruger Single Six, a S&W M 41, several Ruger 10-22's, a Ruger 77-22, Winchester 52b, and three Marlin 39a's, I also this afternoon after cleaning and polishing tried some CCI MiniMag, and some Aguila Target with the same results.
 
L

Thread '.22 chamber reaming report'

*** Update ***
I just got a reminder from a fellow Forum member to remind everyone who tackles this type of project to ONLY turn the reamer in a clockwise (cutting) direction. Do NOT turn the reamer counterclockwise at any time, or the cutting edges of the reamer could be damaged. I read this information in previous posts on this subject as well, but neglected to remind folks of this important piece of information. (Thanks Engineer1911!!).


I decided to post this in the revolver section since I've learned so much here from my fellow S&W revolver enthusiasts, and wanted to share...
  • Like
 
BILL said:
L

Thread '.22 chamber reaming report'

*** Update ***
I just got a reminder from a fellow Forum member to remind everyone who tackles this type of project to ONLY turn the reamer in a clockwise (cutting) direction. Do NOT turn the reamer counterclockwise at any time, or the cutting edges of the reamer could be damaged. I read this information in previous posts on this subject as well, but neglected to remind folks of this important piece of information. (Thanks Engineer1911!!).


I decided to post this in the revolver section since I've learned so much here from my fellow S&W revolver enthusiasts, and wanted to share...
  • Like
Click to expand...
I had read that in several places in some researching
 
jkingrph said:
Do I need to remove the extractor star before reaming.
Click to expand...
I did not, and experienced no ill effects. I reamed just until the reamer "kissed" either the cylinder or extractor star, whichever occurred first, and stopped at that point. In most cases the star and cylinder were in the exact same plane.
 
I went out and found a couple of other brands Remington subsonic and some Winchester standard velocity, Subsonic extracted easy, Standard stuck in the M 18 and had a little drag in the kit gun.
 
It's The Ammo !

Find a brand that doesn't stick ...

Try CCI ... Standard Velocity ... should give you no proble,s ...

You have Reamed the chambers , cleaned and polished them ...
nothing left to do ... It's The Ammo !

I shoot CCI Stingers , Mini-Mags and Standard velocity in my revolvers ... all 4 just adore CCI brand and have no problems ejecting the fired cases .

Good Luck ...

Gary
 
jkingrph said:
Gunsmith says they did that, But I ordered a Manson finish reamer to see if a follow up will help.
Click to expand...
No disrespect intended toward your gunsmith, but it's *possible* that his reamer was worn, just as S&W's reamers wear as cylinders are manufactured, eventually resulting in undersize cylinder chambers before they change their tooling. If that was the case, he may not have removed enough material to bring your chambers into SAAMI spec.

Please post the results of your own reaming when you receive your new reamer. I'm curious whether you'll remove much material since your gunsmith already worked on your chambers.

Some of the .22's I've done have taken quite a bit of work to bring into spec (lots of turns, lots of material removed) and some took hardly any time at all (very few turns, very little material removed). The good news is that all my .22 revolvers will now shoot ANY ammo I've run through them with absolutely zero extraction issues. This includes a bunch of S&W's, Rossi, Taurus, and Ruger revolvers.

Best of luck in your endeavor!

Lou
 
Elmer Keith referred to this. My recollection is that was in "Sixguns", the first edition of which was published before I was born. I am about as mechanical as a brick, so I have no idea why S&W cannot get this right, but it is common.
 
Also, when reaming, you want to leave the extractor in, as it is part of the chamber. You do want to clean the space under the extractor and the bottom of the extractor well before starting. Put a couple of fired cases in other chambers to keep the extractor from moving sideways. Ream so that the seat for the rim cleans up on both the cylinder and extractor so they are both in the same plane.
 
Lou_NC said:
No disrespect intended toward your gunsmith, but it's *possible* that his reamer was worn, just as S&W's reamers wear as cylinders are manufactured, eventually resulting in undersize cylinder chambers before they change their tooling. If that was the case, he may not have removed enough material to bring your chambers into SAAMI spec.

Please post the results of your own reaming when you receive your new reamer. I'm curious whether you'll remove much material since your gunsmith already worked on your chambers.

Some of the .22's I've done have taken quite a bit of work to bring into spec (lots of turns, lots of material removed) and some took hardly any time at all (very few turns, very little material removed). The good news is that all my .22 revolvers will now shoot ANY ammo I've run through them with absolutely zero extraction issues. This includes a bunch of S&W's, Rossi, Taurus, and Ruger revolvers.

