M1917 modifications

[Newworldman]

New to the forum and glad to be here. I have a S&W M1917 revolver with some modifications to the wood grips and backstrap. Other than that it seems to be in original condition with matching part numbers. The grips are not numbered but appear original from what I can tell. There are inspectors marks and proper markings for a military issue revolver. The finish has a few dings and scratches but is in good condition given the age of the revolver. The serial number is 133xxx.

I was told the carvings are a form of "trench art". If true they give a unique character to the piece. I suppose they could have been done at a work bench and not in a battlefield trench, but I have no history on the gun.

What would be the value of this piece? Do the modifications hurt the value significantly?

Thanks for the input.

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[Watchdog]

New to the forum...I was told the carvings are a form of "trench art". If true they give a unique character to the piece. I suppose they could have been done at a work bench and not in a battlefield trench, but I have no history on the gun. Thanks for the input.

First, welcome to the Smith & Wesson Forum.

Second, I'll admit to being clueless as to the value of your revolver (I'll leave that to some of the gurus on this forum), but I will say this: If that is true "trench art", then some doughboy either had a nice set of tools with him, or he was extremely gifted with whatever implements were at hand at the time. I mean, that doesn't look like carving done with a bayonet or a nail pulled out of a timber or something, you know?

The initials look like "LC" or "CL". I wonder who that was?

It does give the gun a character all its own, and I actually like the way it looks.

 

[mc5aw]

Curtis LeMay?

Lieutenant Chekov?

 

[Newworldman]

If you look close you can see where the tool was dragged past the edge if the checkering a bit. Much like you would expect from a knife blade. But it is fairly precise work which means someone took their time.

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[05CarbonDRZ]

I really don't think that its "trench art" whoever did it was pretty skilled with a checkering file.

 

[Nightowl]

Whatever it is I like it! And that gun is in great condition to have spent much time in the trenches in WWl. I don't see any obvious refinish indications, but the sideplate fit will tell a lot.

 

[Watchdog]

If you look close you can see where the tool was dragged past the edge if the checkering a bit. Much like you would expect from a knife blade. But it is fairly precise work which means someone took their time.

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I see what you're talking about, but it certainly doesn't detract from the overall look of the work. And is that a letter "A" at the rear of the trigger guard on the left? Is that an inspector's mark?

 

[Newworldman]

It's an eagle's head inspection mark. S6 was the inspector. I believe the list of inspectors is published. This piece has 3 or 4 different inspection marks.

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[2152hq]

The grips look like they were cut w/a small palm handled 'V' wood carving tool,,commonly called a 'veiner tool' . Slight overcuts and compression tool heel marks are evident on the checkering & initials.
It's a tough little tool for many to use as it's used like a graver,,with one hand.

The file cut backstrap,,at least that's what it appears to be in the pic. Nicely spaced and evenly cut to depth & angle so whoever did it took sometime to lay it out first instead of just wildly going after it.
Why only cut in one direction?,,maybe we assume too much that it was or is 'checkering'. Perhaps the slanted lines represent something else.
Even the wood checkering, as coarse LPI as it is,is still evenly layed out and keeps to it's square aspect.

I'd guess it was performed on the gun later than WW1 (or WW2) and by someone other than a bored GI stuck in a hole in the dirt somewhere. But my guess is worth just that.

It's certainly a tire-kicker point for a potential buyer. But it certainly doesn't detract from it's shootability. It'd bring more if the mods hadn't been done to it though IMO.

The backstrap cuts could be finished up into checkering by doubling up the existing cuts. Then completing the cuts in the opposite direction.
Reblue just the backstrap to finish it up.
The strap itself may also be able to be filed down to elliminate the existing cuts and reblued.
Just a couple of things if you don't care for the existing look.
Grips can always be replaced of course.

 

[Newworldman]

I don't plan to change anything on the gun because I do like it the way it is. I think further changes would detract from it. Any ideas on value as it is would be appreciated.

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[Hondo44]

Welcome to the forum.

That looks like, from the little we can see of it, a very nice 1917.

Recognize "trench art" was very seldom actually done in the trenches.

In both wars, 1917s were classified as "substitute standard" issue and supplied more routinely to non-front line
servicemen such as those below.

Most trench art was done behind the lines by members of quartermaster supply, communications, armorers,
army air corps, Seabees, shipboard sailors that had full machine shops, etc.

So the precision of your art and many others is not surprising. 'Art' actually done in the trenches is numerous
but usually far cruder. We can only speculate.....

 

[gaucho1]

You have a very nicely customized 1917.

The "artwork" is well done and has a precise but handmade
look.

Reminds me of some deco era graphics.

The .45 looks to be in great condition.

A+ score

 

[gunfish]

The modifications would annoy folks that collect for condition. They would please folks that collect for shooting. The value is reduced by about 50%. In my area of Indiana it might go for 500$. It looks to be in great shape otherwise. You have a chance to shoot a fine revolver with out hurting the value.

 

[vonn]

Unique to say the least. Sure makes you wish it could talk. Let us know how it shoots.

 

[zoisrus]

I would want it in my collection as a "Folk Art" gun. Last year, I noticed on GB, a pre-war Outdoorsman with primitive engraving placed all over the frame and cylinder. I wanted just for the personal art. I saw it as a slice of life in a gone-by era. Somebody sniped it while I was busy! Rats!

Chris

 

[zoisrus]

The OD I referred to is in post#17 of 38-44-outdoorsman-updated-files-help

Jealous Chris

 

[Newworldman]

Gunfish that's interesting. I saw 2 colt m1917's at a gun show last weekend in much worse condition, I'm guessing 30% blue finish remaining, with an asking price of $600-650 each. Granted that's the asking price not the selling price. I'm not planning to sell but I am hoping there is some collector value left in this old war gun.

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[jrs70]

On value I paid $500 for one with no finish. I would gladly pay that or a little more for your' s.

 

[Watchdog]

It'd bring more if the mods hadn't been done to it though IMO.

I'd buy it in a heartbeat, just like it is right now.

 

[Watchdog]

Gunfish that's interesting. I saw 2 colt m1917's at a gun show last weekend in much worse condition, I'm guessing 30% blue finish remaining, with an asking price of $600-650 each. Granted that's the asking price not the selling price. I'm not planning to sell but I am hoping there is some collector value left in this old war gun.

I guarantee you that if you put that revolver up for sale in the classifieds on this forum, it'd be sold in a matter of hours, if not sooner. Then you'd be getting posts saying something like, "If the deal with so-and-so falls through, put me next in line for the gun."