M3 trench knife question

[MTC(SS)Ret]

I just read Retired W4's post about the M3 knife he acquired and it prompted me to write this post.
The posted photo is my Dad's M3 from WW2. He was a SGT and served 1942-1944 but not in a combat unit. I got the knife and some other of his things when he passed in 1965. I kept the knife in a box just as you see it until 4 years ago when I passed it down to my nephew (who would have been his only grandson). My nephew served in Alaska twice and did a tour in Afghanistan before attending OCS and being commissioned a 2LT in the Chemical Corp.
This is the only photo of the knife I have. You can see the blade is in rough shape having been ground down excessively by someone, but you can make out CASE as the maker. The scabbard is in pretty good shape and I believe the leather thigh string is original and never used.
My question for you experts is if this knife has any value to collectors? I'm sure my nephew will never sell it, just curious how nice of a gift I gave him

 

[RCL-09]

As a family heirloom... Priceless

As a collector from outside the family.. due to condition, not much.

 

[30-30remchester]

Being an avid knife collector for 50 years with tubs full of vintage military knives, I have some knowledge of the subject. Most of us collectors want and own pristine examples. However, there are us serious history buffs that like battle worn and scared items. This knife has character in spades. The greatest thing about this knife has that few inanimate objects retain is actual history of use and ownership. Great knife. And one last note, this knife is stolen from the US government. Unlike most other knives the military declared surplus and sold off. Mark 3"s never were. Everyone in a private collection has been smuggled home.

 

[MTC(SS)Ret]

Being an avid knife collector for 50 years with tubs full of vintage military knives, I have some knowledge of the subject. Most of us collectors want and own pristine examples. However, there are us serious history buffs that like battle worn and scared items. This knife has character in spades. The greatest thing about this knife has that few inanimate objects retain is actual history of use and ownership. Great knife. And one last note, this knife is stolen from the US government. Unlike most other knives the military declared surplus and sold off. Mark 3"s never were. Everyone in a private collection has been smuggled home.

When my Dad passed I was only 10 years old so I never found out from him details about his WW2 service. He served in the Army Air Corp, I believe as a mechanic of some sort, and was stationed in Idaho and the Azores. One photo I have dated 1943 he has Corporal stripes over a "T" and two service stripes on his left forearm.
I just read an article about the M3 knife and as you wrote it should have been returned and kept in stock as a substitute for the M4 as needed.

 

[Retired W4]

As with issued items like these, if an individual looses it (not combat loss) or ruins it, that person could receive a "Statement of Charges" and the cost of said item would be deducted from pay.

That is a great M3 with great history.

 

[30-30remchester]

When my Dad passed I was only 10 years old so I never found out from him details about his WW2 service. He served in the Army Air Corp, I believe as a mechanic of some sort, and was stationed in Idaho and the Azores. One photo I have dated 1943 he has Corporal stripes over a "T" and two service stripes on his left forearm.
I just read an article about the M3 knife and as you wrote it should have been returned and kept in stock as a substitute for the M4 as needed.

My father-in-law was in the Azores with the Forgotten Fiftheenth. He spent his time flying the ball turret of a B-17 named "Tough T####e".

 

[ISCS Yoda]

Corporal stripes over a "T"

I recall that the Air Corps, and the Air Force later on, had "technical" NCOs. You don't see the T anymore but the Air Force and the Space Force both call E6s "Technical Sergeants".

 

[Greyman50]

During the invasion of Panama knew an officer that found a US footlocker full of M-3’s. He intended to have it shipped home via “ secure” means but action prevented it.
Never heard about “ all M-3’s being stolen”, sources please…

 

[raisedin99]

I recall that the Air Corps, and the Air Force later on, had "technical" NCOs. You don't see the T anymore but the Air Force and the Space Force both call E6s "Technical Sergeants".

My dad had the same rank in WW2, Corporal stripes over a "T", I believe he told me he was a Tech 5 in the Signal Corps.

terry

 

[Kevin J.]

Technician fifth grade - Wikipedia

Old school version of the current army Specialist ranks.

