Model 60 (.38 spc) history?

[Brian894x4]

I'm trying to learn a little more about early model 60s (specificly the 1980s and 1990s versions, since I recently purchased a 60-7 (1990)

I'm curious what all the changes from about 60-1 to about 60-8 or whenever they switched from .38 only to .357.

One thing that confuses me is that I was reading in another thread about 60-2 being sold in 1989. My gun is a 60-7 which was apparently only issued in 1990.

Was there a whole bunch of changes that occured in the final years of the 1980s that warrented 5 major model number changes?

Any info would be appreciated. I've looked in various books and on different websites and while I can find model change info for nearly every other make, for some reason the info seems to be elusive on the 60.

 

[bamabiker]

Here's what the book says;
60(1965); Introduction of the first SS revolver.
1968; Delete the diamond grips
1969; Begin R serial numbers.
60-1 (1972); 3" sq. butt heavy barrel version; limited production of 171 in a serial range of R56962-R57239.
1982; Delet pinned barrel.
1986; Special run of model60 with adj. rear sight.
60-2 (1987); Per Robert Vivas, expert onNYCPD firearms, all aproximately 2500 of this variation were originally DAO with 2" barrels possibly for the NYCPD. It is believed that all were returned to S&W and resold, probably after conversion to traditional SA/DA operation, and at least some rebarreled to 3".
60-3 (1988); New yoke retention system.
60-4 (1990); Limited production of target model with full underlug and new yoke retention system.
60-5 (1990); DA only for NYCPD and new yoke retention system.
60-6 (1989); LadySmith version introduced. Introduction at LDY0045 (possibly starting at LDY0001).
60-7 (1990); New sight width increase to 1/8", heat treated package.
60-8 (1990); New sight width for NYCPD, heat treated package.
1992; Discontinue 3" barrel; continue with 2" only on LS.
1994; Rosewood laminate grips on LadySmith.
1994; Change extractor; introduce Uncle Mike's synthetic grips.
60-9 (1996); Change to J magnum frame and cylinder for all fixed sight 2" frames in 357 Mag; begin shipments in blue plastic case.
I believe that's the most I've evr typed at one time. Please don't ask for the changes all the way to 60-18.

 

[pred]

Wow they got all the way to 60-18,
What are all those changes

 

[bamabiker]

Get the book!!!!!!!

 

[snubbiefan]

This is a well-dated thread, but it appears to have some really good information. I am not going to ask a thing about ANY dash number changes or improvements....I want to go the other direction.

I just picked-up a ND with a case-hardened forged hammer and trigger. I have no "R" in the serial number, which is 4785XX. It has a pinned-barrel. The grips have likely been replaced. I do have the old yoke retention system.

Judging form what bama typed above (NO...I am not going to ask for anymore typing)...I must have an original 1965 model in hand. Does that seem to be in agreement with anybody reading the above posted information?

I know this likely belongs in the 61 to 80 subject mater section, but this is where I found it.

 

[murphydog]

This one is likely a 1965 or '66 shipped gun. It should have come with J frame diamond Magnas, which look a little different than earlier ones in my observations.

 

[snubbiefan]

Thanks murphy. This is my first Model 60.....so I am not up-to-speed. I knew the grips have been changed as the originals should have been the diamondwood and this gun has much newer stocks on it. Is there anything puzzling about the fact the hammer and trigger are case-hardened and not stainless. Maybe all the early guns came that way....I don't know.

 

[oliveview]

You know, right away I see an inaccuracy with that list, above. Or, at least an omission of some important information.

Regarding the OP's 60-7: "60-7 (1990); New sight width increase to 1/8", heat treated package."

Well, the actual S&W booklet which came with both my 60 and 60-7 indicates that the primary change for the dash-seven, is the ability to handle +P rounds. The barrel is noticeably thicker, and may be the whole reason why the sights were widened, ever so slightly.

So, I'm not discounting the rest of that information, but you have to cross-reference when it comes to reliable information on older guns.

 

[murphydog]

Thanks murphy. This is my first Model 60.....so I am not up-to-speed. I knew the grips have been changed as the originals should have been the diamondwood and this gun has much newer stocks on it. Is there anything puzzling about the fact the hammer and trigger are case-hardened and not stainless. Maybe all the early guns came that way....I don't know.

The earliest model 60s had a polished stainless hammer/trigger, then briefly case-hardened stainless parts as yours. The vast majority have the "flash chromed" parts.

 

[murphydog]

You know, right away I see an inaccuracy with that list, above. Or, at least an omission of some important information.

Regarding the OP's 60-7: "60-7 (1990); New sight width increase to 1/8", heat treated package."

Well, the actual S&W booklet which came with both my 60 and 60-7 indicates that the primary change for the dash-seven, is the ability to handle +P rounds. The barrel is noticeably thicker, and may be the whole reason why the sights were widened, ever so slightly.

So, I'm not discounting the rest of that information, but you have to cross-reference when it comes to reliable information on older guns.

The information quoted comes from the Standard Catalog of S & W 3rd edition, which is generally pretty reliable. The reason the 60-7 was +P rated was the upgraded heat treatment. Don't know if the barrel change was related to this, or the sight width change.

 

[oliveview]

The information quoted comes from the Standard Catalog of S & W 3rd edition, which is generally pretty reliable. The reason the 60-7 was +P rated was the upgraded heat treatment. Don't know if the barrel change was related to this, or the sight width change.

Indeed. This is why it's good to cross-reference the information, like at a fine place like this forum.
Even S&W is inconsistent with what information they publish, and where.

 

[snubbiefan]

Gets us back to the often asked question...."can any S&W 38-special safely handle +P". Most everybody agrees that they can. I have a brochure on the Model 60 dated 1978 that includes a disclaimer pertaining to +P+ ammunition. The warning specifically indicates that +P+ should not be used in S&W J and K frames manufactured "prior to 1958". This would lead one to believe that even +P+ can be fired in any Smith 38-special manufactured after 1958.

Most of us agree the +P can very safely be fired in any "modern era" Smith and that the introduction of the +P rating is just another method to market a new gun for which new ammo can be purchased. If you believe what I have in my hands that indicates even +P+ can be used in post 1958 38-specials....why designate a gun as such with a new dash-number? Marketing hype...I guess.