Model 19 strengthening

D

DB404

Member
Joined
May 15, 2012
Messages
75
Reaction score
84
Location
Big Sky Country
I’m pretty sure everyone here knows how the Special Forces guys wore out M19s by shooting lots and lots of 125 grain jacketed hollow point ammo, experiencing flame cutting of the top strap and loosening of the gun. The standard yarn has it that S&W solved the Model 19 “problem” by developing the 586 and 686. What I would like to know is if any other strengthening efforts went into the Model 19, similar to those done with the Model 29, especially the -4 and -5 iterations. I’m not really lusting after a heavier .357, as I won’t be running thousands of hot loaded 125 grain bullets through it, but I would enjoy a Model 19 4” or 6”which would not develop premature end shake or quickly lose the ability to tightly and precisely lock up for the shot (timing problems). The most recently made Model 19 I have owned was a 19-3, so my knowledge about the dashes since then is very limited. Thanks for your answers in advance!
All the best, Dave
 
Last edited:
Register to hide this ad
The 19-6 went to a radiused stud package which was said to prolong the life of a revolver significantly. Honestly I am not sure if they ever utilized a hardened yoke like the N frame but I wouldn't be surprised if they did.
 
For durability, the current production (19-9) is probably the best thanks to a significant redesign. The front lock is no longer on the ejector rod, it has been moved to the yoke. The barrel has been redesigned, going to a rifled tube, exterior shroud and tension nut, similar to the Dan Wesson system. Gone is the thin spot at the bottom of the barrel forcing cone.
 
The first model 19 production run (Combat Magnum through 19-8) are fairly similar in structural detail. By reputation the weak spot was the flat/thinner bottom of the barrel forcing cone; there was not an "Endurance Package" modification as done on N frames but regular unlocking with heavy loads (as in heavily loaded model 29s) was not an issue as far as I have read or seen.

The current model 19-9 has the multi-piece barrel assembly and a good quality reputation, so if you are looking for one without the potential issue of older guns both it and the current model 66 may be good choices for you.
 
If you’re not going to run a lot of 357 ammo through it why worry about it? Find a nice gun, shoot it with 38’s or lighter 357’s and enjoy it.

I don’t think there is any definite answer to why forcing cones crack. It seems some do...some don’t. The only one I’ve seen with my own eyes was on a Model 15, 38 Special of all things. A 15-8 IIRC so it was a fairly recent gun. I wish I’d taken a picture of it.

On the other hand my 19-9 is one of my favorite guns.
 
Anyone know if this would apply to my 4” 1973 Model 66?
 
DB404, I don't own a 19 but I do have a 66 no-dash, one of the early ones. I only shoot 38 special 158 grain through it. (not taking any chances on cracking the barrel extension, forcing cone) How I fixed my need for full house 357 Mag is I got a 586 no dash. And I'm currently looking for a 686.
 
DB404 said:
I’m not really lusting after a heavier .357, as I won’t be running thousands of hot loaded 125 grain bullets through it, but I would enjoy a Model 19 4” or 6”which would not develop premature end shake or quickly lose the ability to tightly and precisely lock up for the shot (timing problems).
All the best, Dave
Click to expand...

Hi Dave,

Based on your plans for it's use, you have no worries about your 19-3.

Too add one bit of information to the great information already shared above. S&W has used a shield in some models above the bar/cyl gap to avoid flame cutting. You could do that but likely not needed, again based on your conservative shooting plans for your 19-3.

I've shot my 19-1 as you propose and it's as tight as it was 50 years ago when I got it.
 
DB404 said:
I’m pretty sure everyone here knows how the Special Forces guys wore out M19s by shooting lots and lots of 125 grain jacketed hollow point ammo, experiencing flame cutting of the top strap and loosening of the gun. The standard yarn has it that S&W solved the Model 19 “problem” by developing the 586 and 686....
Click to expand...
Nope, never heard that one. But there's probably a story for every gun S&W's ever made, so nothing would surprise me.
 
About 15 years ago I went to one of the S&W armorer schools and asked a lot of questions. I was told that the later dash models of 19 & 66 seemed to hold up better to hot loads, and the 66 seemed to hold up better than the 19, but my source did not know what changes, if any, were involved. Maybe the later dash versions just hadn't been shot as much.

As mentioned above, the new "Classic" (complete misnomer) 19 and 66 should solve the hot loads problems completely.
But not everything is perfect. I bought a new 19-9 Classic last Fall. The rear sight is bad (windage adjustments tilt the blade but don't move it), the DA and SA trigger pulls are heavier than old-but-stock K frames, and it spits horribly with Magnum loads. So bad I wouldn't dare shoot it without glasses. Trying to fix the trigger pull, I went to remove the sideplate, the screws must have been tightened with an impact wrench; I broke two screwdrivers just trying to remove them.

It's going back to S&W when I have time.
 
It wasn't made by some big machine called " Smith & Wesson " ! It was built by a guy that obviously doesn't take pride in his work or the company that he works for . Let's not judge the whole company by a bad experience . Regards Paul
 
Gearhead Jim,

Yes, the side plate screws on the
Model 19-9 are very tight. I use
a Chapman torque "wrench" and
they come loose fairly easily. The
same tight screws are common to
many of the older models as well.

As for spitting, I've had spitters
on Smiths going back to the
1980s. Try a different load
first.

As to the wobbly sight blade,
I suspect that's easily corrected.

Heavy DA pull? They are around
12 pounds but quite smooth. A
change of rebound spring if you
must is easily accomplished. That
"heavy" spring ensures fast
reset and avoidance of lockup
by shortstroking.

For all your complaints, contact
S&W. The gun has a guarantee.

By the way, I have two (yes two)
of the 19-9s and have encountered
no problems.
 
Thanks everyone for the info. It is helpful. Part of the reason I sought feedback has to do with my first Model 19, which was a four inch gun, made at the end of the first year production. It came with the original box, papers, and tools and had been a motorcycle officer's gun for use when escorting funeral processions in a large western city, and had rarely been fired. When I acquired it, it locked up tighter than any of my other Smiths, on each chamber of the cylinder. After less than 200 rounds of handloads (several grains below maximum in two manuals, to be easy on it) it only locked that tightly on 4 of 6, so I put it away, then several years later sold it to a collector. I really liked that revolver; it had a super trigger, both SA and DA. It was just about a perfect woods loafing revolver for the lower 48.
 
I've been target shooting my 19 for well...a long time and to be honest, I don't know why anybody would want to put a lot of magnum ammo through any K frame revolver even if there were no chance of damage. If you're thinking of self defense, the modern 38+P has come a long way and is far more manageable, at least for me than magnums. I had the chance to shoot a friends 586 6" barrel. All that weight and that heavy full under lug barrel tamed those magnums nicely.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

A
357 magum self defense rounds for model 27-2 . 5 inch barrel
2
Replies
36
Views
2K
agent00
A
max503
Lightweight bullets in Model 19's
2
Replies
28
Views
2K
Greyman50
Greyman50
M
Vintage S&W model 19 locks up
2
Replies
30
Views
2K
mj2008
M
JHW
  • Locked
Sold Smith Wesson Model 19-3, 15-2, 66-4, and 586-1
Replies
4
Views
1K
wheelyfun66
wheelyfun66
M
Let's talk 1970s K frame magnums
2
Replies
29
Views
1K
Tabby Lynn
T

Latest posts

Back
Top