Merwin & Hulbert and a Sharps

[Pirateer2007]

Hey guys.

I know these aren't S&Ws, but I thought I'd ask for help none-the-less.

So I picked up three pistols in trade today. I will give a brief description and I'll try to ad a photo.

1. Merwin & Hulbert .38. Nickel plated. The entire pistol functions perfectly. It has the skull crusher, 3.5" barrel and the folding hammer.

2. Sharps Pepperbox .22. Overall the little pistol is in amazing shape!

3. Lastly in this little trio is an Iver Johnson, .38cal break top. Looks and functions a lot like my Model 3 American.

Any help with info and values on these would be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks guys,
-Adam

 

[deadin]

Don't even try to tell me you were after the Iver Johnson and the other two were "throw-ins"

(Nice trade! I especially covet the M&H.)

What did you have to give up?

 

[Pirateer2007]

Don't even try to tell me you were after the Iver Johnson and the other two were "throw-ins"

(Nice trade! I especially covet the M&H.)

What did you have to give up?

Well... The gentleman inherited all three from his dad. The M&H was used at the end of the 1800s by his great grandfather to commit suicide, so he wanted nothing to do with it. It came with an original holster and the police tag that listed that it was used in a suicide and the date. Pretty macabre, but still, a piece of history. He threw in the other two and wanted $950 for all 3. I wound up trading a Savage Model 10 Predator in .22-250 and $400.

 

[mrcvs]

I would say that $900 would be about right for retail value on these. Iver Johnson worth around $100, Sharps is worth maybe $250 or $300, and the Merwin and Hulbert on a good day, although worn and in .38 cal, would be around $400.

 

[deadin]

I've been lusting after a M&H and the only $400 ones I can find are basically what I would call parts guns. (Missing parts, broken grips, well battered).

 

[Pirateer2007]

That's kind of a weird thing about the M&H... The grips are worn smooth, but the rest of the gun is in amazing shape for it's age. The bore is one of the best I've ever seen on an 1880's black powder pistol. The rifling is still strong as well. The retention spring on the folding hammer is still strong and crisp. Nothing on this pistol is loose or missing. The timing is dead on and the double action, while really heavy, is still really smooth. I have a couple Colt 1877s and this pistol blows their D/A out of the water IMO. I'm a machinist and looking at the workings of this thing, I cannot fathom how they were able to make such a tight pistol. I wasn't sure I'd like it, but once I held it and looked it over, I think I'm in love.

 

[DWalt]

The last time I even saw a M&H was 2007. I'd be willing to pay more than $100 for the IJ .38.

 

[mrcvs]

About 5 yrs ago, I bought a Merwin & Hulbert like this one, and I paid $145 for it. I bought an Iver Johnson similar to the one posted late last year or earlier this year and it ran me $116. I saw a Sharps like the one posted go for $250 at auction earlier this year. With buyer's premium and sales taxes, you are looking at around $300. Now, I am thrifty by nature, so I realize such prices might not be had by all, but I still believe $800 to $900 retail is about right for all three firearms. Maybe $1,000 for all on a really good day.

 

[Pirateer2007]

About 5 yrs ago, I bought a Merwin & Hulbert like this one, and I paid $145 for it. I bought an Iver Johnson similar to the one posted late last year or earlier this year and it ran me $116. I saw a Sharps like the one posted go for $250 at auction earlier this year. With buyer's premium and sales taxes, you are looking at around $300. Now, I am thrifty by nature, so I realize such prices might not be had by all, but I still believe $800 to $900 retail is about right for all three firearms. Maybe $1,000 for all on a really good day.

Do you still have your M&H and are you looking to sell it?

On a side note, I took out my S&W Model 3 American, Colt 1873 from 1882, and this M&H and took a picture of them. I'll post the picture when I get the chance. I love history!

 

[deadin]

About 5 yrs ago, I bought a Merwin & Hulbert like this one, and I paid $145 for it.

I'm with Pirateer. If your M&H is comparable to his I will happily give you $400 for it.
If it's like the $400 ones I've been seeing around here, no thanks.

Added: I probably would pay your $250 for the Sharps even though they are not of much interest to me.
I wouldn't pay even $100 for the Iver Johnson.

 

[mrcvs]

I do still have the Merwin & Hulbert. It is comparable to the one you have. The grips and overall condition is better than yours, except, however, the folding hammer is damaged. I thought $145 at the time was a fair price.

 

[deadin]

I thought $145 at the time was a fair price.

It may have been a good price at the time. However you stated that you thought $400 was currently a fair price. I'm willing to pay $400 for a comparable piece today, although the messed up hammer spur should knock it down a bit. (Messed up folding hammer spurs are quite common on the M&H's.)

 

[Pirateer2007]

So, does anyone else have any insight to the value of these pistols? As far as I can tell, the M&H has a couple desire able features in the skull crusher grip and folding hammer. Anything else about it seem special?

Thanks guys!!

 

[deadin]

What does the other side of the M&H look like? I can't tell from your pictures how much of the finish is original. (BTW, "amazing shape for its age" is not a valid condition description. I'm in pretty good condition for my age, and believe me, I ain't pretty.) If you have access to any of the collector catalogs there is usually a description of grading standards near the front of the book. If you can't find one for antique firearms, I can probably dredge one up and post it for you. It's going to be hard to give you a decent guess as to value without more detail of condition.
Also post a picture of the holster that came with it. Sometimes these can be quite pricey.

Also, I think the grips on the Sharps may be replacements, but I'm not very familiar with that model. Hopefully someone will pipe in with some knowledge of these little guns....

In my opinion the Iver Johnson is pretty much of a throw in, but there is a growing group of collectors for this class of pistol. I think the main attraction is they are still something old that is affordable. They seem to go for somewhere in the $50 to $125 range depending on condition and model.

 

[Pirateer2007]

Here's another poor quality photo, lol. I'll try to get some better pictures in better lighting tomorrow.

 

[Pirateer2007]

 

[Pirateer2007]

 

[Cyrano]

Pirateer: The Iver Johnson is the post-1909 version with positive cyoinder stops and improved metallurgy. They stayed in production until WW II. They are intended for use with smokeless power. They came in four calibers: 22 LR, 7 shot; 32 S&W, 5 shot; 32 S&W Long, 6 shot on the 38 frame; and 38 S&W 5 shot. Unless absolutely necessary, do not take it apart beyond removing the cylinder for cleaning, or possibly taking the barrel off the frame; they are a BEAR to reassemble.