 

[MTC(SS)Ret]

Yep, did some more looking and found he was a Tech 5. I can't make out in his photo what his lapel pins are to narrow down his speciality. Also found out the short horizontal stripes on his sleeve are overseas service bars and his arm patch was European Theater of Operations Advance Base (photo), the lightning bolts are breaking the chain of Nazi oppression.

 

[30-30remchester]

During the invasion of Panama knew an officer that found a US footlocker full of M-3’s. He intended to have it shipped home via “ secure” means but action prevented it.
Never heard about “ all M-3’s being stolen”, sources please…

I have no idea where or when I read about this. I did quite a bit of research on the Mark 3's several decades ago. Visited with many top collectors about variants and rarities of the model. IIRC several experts related the story personally to me and recall at least one article in a national knife magazine telling the same story. The publication was most likely the monthly knife rag with the title of 'Knife world"

 

[Greyman50]

Military Knife Guru on East Coast is in Pa., has a world known shop with countless knives on display. I may call him regarding this.

 

[JH1951]

Military Knife Guru on East Coast is in Pa., has a world known shop with countless knives on display. I may call him regarding this.

Talking about Larry?
If so he should be attending the Forks of the Delaware show in Allentown next month....

 

[PALADIN85020]

As a collector piece, its value is way reduced by its condition and the later plastic scabbard, which was primarily used for similar bayonets for the M1 carbine, the M1 rifle, the M14 rifle and the M16 series.

The original scabbard was leather and had a metal retangular piece in lower part of the sheath.

The early leather scabbards have a lot of collector value, as they were quite subject to destruction from the elements over the years and are somewhat rare in good condition. The later plastic scabbards are a dime a dozen.

When the M1 carbine was modified to accept a bayonet, the plastic scabbard became standard and the earlier trench knives and the leather scabbards were no longer issued as standard.

Here is a pic of the trench knife and the original scabbard; these were used during the D-Day parachute drops and were usually tied to the leg of the paratrooper. Many WWII pictures exist of this.

Hope this helps. Your M3 trench knife and the later scabbard will much better serve you as treasured family heirlooms.

John

 

[BB57]

As with issued items like these, if an individual looses it (not combat loss) or ruins it, that person could receive a "Statement of Charges" and the cost of said item would be deducted from pay.

That is a great M3 with great history.

I agree, not every item that comes home with a soldier or Marine is “stolen”.

It could have been reported lost and then paid for.

Plus, strange stuff happens. Supply sergeants by nature are good at acquiring things. Sometimes they acquire to many things that are not officially on the books and need to get rid of them before an inventory is done. They often make a deal with another supply sergeant swapping the excess items for items they might be short on.

In my case the day I showed up to turn in all my field gear, the supply sergeant was in a panic to get rid of excess equipment and told me to just keep it all and checked his box on my paperwork, leaving me with a duffel bag with my steel pot, flak jacket, complete web gear, compass and M7 bayonet.

 

[walnutred]

I agree, not every item that comes home with a soldier or Marine is “stolen”.

It could have been reported lost and then paid for.

Plus, strange stuff happens. Supply sergeants by nature are good at acquiring things. Sometimes they acquire to many things that are not officially on the books and need to get rid of them before an inventory is done. They often make a deal with another supply sergeant swapping the excess items for items they might be short on.

In my case the day I showed up to turn in all my field gear, the supply sergeant was in a panic to get rid of excess equipment and told me to just keep it all and checked his box on my paperwork, leaving me with a duffel bag with my steel pot, flak jacket, complete web gear, compass and M7 bayonet.

We had a Huey go down in Honduras due to an engine malfunction, controlled crash and the crew got out before the Huey burned. By the time everything that was reported as being lost in that crash was tallied, that chopper had over 5,000 lbs of cargo onboard when she went down.

 

[Drm50]

I sold one with plastic sheath in good condition for $150 a few years ago.
I wonder if the lost in combat records from RVn are still hot sheets for 1911s?

 

[squidsix]

We had a Huey go down in Honduras due to an engine malfunction, controlled crash and the crew got out before the Huey burned. By the time everything that was that was reported as being lost in that crash was tallied that chopper had over 5,000 lbs of cargo onboard when she went down.

I cannot say for sure, but I would guess that several hundred thousand tons of material was attributed lost to a couple of sunk Zodiacs back in 2007-2010.
Not that I would know.