Best of luck in your endeavor!

Lou
Click to expand...
That was one thing I was thinking. When I get the new reamer we will know.
 
jkingrph said:
I got a M 18 and a 22/32 Kit gun (I frame) last year and when I shot them the empties were so tight I could not eject them …

Any suggestions
Click to expand...
I'm thinking poor job of cleaning the revolver cylinders by the previous owners.

Besides 22s I see it a lot in 357s that had a steady of 38s fired in them.
 
You know I never had a problem in the 1960s to the early 2000s with the 22 revolvers and
shooting with my children and grandchildren. But I am really OCD about cleaning firearms.

So is this a current production issue with the revolvers or with the ammunition today?
 
had my kit gun and M18 reamed for difficult extraction. I took my son and grandson to the range over the 4th of July weekend and my started with the M 18 and it still would not extract and neither would the kit gun. Next week I took them back to the gunsmith and he looked and said they had been reamed, so took them home and tried really cleaning and polishing the chambers. No luck except with some Remington subsonic ammo. I thought, read a lot of posts about the problem and ordered a Masene finish cylinder reamer and some cutting oil. One by one, starting with the M 18 I took cylinder out of gun cleaned it and reamed. I dipped reamer in cutting oil and would give it 2 1/2 to 3 turns remove, clean shavings off by wiping with paper towel, brushing along flutes with a new, clean acid brush, then wiping again, then another dip in oil and enough turns to just kiss the extraction star. I then took it outside and sprayed with some brake cleaner then ran a patch with a little clp through each chamber. I loaded two different makes of ammo that had given problems CCI mini mag and some German Geco labeled optimize for bolt action rifles, a little faster than normal standard velocity and slower than the mini mags, alternating chambers. Crossed my fingers and toes hoping and they all extracted fine.

With the amount of shavings that came out of each chamber I really wonder if my local gunsmith actually reamed them or maybe his reamer was worn small.
Oh I had added one gun an old K 22, that I got back in late 1969. I had never had any problems previously, but when I tried some of this ammo last week it was difficult to extract so went ahead and reamed it.
 
Glad to hear you had a good outcome! I love shooting my S&W .22 revolvers, and they are so much more fun to shoot now that they extract easily.

Lou
 
Protocall_Design said:
Also, when reaming, you want to leave the extractor in, as it is part of the chamber. You do want to clean the space under the extractor and the bottom of the extractor well before starting. Put a couple of fired cases in other chambers to keep the extractor from moving sideways. Ream so that the seat for the rim cleans up on both the cylinder and extractor so they are both in the same plane.
Click to expand...
I went back and did that.
 
People post that it is probably just the ammo, but I found after buying a Manson reamer that no, it was undersized & sometimes also rough chambers. I did 6-7 S&W K & J frames that I owned at the time; only one newer J frame did not need it.
I checked two Colts, an Officers Model Match & an older Trooper, from when they were much like Pythons without the underlug barrel, not a Mark 3 & a Taurus, one made when they looked much like Model 17's, not a newer gun.
All three were fine as is.
 
This is a long standing common problem throughout all eras of production. I have owned multiple S&W 22 revolvers and all but one has exhibited this issue. Some ammo is definitely less affected than others, but it is still a " gun problem"
Regarding 22 ammo, best to avoid any American made ammo except CCI as quality runs from marginal (federal) to abysmal ( Remington and Winchester)
For bargain ammo, I have better luck with Mexican aguila than federal Remington or Winchester. I will only shoot remington or Winchester if I get it for free, yes it is that bad.
My current 34-1 must have been made after a fresh tooling change as it runs everything fine,but my experience suggests this is an exception.
 
As I bought the Model 63 used, & it was the only S&W 22 LR I have owned that did not have extraction issues, my assumption was that it had been repaired by someone after leaving S&W.
You can call me cynical, but I can still remember the first gun I bought "online" Gunbroker or Auction Arms, I don't remember, at least 25 years ago & it was supposed to be as NIB, well it was, & as I brought it to the range & could not get a single piece of ammo of any brand I tried to even fit into the cylinder, it was the worst one I have ever seen, I called S&W, they said to send it back but there was no warranty as it was a 1968 gun. It came back in about 2 weeks, fixed perfectly with no explanation.
 
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